sosonic

What is the deal with the mazmart water pump at low rpms?

I know it is clearly better at above 6K , but what about 2K to 5K range?

zoom44

hahaha another scoop for zoom

E-Mop 3 injectors

RotoRocket

iTrader: (1)

Okay, this is probably a stupid question, but isn't that a fairly radical change from the current setup?

I though the new OMP design change was going to more...incremental.

zoom44

well this thread is already discussing the 3 injectors and the change in pump- this is just the first visual we have to share

MazdaManiac

iTrader: (3)

They went to an electrical MOP and three injectors.
Whether that is "radical" depends on your point of view.
It is certainly an admission of some serious engineering deficit in the current (pre-08) Renesis oiling scheme.

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

There are people out there who still believes in :

"Mazda tested their engines more than any of us ! So they know best ! There is no defect in the design ! Stock is perfect !"

Im premixing so Im pretty sure Im ok for now ... After scanning thru all the papers released so far from Mazda, Hmm, at least they know what really went wrong, lets just hope that the 09 will have longer life.

surgery

Okay Renesis, I will premix you. I will 'upgrade' your water pump. I will feed you a 10-30 synthetic. I will drive out your carbon with my lead foot.

Will you live?

Surgery -- 2007 RX8 (2100 miles)

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

Renesis : Well, I dont know, cuz even a perfectly healthy person might all of the sudden get cancer. *fingers cross*

CnnmnSchnpps

iTrader: (1)

A rough translation of the Japanese text accompanying the diagram:

So..
- better oil injection specifically to address apex seal lubrication (there you go, RG )
- a knock sensor that works??
- a variable redline????? (edit - nevermind, all this does is display the current redline on the tach based on coolant temp)

olddragger

iTrader: (3)

what is stopping us from machining in a 3nd injector? Could not that be done. The mop doesnt care--it is volumn oriented. A Y fitting on 2 of the current supply hoses ,machine in a 3nd stock injector and then you have it.
olddragger

CnnmnSchnpps

iTrader: (1)

A couple grand in labor cost?

Mazurfer

Let's get Ray(BHR) to look into this.................yeah..............that's it!

LionZoo

I wonder what an engine that has received premix from the start would look like. Mine has had premix since about 2,000 miles on the clock, though I stopped for a few tanks in the middle due to the alarm about fuel pumps clogging. It's probably spent about 27,000 miles of it's 32,000 mile life on premix.

Easy_E1

iTrader: (2)

Would not Premixing be a cheaper way to do the same thing? Lube everything.
Mazda use to just run the OMP into the carb float bowl. Basic Premix.

Nubo

Any consensus about the Phosphorus? This is the only part that worries me, as it's a known catalyst poison. Whether 900 ppm diluted to say, 4 or 5 ppm in gasoline, has any meaningful impact, I don't know. Anyone?

Other than that, the recent Mazda TSB/MSP seem to imply that a constant trickle of Naptha and spirits might not be such a bad idea to keep carbon deposits at bay. Seafoam is basically Naptha plus isopropyl alcohol.

Perhaps the most important question -- will my exhaust smell like Wint-O-Green?

musclecarconvrt

Is that the breakdown for MMO? If so, I used it ever few fill ups and swapped out a quart ever two or thee oil changes in my old Explorer. No it wasn't a rotary, but it had 268k on the clock and running smooth with the stock cat when I traded it in. Should have kept it for the beans they gave me in trade.

I'm using good old Idemitsu for the RX8 though

Oh yeah, Marvel Mystery oil will make your car smell minty fresh

rotarygod

They actually just ran the hose into the runners in the carb under the throttleplate so it trickled in but it's all the same effect in the end.

Jax_RX8

Marvel claims that they have had no issues with cats getting tainted from MMO use - gets ask all the time.

I think most of the phosphorous gets burned up in the combustion leaving very little ever reaching the cats - and this is not more than is already in normal SL motor oil anyways.

I agree MMO might be the perfect premix for the rotary - it needs the carbon cleaning.

And, yes it does make the exhaust smell like peppermint (I smelled it)

Seafoam is similar to MMO, but without the lubricity and barrier additives - many use MMO for this exact same procedure. It is very good for piston/ring soaks.

StealthTL

iTrader: (1)

JaxMan -

The subject is pre-mix, not snake oil.

MMO is not a good lubricant, and it has no place in any engine made after 1945.

Phosphorus is a catalyst poison - spin it anyway you like, it still kills cats.

Phosphorus cannot be "burned up" before reaching the cat - Physics 101 - the only way out is thru the cat, and it's not paper, it's an element, it is phosphorus forever.....

Your previous assertions that the dichloro-benzene components are "friction reducers" is just fantasy - they are just there to stop it getting slimy and moldy while sitting on the shelf. They have no uses as any kind of lubricant, no matter how much you want them to.......

MMO is a pitiful and antiquated form of WD-40 and I personally wouldn't use it in/on my lawnmower.

S

Jax_RX8

I see your a fan of MMO

Actually, everything I have stated is from many sources including BITOG, MMO's own forum Q&A, and Oil analysis. Take it for what it is is worth - as much data as I have been able to find, my actual results when using, and some opinion.

There are many that have used MMO and seen very good results, just like "musclecarconvrt" above, and at least no dead cats (with 268k on the odo) - so it may not be the next wonder drug, but it is also not the root of all evil either.

Jax_RX8

Some reality......
(sorry, I could not help myself)

Just so that you know, dichlorobenzene is a "chlorinated hydrocarbon", one of several kinds of chlorinated hydrocarbons

In MMO, dichlorobenzene performs 3 functions:

- Extreme Pressure (EP) protection and friction reduction (lubricity). It is most commonly used for metal "cutting" oils.

- It aids the combustion process for more complete combustion

- When burned, it forms Hydrochloric Acid (this is the somewhat controversial part), but this by-product is in such small amounts that it is actually used up in preventing carbon from solidifying during the combustion process and in cleaning existing carbon out of your engine, so it does no harm to your engine metals.


On the EP/lubricity point, from a published study:

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/m...1/ai_n21422243

And for the lazy ones -

"Chlorinated hydrocarbons are commonly added to a base lubricating fluid when it is used for extreme-pressure (EP) lubrication of ferrous metals. It is demonstrated here that the interfacial temperature in the EP regime varies linearly with the applied load in a pin and v-block testing apparatus and that temperatures in excess of 11000 K can be attained. Thermally decomposing chlorinated hydrocarbon vapors on iron heated to these temperatures (1) shows that a film consisting of an iron chloride which incorporates small carbon particles (~50Angstrom) is formed. In this paper, tribological measurements at extreme pressures and the corresponding analyses of the rubbing surfaces and wear particles also indicate that this film, formed from the chlorinated lubricant reacting with these surfaces, is the critical antiseizure material at less severe EP loads and interfacial temperatures less than ~1000 K"

musclecarconvrt

StealthTL,
We all know how you feel about MMO. I don't know why you hate MMO so much, but your just dead wrong. Is it the best thing since sliced bread? No. Are their better alternatives for premixing in a rotary? Yes. I use Idemitsu. But I have run several cars and trucks over 100k miles and at least two well over 200k miles using Marvel Mystery oil as a cleaner and top cylinder lubricant and have never had to replace a catalitic converter. My engines have run smoother, lasted longer, and been cleaner on tear down with moderate use of MMO. It will help keep things cleaner. I use Idemitsu because our rotaries need more lub than a piston engine's top cylinder, but it isn't going to hurt a thing for those who want to use it.

Have a nice day

rotarygod

Actually for that Mazda just had a little Japanese man sit under the hood holding a nitrous bottle in his lap with the hose pointed at the air filter. He was the regulator.

ezrider55

As I said when I first joined this forum-- I did not think anything could make driving an RX-8 more fun, but this forum does.
I have been premixing since 1000 miles. I now have 38k miles. Passed compression test by mazda with flying colors.
New info. since I had guages installed.
In the summer with Houston temp. above 90 deg.
Water temp. at engine exit can get to 220-240 deg.
Oil temp can get to 240-260 deg.
My RX-8 still runs strong.

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

Im pretty surprise that your engine is still alive with those kind of water temp.

My car
outside temp, the hottest - 103
Water temp - 102 C
Oil Temp - 102 C