pieter3d

iTrader: (7)

Hey guys. I have a couple questions about the kit. How is tuning done? Does the EFIDude flash new maps? If so how can I be sure they are good for my car specifically??

Finally, the kit now comes with the upgraded & safer bypass valve right? Thanks

Phil's 8

iTrader: (3)

These may be questions better answered by Pettit....The kit has changed very little since I got mine but changes have been made. My Pettit uses a Cobb AP for tuning as re-tunes and upgrades are easier to acquire and my tuner is closer than Florida. I think several changes have been made to the choice of bypass over the years. Only Pettit can tell you what is used now.

Since you live so close, if you want to see an install of one of the original Pettit units, come to the "What Happens in Vegas" meet in June. You will be joined by several other Phoenix and Arizona peeps.

olddragger

iTrader: (3)

Yes --EFI dude can do the flashing needed. The oridginal bypass valve was safe, it just did not contain the boost as good as the upgraded one.
To communicate with Pettit--it is best to call them. Tell them OD sent ya and they will give you $1.00 off!
Hope you join the ranks--its a good kit.
OD

Phil's 8

iTrader: (3)

Always nice to welcome a new member to this group....

olddragger

iTrader: (3)

Hey all --go to the Race threads---i posted a track vid from this past w/e.
OD

turtlesdove3

Sometimes it's coz of being kept on the idle for long but if you've figured it out and can't fix it i think its better to take it for repair.

Phil's 8

iTrader: (3)

Is that you again Gil? How many names do you have?

Rocketman1976

Does anyone use the Mazsport ignition with their Pettit SC?

I know its got some issues with the Dwell needing to be adjusted.

If running an SC or turbo is it easier and safer if I just get the BHR and throw the Mazsport in the trash?

Phil's 8

iTrader: (3)

I use the BHR coils.................never a problem. You can always sell the others to some unsuspecting boob - we have a lot of them out there

Charles R. Hill

iTrader: (7)

Or, I am sure one of the Vegas kids would buy them simply because they despise BHR.

california style

why do you card count in Vegas or something? 8)

olddragger

iTrader: (3)

any upgraded ignition coil system + FI (after a certain g/sec airflow) will require a dwell time adjustment? Thats how i understand it. The mazsport kit can be ran--- i think the ignitor box at times may be a problem. I ran that system for a short time (about maybe a year?) it was OK. Replacement parts are available.
The yukon/ls/msd upgrade is an option, but the dwell will need work to get max benefits out of them. Some Pettit guys (not me) are running the msd (designed for the ls1/6 engine) without any dwell adjustment and are not having any problems. They are expensive.
I choose to stay with oem coils +hks twin power. So far so good.
OD

Charles R. Hill

iTrader: (7)

1) Depends on which coils are used.
2) The Microtech Ignitor Module is well-known to have issues when used with the RX-8.
3) True, but simply setting the dwell to the best value isn't exactly "work".
4) Give it time, they will.
5) Electrically useless, based on design.

ZOOM-I-DO

OD I have an EFI dude but I have never been able to modify any maps. How? What am I missing? Is there a manual out there. I bought it used in Dec and have just been learning the data that is collected.

Thanks for any feedback

Zoom-I-Do

olddragger

iTrader: (3)

Hey Ray, glad you came in. can you clarify some things for me then?
1- what upgraded ignition coils do not require a dwell time adjustment after threshold g/secs have been reached?
2- adjusting dwell is not a lot of work--granted. But 1st you have to have something that will let you do it!--like a Cobb?
3-- I think Juan has been running those msd coils for 2 years now?

4- You know I have looked and looked for hard evidence as to the effectivness of the Twin Power and i cant find any. No oscilliscope readings etc. There are hundreds of testomonials with dyno results etc but so many varables could be present I cant count that. Do you have anything showing why it will not work? I would love to see it--honestly.

With the small pulley on the Pettit kit it is fine to run the oem coils--just narrow the sparkplug gap a little and you are good to go.

The EFI dude will not let the individual change anything---but you can send your maps to Pettit (after arranging ) and they can custom tune per flash sent to your efi dude.

Charles R. Hill

iTrader: (7)

Being "glad" I posted and simply tolerating my presence are two different things.

1) You said "all upgraded coil systems" required dwell adjustments. My point was that you have not tried all the available coils or systems so that matter is, as of yet, inconclusive.

2) Yes, one needs some sort of reflash device if they wish to adjust their coil dwell time settings. A real sweat-breaker there.

3) One set of MSD coils being used by one person, who likely does not drive his car daily, does not trump the many sets seen firsthand to have fail by the guys at UMS Tuning in Phoenix. Look them up sometime by flipping open just about any issue of Modified Magazine as they are one of the few shops who actually deserve the coverage they get.

4) I will leave this part for you to try and do your own homework. Suffice it to say that the manner in which the HKS Twin Power DLI unit you are probably using has very little to no effect on the performance of your factory coils based on how it is electrically designed. Better than that, when using our ignition system even HKS will tell you that their unit is completely unnecessary. Go look at a schematic of that unit. Now you see why BHR does not care to engage in the "RWHP gains!" hype so prevalent in this industry.

olddragger

iTrader: (3)

thanks for the feedback Ray--hope you are doing well.
I have tried ignition coils:
1- Mazsport
2- yukon's
3- ls2's
4- oem with hks twin power dl II (not the I)
all on the factory dwell.
To tell the truth i havent seen any performance difference in any of them, BUT that is probably due to my self imposed 7.5K redline and still running the oem dwell time.
Longetivity is another subject

Now you know I am tech challanged and fooling around with a cobb WOULD cause me to break out in a profuse brain sweat!

I have heard of trouble with the msd coils on other cars---dont know the full story on them. Too expensive for me anyway.
I have wondered for a while now how the HKS unit gets around the oem design to produce a stronger/ longer spark. It was cheap when i bought it --so i thought wth? No problems with it.
OD

Charles R. Hill

iTrader: (7)

Funny you mention doing well, as I actually have a cold right now. I was using my own snot as assembly lube in Jeff's engine last night. GROSS!

I hope you are well, also.

Let's see;
1) Mazsport systems had issues with irregular ignition timing and failure-prone ignitor modules.

2) The "Yukon" coils, as was discussed a year ago at the height of BHR's controversies, do perform best with additional dwell time applied to them.

3) The "LS-2" coils do not seem to need the additional dwell time but they only emit about 1/3 the current the Yukons are capable of.

4) The HKS Twin Power is essentially a "ground lift" box that completely interrupts the grounding circuit. IIRC, that is supposed to cause all the coil output to the tower but the OEM coils do not need help in that regard.

5) MSD (as well as other "racing" ignition components) are not really designed for the long service life we expect and need in our street/daily-driven vehicles and it is completely reasonable to change them far more often than the coils we use in our BHR system because expected racing maintenence regimens are far different than OEM regimens (except maybe with the Mazda coils ). Further, the MSD coils are intended to emit "multiple sparks" (hence the name Multiple Spark Discharge) until an alleged 3,000 RPMs, where they then revert to single spark output. Not good nor necessary for an engine that has leading and trailing ignition timing events. On top of that, Jeff discovered some funky latency/reaction characteristics when he tried them a couple years ago. All this in totality was why we decided on an OEM-supplier coil and why I made the executive decision to use the "Yukon" coil.

There may be something out there that will accomplish Almighty Output with only the 3.2 mS of dwell our PCM applies at max, and Jeff and I have some ideas on that, but as of now we have yet to find it.

As for why you may not have seen improvements; were you using the ground on the inner fenderwell, near the brake master cylinder? We have found that to be the best spot for grounding the BHR system. Were you using the proper coil tower terminals on the plug wires and were they properly terminated at the plug wires? Both are common errors. As an example; a local (and highly respected) shop-owner/engine builder recently had us come by his place to custom-build sets of wires for both his car and a customer's car. In both cases he clearly built his own wires and was not familiar with the proper way to terminate spark plug wires, and he is a professional. Since he was unaware, I am sure many others are, as well.

Huey52

iTrader: (2)

^ Hey Ray, do you have a photo of that BHR Ignition ground location? I used the bracket attached to the firewall near the master cyclinder (sanding off the paint) and it seems fine. [btw: I've neatened it up since this photo]

Get well!

Charles R. Hill

iTrader: (7)

From where you are standing when that picture was tooken (LOL), look to your right. Farther....... farther...... a little more, and, there you see an OEM ground point to the right of the master brake cylinder on the inner fenderwell (it is somewhat hiding behind the factory harness as it snakes to the front of the car). There are two ground wires from the factory held in place by a 10mm bolt and we just direct people to add the BHR ground wire to that spot.

That spot in your photo ain't the swellest.

Huey52

iTrader: (2)

^ K, thanks. I strive to be swell, as do you well.

Charles R. Hill

iTrader: (7)

For some reason, there seem to be a lot of people using that spot as the ground for a number of different circuits lately. The problem is that all that metal is coated to prevent/resist oxidation and, as such, isn't a great conductor. We figured what better ground spot to use than the one Mazda uses themselves?

Huey52

iTrader: (2)

^ I did say I sanded the paint [to bare metal], but concur a factory ground would be best.

I would have done that originally had my installation instructions so cited ..... but I digress.

Rocketman1976

I do seem to have an irregular idle at times where it sounds like it is missing. Also one of the coils cracked right at the base of the neck where the wire boot ends, luckily that happened when Mazsport was still around, so I replaced the one coil for $80.

I keep being worried about a disastrous failure since I have read little remarks here and there about them having problems.

Charles R. Hill

iTrader: (7)

In our "Gamma-testing" process since the initial release of the BHR Ignition System we have learned a few things about the varying levels of installation experience and understandings of automotive electronics on part of the end-installer, whether "professional" or novice, and our most recent updates to the installation instructions now reflect the importance of using the ground location I described.