graphicguy

And regardless of the RX8 issue, the vast majority of us still looked at the 350Z/G35C and chose the RX8. The vast majority of us believe that Mazda went well out on the limb and offered a very strong deal for a car that essentially still performs the same (give or take a few 10ths) as skyline's beloved nissans, with much better attributes acroos the board and costs $3K less (when popularly equipped) than the G35/350Z. That's why we're here.

Still can't figure out why you're here skyline.

canzoomer

I doubt that HE does, but I do.
First off, my RX-8 is a sweet car. It hauls *** on the highway, handles high speeds like it was going 55, and is sooo smooth.
One thing I do not notice anyone mentioning is the suspension.

I can feel every bit of the road surface, from a tactile point of view, yet big bumps get eaten up by that marvelous suspension with nary a blink. And if you haul hard on a corner, under full power, and go over a bad bump it does not skip, get unstable, or any other bad behaviour. I LOVE it!

But:
My last car, Nissan Sentra Spec V was modified with exhaust, intake and a few other tweaks.
It would easily beat my 8 in a drag race.
It dyno'ed at 190hp, and 194 foot-lbs.

Of course it felt unstable as hell, had bad wheel hope ( front wheel drive with a lot of torque tends to do that), and the chassis was never designed for that torque level and you could feel it twist.

Still, the missing 20HP is sorely missed.
In 4th, I would not want to get in a passing war with a lot of other cars.

NashuaCLS

My 2 cents:

If it is 250 HP, 247 HP or now the 238 HP, It shoud dyno like a 240 HP S2000. Does it? Stock S2000 will be at close to 195-205 WHP.

If the RX-8 dyno at 200+ WHP, then it is making the numders right. I heard the JDM does so. So, maybe after market tuning can get you the lost WHP!

Nashua.

93RedX7

This is all ridiculous. Either you like it or you don't. For the guys that don't have an RX-8 (myself included) don't talk trash until you've tried one out. A few hp wouldn't matter too much to me. My last car before my FD was a 2000 Focus ZX3. Honestly, if I had the extra cash, I'd get a 238hp RX-8. It's one of the few cars that's almost as good looking as mine.:D

dgtlbullet

After going back and fourth, this power issue made me decide that the Z was the one. It was my first love before the RX came out. This power issue may not be big with many and I know that RX8 is a superb car, but these kind of false advertisements are unacceptable my a company who has goofed in the past. My 2 cents.

rotarygod

Mazda probably knows this will happen and some people will go after the Z instead. It is a nice car and you will probably enjoy it very much. Stillen has a ton of goodies too! Mazda should be kicking themselves over the error but what's done is done. Their priority should be at the very least giving a very detailed explanation of where the power is or focusing on how to get it back. Maybe they could post what the average driveline loss is so we know what to expect. Every transmission is different and this 6 speed is brand new. Paul Yaw said that the engine is capable of rated horsepower so I think it is only a matter of time before we see power return. I'm still a fan of the car never the less and would still love to own the newest rotary cars that Mazda produces regardless of if they have 100 or 1000 hp. (1000 sure would be nice!)

ChrisW

Are you serously suggesting that Mazda spent years and millions of dollars developing this car and didn't bother to find out what the relevant US emissions regulations were that it would have to meet?

Obviously, they weren't able to meet US emissions regulations while producing anything like the power they had promissed, and they will have known about this problem well before the cars arrived in the US.

As for the mysterious delay in the ports and suspicions that the ECU's were re-flashed, that's easy to explain. Why would they program the ECU's back in Japan, when they could carry on working on the ECU code, trying to squeeze a few more hp out of the engine, while the cars were on the ship, and then reprogram them when they arrive in port. This gives the engineers a few weeks more development time.

They will have known that the cars didn't meet the specified horsepower the moment they released them from port, but they kept quiet about this for several weeks. That's deception.

N1-R

I'm with dgtlbullet, I like both the Z and the 8 and I was gonna get the 8 because it was a better bang for the buck car. I luv the interior/exterior styling of the 8 more than the Z. Sure 12hp might not be alot but i can't justify paying for a $39K (cdn funds) for a 250hp car that is now 238hp. And according to some of they dynoes posted, the car doesn't even seem to be rated at 238, more like around 210hp range as someone has said. The dealers should at least lower the MSRP but that's not gonna happen as I talked to my dealer already. Looks like I'll be taking my deposit back for the 8

If my dealer would lower the MSRP several thousand dollars then I could think about the 8 again....but looks like I'll be going for the Z pretty soon.

Seks

I wonder how many people have done/will be doing the same thing as you?

borg

Just received my letter from Mazda and called their number. Mazda stated that on the buyback it is for what you payed for the car plus sales tax not what it would cost me (or others like me) to pay off the loan to my credit union and get back my down payment which would be a loss of $ 4000 dollars roughly if i took their offer. I told him that in my opinion that was not an offer to anybody unless they bought the car themselves and paid it off.

brothervoodoo

Hi Borg,
I guess I'm confused in terms of what you are trying to say or stated above. Mazda is going to reimburse the price paid for the car, right? So, it shouldn't matter how much you financed and how much came out of your pocket to do so. In my example, I took a loan for 20K and paid the difference in cash. Your statement above seems to indicate I will be reimbursed on the cash portion but not my loan, which sounds ridiculous. So can you please reword your statement in a way I can understand. I must be missing something here. Thanks!

Jsuzuki

I think "Borg" is saying that his loan doesn't have an early pay off provision, so he would have to pay the entire interest owed for what would have been the life of the loan.

BlueAdept

But, he's going to buy one car or another I assume, so does it really make so much difference?... OK perhaps it does if he wants to wait for a new RX7 or somthing???

Edge

After putting 2000+ miles on the vehicle (long road trip last week) I have to say that the power is indeed missing. I've driven a variety of vehicles, and we're just not getting it done. In terms of straight line acceleration it's not even close. It picks up speed much more like my '66 Mustang (289V8 AT, 144hp) than my Eagle Talon (turbo, MT, 210hp, FWD). I spent enough time getting on and off highways (not in 6th or 5th thank you) to build a solid opinion that I was happier hitting the highway in my Miata than I am in my 8 right now.

The numbers do matter. For everybody claiming they don't because the performance is still the same, you're full of it. Performance is NUMBERS. I don't care if you compare 0-60, lateral G, 1/4 mile, hp, torque, whatever. They're quantified values and many of us comparison shop using those numbers. I enjoy this car. I want it fixed because right now it's not developing enough power, acceleration, or whatever to beat my Eagle Talon (210 hp) onto the highway in front of a big rig.

If I did not read this forum, or had not received THE LETTER, I would have been complaining to my service department (1st oil change) next week about a lack of power, especially at high RPM, with the intent of getting the car fixed. What's worse is that now not only is the car broken with no hope of repair, I'm the laughing stock of several performance communities for trusting Mazda or actually believing that Mazda could pull off a 4 seat / 4 door sports car with not too many compromises.

I love the car, but a 250 hp car should make me MORE confident facing an on-ramp with a fast apporaching rig than any previous vehicle I've owned. I want that margin of comfort/safety, not $500/free service and not a refund.

PS totally dif thought: last i checked this was the USofA. we don't supress people for voicing their opinions, regardless of whether we like them or not.

canzoomer

Except on these forums.

Got the JT map today emailed to me.
Found a Mazda mechanic wwho claims he can reflash it.

Next week I hope I will be a happier camper.

bureau13

If this has already been addressed in this thread, I apologize...its grown way too long for me to go back and check it!

Anyway...don't the Japanese have higher-octane fuel readily available over there? If the JDM map is tuned for different fuel formulations, will it be such a great idea to use it in the US?

jds

canzoomer

True, but the Japanese manual also says one should use 91 Octane fuel, and the cars that were tested earlier in the USA were J-spec, so I doubt it would matter much.
In tests run on a GTech with regular octane fuel losses were typically around 2-3hp, so I doubt it will have much significant effect.
Worst case scenario is we would have to use Xylene additive for maximum power..

Anyway, it is all moot until tried, so hopefully next week we will know more.
I have to arrange dyno time this morning, so I can get a pre-mod bse benchmark for my car..

RotorGeek

I was reading the RX8 book last night and i came across page 50 that states the HP in the euro car, and guess what. It was 238hp sound familar. I do think we got the euro ecu.

ectomort

A little bird named "Occam" agrees. The first allocation cars were held up in port for something (i.e. to ensure near-simultaneous release in North America, and the 2 or 3 in-port modifications.) If Mazda was truly blind-sided by California emissions requirements, and if generating a ECU table is not a trivial task, then it seems reasonable to assume Mazda would flash the ECU with data it had tested and that it believed would definitely meet the requirements.

Euro-spec ECU data fits that bill perfectly.

autoxr

Page 50 of the RX8 book also lists the highway mileage as 30.2 mpg. I'm getting about 20.

1stRX8

While the book is informative and gorgeous - it's produced by the marketing dept. not engineering.

Love the book, I read it like I read stuff on the internet, carefully.

JeRKy 8 Owner

Sorry everybody I dont wanna read through 34 pages in this post but I have a question that may have been answered already.

I bought my car 2 days after the 26th deadline and didnt know about this cash back and service thing since the sales guys didnt tell me about the horsepower thing.

If I call Mazda Customer Service and tell them that no one told me about this since I just found out on here, do you think I will still be able to get the incentives? Maybe I should threaten legal action if they try to reject me.

ectomort

What did the sticker on the side of the car say when you bought it? If it lists 238HP I doubt you have grounds to threaten Mazda with a lawsuit.

Pete

I have the magazine Blender, and It has an ad with the RX8 promoting 247HP.

Squidward

wtf, some people need to get a clue.