munche187

Well I'm at the shop right now. It was minor. I built up so much pressure during that run that it caused one of the plugs to back out. He will be installing a breather valve so it never happens again.

I will be leaving it though my Ntercooler won't be in until tomorrow. Instead of making the long trip again I will leave it here and pick it up on Friday.

myriadshalaks

iTrader: (1)

if you ask me, most of the people who are mad at MM are just butt hurt because their SC baby, the one they were so excited about, is sub optimal, and no one likes to have their poor decisions discussed in the public eye.

To be fair, MM clearly just wants to prevent others from going through the same thing. HE wants the kit right for people who want it. But why should he praise a kit that's got issues? Furthermore, why should he bite his tongue?

mysql101

It only seems one sided to them because they have picked a side to be on.

I own the greddy turbo kit and I'll be the first to say it has short comings. I don't take it personally, I know what it is, and what it can do.

I've seen people attack MM from time to time, ragging on him because he owns a GReddy kit. Ironic since he doesn't. He has however, worked on the greddy kit, and helped come up with fixes that has made it usable for the rest of us. He's doing the same now with the Pettit SC kit, but the fan boys are trying to push him away.



Personally, I don't care if you guys shoot yourselves in the foot, but there's something within all of us that make us want to watch the train wreck.

Jedi54

iTrader: (7)

subscribing in hopes this thread stays civil and we can get some useful information out of it...

Brettus

iTrader: (2)

MM does have a heap to offer us all & is an asset to the forum - he has posed some good questions that should be answered . However - that could be done without putting down Pettit & the people who have the SC .

Phil's 8

iTrader: (3)

Let me know how it turns out for you - I made a couple of high speed runs and it has not happened to me but better to be prepared.

Bastage

iTrader: (1)

Agreed. ^

I speak for myself when I say this (but I'm sure the other customers agree); it doesn't bother me personally if someone points out a flaw in a product I purchased. People do it all the time when they talk about my car. I don't care! It's just a product that I have purchased with full awareness that there would be some issues involved. I was a member on this forum for over a year before I bought my car.

The fanboy statements are completely baseless and laughable (no proof, no merit). No one feels upset that the mighty MM thinks ill or has pointed out flaws in the product. Not a single comment was ever in response to his questions, or in being defensive about the product, but rather they were in response to his attitude. What started all of this drama was not MM's questioning of the product, it was his attitude and lack of tact. He made it personal.

Plain and simple, he was the first one to get personal. If you can ask questions and make observations without getting personal, then people will thank you, sincerely. Otherwise... well... I don't want to get personal.

So now that all the drama is over let's move on to more interesting things. Like how someone has figured out how to get cold air into this S/C with a ram-air setup (can't wait to see the pics).

munche187

As soon as I get it I will test and let you know the out come.Call Cam the fix will be simple. I do recommend you get it done. It takes a whole 15 seconds to do. I don't want to get into details as I do not want my words quoted.

Mazurfer

Quoted....who..........us?
Jeez, how far did the plug back itself out? You think it was loose to begin with?

vIce^gRip

Please, everyone! Lets let the finger pointing end now at this Post. Let us not drag up any past comments of negativity towards members. Jeff (MazdaManiac) has his right to his voicings and opinions! He has openly stated he was done with this issue and though honorable, I truly believe it to be a loss in the more productive issues of this subject/discussion. Let us not continue to actively call bullshit on a member. Let us constructively discuss this S/C.
Wanna call me a FanBoy! Fine! I hate Dallas CowGirl "FANS" cause they're Fake as hell. <---- You see the point? Most everyone is a Fan of something... and others dislike it. Not at all relevant though. Why get your panties scrunched because you were called a fan of something? LOL.

ScudRunner

[Useless Post]That's why I wear thongs. They're always all up in your business, so you operate normally regardless of your level of irritation with other people.[/Useless Post]

shinka213

Hey Bastage...
ive been talkin to a co 8 owner about the AEM CAI and how it might possibly work better than the Typhoon...
I know Moon has some other types of ideas on some cryogenic stuff...

I might give Cam and/or Moon a call for further discussion...

Bastage

iTrader: (1)

Totally agree with you, but my panties weren't scrunched. They were steamed, pressed, and worn on my head.

Btw, the more I see that picture in your sig, the more I'm becoming a fanboy of your car.

vIce^gRip

LOL... I did not mean to insinuate or insult anyone with that comment! It was just a metaphor for all of us to just not respond or to refrain from entertaining the negatives...

I compiled near 20 questions for Cam. I will relay them back when they come in.

csuttman

I am lucky enough to live locally to pettit racing and went down there today. From my perspective... They have a very professional shop and some incredible RX-7's and RX-8's there. Cam and his son were very helpful in answering my questions and both dropped everything to talk to me, even though they were obvioulsy busy. I really got a good feeling from them and got the feeling that they would be very helpful with the install. They really seem to know their stuff.

Cam took me for a ride in one of his RX-8's with the SC on it. I was very impressed. It wasn't crazy power, but it was enough to put a smile on my face. I've always felt that the only thing the 8 is lacking is enough power. The SC makes the package complete. It also looks so nice and neat under the hood that it's hard to believe it's not factory installed. I can't wait to get one! I just hope they get the firmware to handle the fuel mgt so I don't have to spend the extra money on the extra fuel management system.

Just to throw in my 2 cents worth... I'm partial to SC's due to the lack of inherent lag with turbos kicking in. I haven't driven an 8 with a turbo, so I can't say first hand if it even has a lag... I'm just going off other turbos I've driven.

Good work guys!

Mazurfer

That's all most people want.
Now I don't know how you will be able to tell us what the answers are since the site is AFU'd for at least two days now!
PM's don't work at all, but notifications do! Threads get updated with new response(like this one), but don't show up as being added to and no "new" post are showing up. Looks like we should all pick some useless thread and all write in that one thread to communicate! Those of us in need of a fix at least!

munche187

I was at Pettit yesterday did some tunning after I got my engine oil and S/C oil changed. The new maps are great car is running smoother and harder. It was street tuned so no I do not have Dyno numbers.

marsredr100

iTrader: (1)

Just got done installing a Pettit Racing Stage II Super Charger on my RX8.

Did all the work myself and was able to keep my Racing Beat Ram Air Intake. According to Cam the owner of Pettit Racing, the Stage II Super Charger is capable of produce 265hp @ 8500 rpm to the rear wheels. I rode on Cam's RX8 and saw the dyno chart myself. The 265hp came out of his RX8 with a gutted factory catalytic converter and stock exhaust. My RX8 has no catalytic converter and I do have a Racing Beat Exhaust. Also, I was able to modify a Ford Contour air filter intake, therefore in conjunction with the Racing Beat Ram Air intake, I'm able to get fresh air instead of hot engine bay air. (see enclosed pictures). I was also able to keep my Racing Beat ECU Race Flash which is running piggy back with an Interceptor X engine management system. I think that I should be close to 275hp but I'll get some dyno runs before the end of the year or after I upgrade to a Stage III system which is still under development. Car is running great and very happy with the product.

Done so far

-Magnecor 8.5mm Wires
-Racing Beat Exhaust System
-Racing Beat Stainless Steel Brake Line Kit
-Racing Beat Stainless Steel Clutch Line
-Racing Beat Catalytic Converter Replacement Pipe
-Racing Beat REVi Ram Air Duct
-Racing Beat Complete Set Coil Springs
-Racing Beat Aluminum Flywheel
-Exedy Stage 1 clutch
-Racing Beat AC & Oil Cooler Screens Package Set
-Change tire size to 255/40-18 (same OEM diameter but a bit wider)
-Racing Beat Front Sway Bar
-Racing Beat Rear Say Bar
-Racing Beat Power Control Module (PCM) Race Flash Service
-Racing Beat Front Sway Bar End Links
-Pettit Racing Stage II Super Charger

By end of Summer

-Agency Power Rear Sway Bar End Links
-Axial Flow Short Shifter

By Fall

-Racing Beat Type II Nose Kit

Stay tune...Zoom-Zoom

swoope

iTrader: (5)

good job..

would like to look at you job on the intake sometime.. pm me.


beers

Phil's 8

iTrader: (3)

Nice setup - You will enjoy it

Spinning Sushi

iTrader: (21)

So you modified the Contour filter? I don't see the filter in the pictures... can you point out where it's located?

Brettus

iTrader: (2)

So - bit of a Racing Beat fan then ?
Like what you did with the filter . i'm thinking of doing something similar with the filter Petit supplies in stainless .

marsredr100

iTrader: (1)

I received a couple of questions regarding my intake modification.

Basically I took an old Ford Contour Air Filter Intake holder that I kept from my 98 Contour SVT (all Contour V-6 are the same) and made some modifications to it. I cut pieces of the air canister base and front of the air filter holder (sorry but I did not take pictures after the modification). The picture you see below of the Contour air filter holder is before the modifications. The picture you see below of the front view of the air filter intake is when I was making sure that everything fit right (not much room to play with). The pieces of white foam you see surrounding the opening are gone (were used for markup) and so the Fram air filter. I replaced the Fram air filter with a K&N air filter. There are many ways you can fabricate your own fresh air intake since is up the builders imagination and skills. I do not own an auto repair shop or a machine shop; therefore I did the best I could with what I got out of my car garage. Just like I did with my 1972 13B Bridge Port R100 after I purchased the car from a junkyard and on the road 14 months later.

Hope this help others, marsredr100.

vIce^gRip

As promised here are some answers to questions that have been posed. I did my best to consolidate and have Cam answer what he felt was appropriate. I also had merge the answer with the question and some answers actually answer more than one question at the same time.If I have misrepresented any question or answer... Please let me know and I will re-ask it more appropriately.
Once again... these are direct answers for CAM, the owner of Pettit.

QUESTIONS:

1.) D.I.Y: A comment was made that the instructions we sometimes vague and hard to make sense of.
The Instructions we released were to industry professionals and it was understood by them that they were unfinished; we are using their feedback to complete them. We will also be providing a DVD as well; our focus now is to continue testing and development until we are completely satisfied with the Stage II’s overall performance


2.) Also A comment was made about having to self Fabricate parts. I think this will be addressed below. MAF etc… / MAF.......I think this has about been solved for the most part?
As for MAF housing it is assumed that the stock tube diameter is the correct size to work with the stock reflashed ECU, however, if we produce these parts before we test and prove this is correct, they will surely be wrong (Murphy’s Law) when the reflash is finally finished, tested and made available we will then produce MAF housing and provide them retroactively.


3.) What is the current (7/20/07) thinking on the MAF mounting? How about the idle-bleed?
RX8’s oil metering nozzle is basically the same design that has been used since 1986 on all fuel injected 13b engines. The oil metering nozzle check valve allows atmospheric air to bleed in and through the oil injection banjo fittings any time manifold pressure is less than atmospheric. On N/A engines pressure equalizes at wide-open throttle and there is no bleed. On turbo engines when boost is applied the nozzle check valve holds back manifold pressure to prevent metered oil from back flowing up into the rubber hoses and completely starving the engine for metered oil. On turbo engines like so many of the RX7 FD’s, when the nozzle check valves fail, metered oil backflows up into the rubber hose and stops the flow of metered oil, (not good) then the rubber hoses swell and seep oil which makes a mess and can even be a fire hazard if it leaks on a hot manifold.


4.) How do you intend to get CARB certification with the CEL issue? CEL, TCS/DSC (and not blinking, like a loss of traction), etc. / Update on CEL issue, I heard it would be solved this Summer?
We will eventually be applying for CARB exemption, but this will be after the powers to be are able to reflash the stock ECU, shut off the dash warning lamps and fully maintain emission standards.


5.) What is the thinking on the way the air jet hose and OMP bleed are hooked up?
Our connection of the jet air hose to the metering nozzles allows manifold pressure to be applied to the atmospheric side of the nozzle valve, this equalizes pressure on both sides of the valve and reduces the chance for a valve failure. In the event a valve does fail, metered oil can’t backflow so there is no interruption of metered oil the engine. It is however, clearly evidenced by the excessive wear found on a large percentage of over a thousand engines that we have dissembled, and inspected that the oil metering oil system is inadequate and fails to properly lubricate and protect the rotary’s internal compression seals. If you expect good longevity and top performance from your rotary engine, it is clearly evident that extra lubricant must be added to the fuel and this is why; the oil metering system is responsible for lubricating the delicate apex seals, compression seals and housing surfaces that are common to every rotary engine. Oil is fed from the engine oiling system (oil-pan) to a variable ratio-metering pump, then it’s injected into the engine where it partially blends with the onrushing air-fuel charge, this incomplete blending and fuel-to-oil ratios of 400:1*and higher, are cause for alarm, but now add in unleaded fuels that are designed to clean piston engines, these fuels and the rotary’s high combustion temperature quickly clean away this small amount of oil leaving little or no lubrication. This causes increased friction and wear, resulting in decreased performance and longevity. With over 25 years experience and more than 1000 rotary engines built, we know excessive wear on apex and compression seals as well as critical housing surfaces is caused from inadequate lubrication and using today’s fuels. What’s all this mean? With out proper lubrication, friction, heat and today’s fuels will likely cause premature failure of some expensive engine parts, great for Mazda’s profits but not good for you and me.


6.) Update and plans on TCS disable? / EMU Flash? When will it be achieved so that the Int-X is not required?
Another point of interest is that if RX8 owners ever want to have and use traction control with FI there are a few issues to address, since the TC is programmed for std rx-8 acceleration we find ourselves constantly exceeding its limits which causes repeated throttle cuts usually when you least expect it. I have personally found this dangerous, especially when it’s necessary to merge into traffic quickly. With this system working you have to disable it by pushing the DSC button on every startup and since I can’t remember to do that every time, we are hoping to accomplish one of the following:

1. Once reflash is available we will try to desensitize the system a little so it can work normally or
2. Program the system to be in a normally off mode, then if it rains you would hit button to activate.

-We are open for suggestions, also with the MAF unplugged the system is dormant and you can’t forget to turn it off.


7.) Protek-R; Why is it better than Idemitsu premix? Yeah, a basic explanation of how the final formula was reached would be sufficient and a straight answer as to how it is better than conventional (Idemitsu) pre-mix would be sufficient.
-In just one 24 hour race a Pettit Race Engine will get a lifetime of use and punishment, but since we mix Protek-R in the fuel they have little wear when compared to the average street engines we regularly disassemble. This is especially evident on turbocharged and high RPM rotary’s like the Renesis.
-Pettit Built engines are the only turbocharged rotary engines in racing history to finish the grueling Rolex24 at Daytona, could Protek be a factor? We think so!
-Here at Pettit Racing we know how fun and important it is to have a good running rotary engine and keep it running for many miles and years, that is why Protek-R was developed in the first place, to help keep your engine fresh.
-For RX8 owners, some Renesis engines have weak or low compression**, Mazda says “heat generated friction” is the cause, but since factory recalibration for the RX-8 ECU increases injected oil for the high revving Renesis; could they just need some Protek-R to help cut friction and reduce wear? We think so and that’s what Protek-R does best.
-By reducing friction and wear Protek-R can extend rotary engine life by 30% or more, depending on your driving habits and consistency of use.
-Protek-R blends completely with your fuel lubricating all these critical surfaces, this provides reduced friction and wear, adding longevity and keeping the power. Just what the rotary needs to last strong!!
-By adding just 4 oz of Protek-R fuel lubricant with an average fill up of 10-12 gallons of fuel, the fuel-to-oil ratio is improved by 100%, or 200:1 and better, Cut Friction Gain Power, use Protek-R.
Updated Answer:
I cant find where It is written that Protek clams to be better than any specific brand, Before we developed Protek we used Belray or Blenzol superior quality synthetic 2 cycle oils to premix, and have always recommend adding some type of lube to the fuel. I have even told many of my customers who ran out of Protek to buy tc3 outboard oil which is available at most gas stations rather than not add any lube at all. It kills me to do that because I get Protek for free, however; there are times when I forget to bring it. Its important to remember when using mineral based oil, it takes 30-50% more premix to achieve the same protection level as synthetic based oils.

The position of the replacement parts industry is directly related to profits from selling these parts, since it is a known fact that adding fuel lube can double engine life, it is common sense that they don't want people using it. Its amazing to me that so many people believe the industry statement against premix, " premixing oil in fuel can cause premature spark plug failure" and completely miss the fact that spark plugs are much cheaper than engines. I personally prefer changing plugs instead of engines.

Another point is the claim that Protek can add 30% to the life of your engine, this is a conservative estimate since it seems to make our race engines last forever, believe me I am still using parts that are over 20 years old and still running stronger than ever.

All Pettit Built Racing Engines as well as nearly all the professional race teams world wide rely solely on premix to keep their engines running strong, none of these engines have metering oil systems!

Another important point to note, there are some instances reported of premix gumming the fuel system, this is most often caused when bean based oil and mineral or some synthetic oils are mixed, the reaction produces a gooey gummy material that clogs screens and makes a general mess and can shut down the fuel system. The easiest fix for this is never use bean oil!!. At Pettit we developed and have used Protek-R for 20 years and have never seen any fuel pump or injector issues, we have seen improved life expectancy from fuel pumps and injectors as they need lubricant as well, again this is common sense, lubricants reduce the friction that cause wear. In just one 24 hour race a Pettit Race Engine will get a lifetime of use and punishment, but since we mix Protek-R in the fuel they have little wear when compared to the average street engines we regularly disassemble. This is especially evident on turbocharged and high RPM rotary’s like the Renesis.

Again if we expect our rotary engines to have top performance and longevity it is clearly evident that lube must be added to the fuel.


8.) Extreme pressure build up from High Speed runs… Will a breather valve become part of the kit?
All Pettit Kits will have every part necessary for a professional install.



9.) What has Pettit been able to with Int-X’s, Auto's 124mph speed limiter? Is this still an Issue?
So far only the auto is having this problem.


10.) When will the s/c be available for us in Australia?
We are taking orders from customers worldwide, to reserve our Stage II Kit we are accepting a $500 deposit from serious customers and expect to ship the second production run in August 07 #3. The 3rd production run will not ship until Late 07. We can accept Paypal, or CC, send to Lab@pettitracing.com


11.) When is stage I and III expected? III development schedule and how it's looking?
We will not be testing Stage I or III until the powers to be are able to reflash the stock ECU, shut off the dash warning lamps and fully maintain emission standards.


12.) Who actually did the Int-X tuning that is shipping with the kit? Was it, in fact, Steve Kan? And, if so, who else worked on that program besides him? Was Scott involved at all with that final tune? Is it still shipping with the same tune as the one that went out with Phil's kit?
With over 25 years of experience working with rotarys fuel and ignition systems it is clearly evident that tuner cars have the most variables over their operating range. Just the different exhaust systems available and their variances in back pressure and flo rates makes it nearly impossible to supply a perfect tune for every system, not to mention variances in fuel pressure, injector flo rates and individual engine condition, (compression #'s). To sum it up the base maps we are providing are base maps and for most cars so far they are working better than we expected, we will continue to improve them and and keep updating users, however; our goal here is to have the stock ecu working alone learning individual driving patterns and do the fine tuning for us just like it was intended from Mazda via short and long term fuel trims.

As for who tuned what, so far several names have been mentioned and we are extremely thankful for all the help and input we received from these professionals, they know who they are. Even with all the help we have received, so far all tuning improvements were made to existing maps , there just hasn't been the necessary time available to properly develop a map from scratch that is suitable for every vehicle, nevertheless we will continue to improve all aspects of the system.

Many great people have helped us with this project and we are thankful for their help and better for their friendship. Thanks Again.

MazdaManiac

iTrader: (3)

Pettit totally dodges the question of why the air bleed is hooked up to the OMP nozzles. Do they realize that there is no forward flowing air to the JAB nozzles because of this arrangement? (Utilizing the pressure to normalize the bleed to the OMP nozzles is not optimal, either.)
They also did not address what "Protek" is and why it is better than Idemitsu. They just gave their sales pitch.

If the instructions were meant for "professionals", why are they shipping these instructions to amateurs/end-users?

#6 is complete bull. The TC doesn't care how fast you are accelerating! Are any of the turbo users (who have considerably more power at their disposal) have similar problems? Of course not. The TCS/DSC is acting up because the MAF isn't properly installed. That sort of ignorance is not acceptable from a company like Pettit.

No answer for "#13", eh?