Paul, enjoyed meeting with you. Thanks for pulling the part I needed. I want the water pump as soon as you have it available. There are three straights on two different road courses that this will definately come into play and I want it installed. CMP coming up will not be an issue but Road Atlanta in August will and I hope to have it by then.

 

Once again, it's been a pleasure dealing with you. You will be in the first group of customers for sure. I'd like to say that production will begin this week but what I like and want aren't all the factors involved.

Paul.

 

I want da PUMP !!!!!!

 

You will have da pump!!

 

count me in also Paul. Please advise people to also get a system --any kind they want--to activate the cooling fan on the radiator at 180F. the airflow through the rad without the fans assist is terrible. You also have a good bit of blockage behind the rad. i am actually thinking about getting rid of the RB intake--going with a mazdaspeed (aem) so i can free up some of that blockage. havent made up my mind yet.
olddragger

 

Paul: count me in as well.

 

I want this pump too! I mostly want too be explained on how it will work... Will there be an idler pulley in place of the water pump? Or will this new pump include a belt too cancel that out? I guess it'd be smartest too understand where the pump even is on the 8 first...

If you could just post directions on install as soon as you begin selling this product that'd be great!

 

^^ pump has a redesigned impeller etc. It is a mechanical pump that resides where the stock pump bolts on

 

Keef,

I look forward to serving you in terms of this pump but I must warn you and others that the cooling system on this car is better avoided by the un-trained. You can install a superior part improperly and create a problem where there was very little or no problem to begin. Simple errors like not eliminating air pockets from the system or not tightening your belt properly or the wrong ratio of water to coolant/ antifreeze could be fatal to your motor. We will be accepting no liability for anything related to this pump and it's installation due to these and many other factors.

Rest assured that this is the finest in design and workmanship and well worth the price. Please don't attempt to cut costs at the expense of your engine.

Paul.

 

YOU BETTER BE SURE THAT THIS IS THE FINEST DESIGN OR ELSE !!!!!!! WE ALL GONNA YOU !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



Summer is commmmmmminnnnnnngggg I need some PUMPZ!

 

A particular pump takes the same amount of power to spin at a particular flow no matter if its being driven by an engine, an electric motor, or a bunch of gerbils running in a gerbil wheel... if an electric pump is drawing 1/100 of the power of a mechanical pump at the same flow rate, its either a magical electric pump or a seriously shitty mechanical pump

 

Paul,

Can't wait to see this thing. Will you be including insturctions or can I just take this to my local Rotary Shop? (Neptune Speed in HB)

 

Not relevant because:
1) An electrical pump runs at a constant speed - a mechanical increases speed as engine speed increases.
2) Power to drive a centrifugal pump increases by the square of the RPM.

A mechanical pump is a compromise because of the range of speeds at which it must run.

 

ya, I know I'm not that mechanically inclined... But I'm still addicted too wasting gas... I never really do that much work on my 8 anyway... I'd rather pay too know it was done correctly.... I let a mechanic do all the work on my car because it's probably pretty obvious that I don't understand 100% of how this is going too work out...

But I'm still very much looking forward too this modification!

Good luck Paul!

Edit: It's just like MM says it. The place I expect too see gains are in the higher RPM range because from my logical understanding our stock belt powered water pump would create the most strain on the engine up in that range... And if you don't have any form of UD pulley the stock water pump doesn't do anything past 7K anyway...

 

if you properly design a mechanical pump, its running at the required amount at each engine speed since the need for heat rejection increases with rpms at a given throttle position. True there is some trade-off in order to get enough flow at idle which may cause the pump to spin too fast at redline, but a 100x power draw difference is completely obsurd.

Somewhere along the line, the two pumps are going to be flowing the same amount and requiring the same power - the closer to redline those two cross the better the design of the mechanical pump.

if anything, an eletrical pump running at a fixed speed is always at full flow and therefore wasting power 95% of the time in a street car....

 

^ You are in a world of theory. Unfortunately (or fortunately, depending on your position), real-world water pumps don't behave that way.

The designs do not overlap because of the difference between static and dynamic drive speeds.

Also, "the need for heat rejection" does not depend on RPM at all. It is a function of load and VE. After the torque peak, total heat added to the system starts to decrease.

 

oh, so 100% load at 3,000 rpms has the same heat rejection load as 100% load at 7,000 rpms?

 

Actually, the heat load at 6500 RPM is greater than 7800 RPM.
But you kinda got the idea.

 

Just throwing this in to the discussion .
If you monitor your coolant temps you will notice the temp go up very quickly if you do a redline through the gears run .
If you are holding at 6000rpm it does not have the same effect unless you are under load . ie going up a hill .

I am struggling to see the benefit of a pump that will improve flow unless the rest of the cooling system is overated for the current pump flow .

 

I would like to see 2 consecutive runs data logged. Something along the same stretch of road. Flat, incline or decline shouldn't matter so much as long as the same stretch of road is used. 1/2mile to a full mile with the cruise set at tq peak and then the cruise set at the hp peak. Gear shouldn't matter as long as its the same between each run.

 

Uh, "holding" at the torque peak means nothing if you are not loaded.

Having done load cell dyno tuning, I've seen the way thermal loading varies above and below the torque peak.

 

Being the president of the PFS gives me certain rights to make unsubstantiated claims and get away with it.

 

So do it on a dyno at load then. Post up some data if you've got it.

 

Who elected you prez of the PFS?
I think you are the under-secretary. Or, maybe you are just under the secretary.
You'll have to survive a run-off vote against Mark to be Prez.

How about you do that?
I already know the outcome (having already done it on dozens of different cars over the years) and I don't have to prove anything. You do, however.

 

Wasn't the catch that the stock pump will cavitate at high RPMS? This is where the inlet pressure drops to a point that the water boils and your water pump is moving a mixture of water and steam. This lowers the coolant mass flow leading to decreased cooling. The cavitation point is decided by pump rpm and coolant temperature. Coolant temperature is load based. So, you run your car hard at high RPMS and your hot coolant starts to cavitate at the pump, decreasing your cooling and overheating your engine.

I haven't really looked into the issue, but this is what I believed the problem to be. A redesigned pump could change the cavitation point and avoid the issue.

Redesigning the rest of the cooling system for better rejection would be a different issue.