9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

As far as I know bumblebeerx8 has the most baller wheels I have ever seen on an RX-8, Custom Forged 360 IIRC.

Atilla

iTrader: (1)

Nessen? aren't those the wheels MadMike has on his car now? silver spoke w/a gloss black barrel?

p.s. +1 wheels shouldn't cost more than the car. That is unless you can get them for free

bose

iTrader: (5)

Correct. They are sponsors of his, I believe made in Florida too.

Danmn858

iTrader: (10)

I still disagree with you 9k.

And Nessen Forged for the win.

tiltmode43

iTrader: (15)

Dang, so much bickering lol. Let's set the fact straight because like 9K mentioned, education is always good.

Rotary Forged, Rim Rolled, Flow Formed, Spun Forged, etc. all have one thing in common - they are all cast wheels, despite their names. This isn't nitpicking 'typed of forging,' it's simply fact. Wheels made with these manufacturing processes cannot properly be described as 'forged wheels' as the wheels are not forged, or else Enkei, Advan, etc. would definitely be advertising their wheels as forged. Great marketing by Forgestar considering their name, but anyone who has these wheels or purchases these wheels under the assumption they are forged has been misled. Like Forgestar, these wheels all begin their lives with a cast face.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with cast wheels. More importantly, one should look at the reputability of a company - raw materials, wheel designs, passing certain strength tests, etc. are all far more important than manufacturing process.

Regarding the slew of high dollar multi-piece boutique wheel companies out there these days - don't believe the hype

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

How is Rotary Forged a casting and not forging? Please explain this to me.

http://www.fourwheeler.com/techartic...d_wheel_build/

and


and

pdxhak

iTrader: (2)

There is way more to a wheel then whether it is forged vs. cast. My wheels are cast flow formed (Rays) and they are stronger and lighter than many other wheels of the same size. Wheel strength and weight is what matters.

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

I agree, but to say rotary forging is cast, is just not correct. As detailed in the link above and the video. But I love this stuff so if I can learn how different wheels are made that is great. This is part of the problem, what are we paying for exactly when we buy high end wheels from say iforged or Volk? Is an iforged wheel that much better? I mean BBS uses flow formed wheels on race wheels.

pdxhak

iTrader: (2)

There was an article posted here a few years back where I believe the 5zigen fn01r-c beat out high end wheels. I have searched a few times for it but cannot find it.

hoss -05

iTrader: (4)

Sounds like something MOTO IQ would cover.

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

Yeah I remember that article. I also remember seeing stress tests years ago versus replica wheels and it was pretty scary how weak the replicas were. But if you hit a curb fast enough any wheel will break. I also recall the cheaper wheels changing color under high heat track situations in another test I read.


But either way I still want to know why Tilt thinks rotary forging is casting.

tiltmode43

iTrader: (15)

The four wheeler link you posted was really informative, but I think there's a bit of terminology ambiguity going on in the wheel industry in general. If I were them, I would shorten the manufacturing description for 'forged' to differentiate it from the others out there who use the same manuf. name, while the wheels as a whole are made with a different process. From my experience, it's accepted for a wheel to be described as rotary forged when it is strictly the rim (or barrel) of the wheel that is rotary forged (flow formed, rim rolled, etc.). When I hear 'rotary forged' my mind automatically goes here because it's so widely accepted and was within context (TSW, Forgestar). That said, I should have clarified/made the distinction between wheel face & barrel/rim. Those wheels from the link are certainly forged, in a similar manner to how HRE and many others forge, but that process differs greatly from TSW, Forgestar, Advan, etc. as far as I'm aware.

Regarding Forgestar's "forged" wheels:
"This specialized process begins with a low pressure type of casting and uses a special machine that spins the initial casting, heats the outer portion of the casting and then uses steel rollers pressed against the rim area to pull the rim to its final width and shape."
(Only the barrel/rim is manipulated through this process, which does not make this a forged wheel.)
Forgestar Wheels Custom Rotary Forged Flow Formed Concave Performance Wheels

Regarding TSW's "forged" wheels:
I didn't actually watch this with sound but based on the picture in the video, it's pretty self explanatory.

If you really want to make sure you're getting an excellent product when buying wheels new, stick to wheel manufacturers that OE for large auto manufacturers such as Rays, BBS, Enkei, OZ, etc. By no means are these the only legitimate wheel manufacturers but I would blindly vouch for their high end wheel lines.

edit: Damn 9k, beat me on the response

Danmn858

iTrader: (10)

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

Well whether the it starts out as a cast aluminum piece or aluminum block that is then rotary forged is not really significant to me, the rotary forging process is realigning the molecules anyway. Same goes for the flow forming process although it does not appear to be as much pressure but I don't know if that means anything at all.

So the final wheel is not cast, it's forged or flow formed (similar processes and arguing which is better is out of my league). And then of course the methods vary between manufacturers so you will have wheels that are made up of both forged and cast pieces.

I agree the terminology is confusing. Either way, I am still right, both the Forgestars and the TSW's are forged. Whether forging while spinning is better than forging while sitting still is better is not for me (or anyone else here)to say, I would have to ask a metallurgist.

tiltmode43

iTrader: (15)

Haha can't tell if that last part was a jest?

That's like saying, "Yeah, my wheels are single piece with low pressure cast faces and molecularly realigned rims, so they're actually forged wheels!" Colloquially speaking, wheels with flow formed rims (aka flow formed wheels) are not called 'forged wheels' in the wheel industry. As a technicality, one can make the argument that because a part of the wheel is put under considerable pressure & heat thus 'forged,' the wheel is 'partially forged' but that's just being pedantic I think. A true forged wheel to me, and I think most others will agree, is a wheel that is fully forged such as BBS, Rays, etc.

Forgestar straight up says the wheel is a low pressure cast wheel with a pulled out rim. Even the comments in the TSW reflect what I'm saying (not that youtube comments mean anything though, haha). Why would Forgestar go through the trouble of specifying their wheels are case if the term 'forged' could accurately and properly be used to describe their manufacturing process?

This video shows the rim rolling process. Can one really accurately describe their wheels as 'forged wheels' due to this process?


BTW 9K, I enjoy a good debate

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

Well...... I enjoy a good debate as well So then RAYS are not full forged either since they are "RM forged" (aka rotary forged) which is essentially rotary forging or actually more similar to flow forming. The faces are forged though.

tiltmode43

iTrader: (15)

Dammit, I quoted before the edit!

I want to say Rays, BBS, etc. do not take forged blanks and CNC the design as HRE does, but rather have specific wheel molds that are used during the forging process. While more expensive I'd say this should be a more 'proper' process as you aren't CNC'ing the entire face but at this point, the differences are largely irrelevant.

As long as wheels look good and come from a reputable source or factory, those are the main things that matter to me

tiltmode43

iTrader: (15)

I'd say it's fine to call a flow formed barrel a 'forged' barrel but who differentiates the various part of a single piece wheel?

At the end of the day:

Forged face + forged rim = a forged wheel.

Cast face + forged rim =/= a forged wheel.

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

I agree. So you can get forged rims for under $2,000.00

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

And I also agree about it being a good idea to know the product you are buying and where is comes from. If you cannot figure out where or how your wheels are made then that is probably not a good thing. And of course the main process used to make wheels means nothing without all the associated detailed processes that go into making the wheel and good quality control. My guess is that marketing departments know very little about the technical terms and engineering behind the wheel making process.

Danmn858

iTrader: (10)

I hope everyone has become infinitely smarter and this is never a topic of discussion ever again.

ever.

pdxhak

iTrader: (2)

keep hoping dreaming

it will come up again and again

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

It was a great topic and I for one will be buying HRE's when I am done with my current plans.

Konig! Wanna trade wheels?

tiltmode43

iTrader: (15)

Lol so true. I don't think it's gone this in depth before though. I'm ready to keep going

Lol sure, you can get a set of forged rim (barrels/hoops) for under $2,000 but not an actual forged wheel set :P

Danmn858

iTrader: (10)

My next set will probably be Luxury Abstract.