MazdaManiac

iTrader: (3)

The only thing I could have done to make it worse would have been to not care for the engine so well over its lifetime.
I guess I could have used 87 octane and conventional oil.

I've had a 12 PSI (82 kPa) peak since I went to the EMU. I have the boost controller set to release the wastegate gain a bit after 6500 RPM and let the boost back to 10 PSI or so (70 kPa) to redline.

The summer has been brutal. It is just starting to let up.

I'm really curious to see if there is any sort of gunk in the ports since I've used nothing but Mobil 1 since the motor was broken in.

I have the cheap stuff in the new motor (Penzoil 5w-30) for the first 250 miles just to liberate the stuff that might have settled in the motor of the 3 years it sat in the yard.
I've got a K&N oil filter and a case of 5w-40 Mobil 1 waiting to go in on Wednesday.

rotarygod

Holy crap you were asking for it! That's one way to see how tough the engine is!!!

I personally have no direct experience with Mobil 1 synthetic and aside from what Yamamoto said about not liking it specifically in rotary engines, I have seen no other issues with it documented. I even asked David at Royal Purple why Mobil 1 would be bad in a rotary and he couldn't think of a reason. He knows a few people who have used it in RX-7's over the years with no issues.

I think one of the biggest reasons for issues is as has been stated already. That is how hard the engine is driven. Your engine will probably look about as good as any engine can after blowing a seal. I don't think you will see any evidence that the oil you used would have caused any problems. We'll see I guess. You drove it hard so it should have been pretty much all removed. Let us know what it looks like.

CarAndDriver

I'd avoid Mobil 1. There are such good alternatives with RP, Redline and Amsoil. Why risk it? It's not as if not buying Mobil is going to hurt the burgeoning coffers of ExxonMobil.

swoope

iTrader: (5)

mm,

sorry to hear about the motor going... were you premixing with it and what flash were you on...

you have done the durabity test for this motor...

btw. we bottled today.... reply to my prior pm if you are interested.

beers

MazdaManiac

iTrader: (3)

I was pre-mixing and was on the latest (pre-recall) flash.

swoope

iTrader: (5)

premixing from begining or tubo / sc install??

interesting. cant wait to see the photos..

beers

MazdaManiac

iTrader: (3)

Just the last 8k or so at most (since arriving in AZ).

Too little, too late probably.

Though, it was ultimately octane (and the lack thereof) that did me in.
PM sent.

rotarygod

After much study I have decided to reverse my position on one thing. No I am not going to say not to use synthetic! I still endorse it's use and will continue to do so. My position on Group III oils has always been that since they are formulated fromt he same base stock as Group I and II conventional oils, I have never considered them to be true synthetics. Legally they can be called synthetics though. I am changing my position on this. I too now agree that Group III oils are synthetics.

I will have to get more into this decision later as once again I will be long winded in my response.

MazdaManiac

iTrader: (3)

Maybe we should start a thread where we can research, analyze and discuss the various additive packages since that would seem to be more at the heart of the issue.
Though that sort of info is proprietary, I'm sure there is a petrol chemist or two here that can spill some beans...

rotarygod

I'd like to get an oil analysis on as many different oils as possible. Not used oil but new oil. This will not tell whether or not it is a synthetic and there is no way to tell looking at the oil analysis. It may take a while to explain this so to keep it simple lets just say that although the molecular structures may look the same, what we can't tell is if those molecules were created from combining other molecules together, or if they were "naturally occurring". That's what determines if it is a synthetic or not. It's not the final product but rather how you got it that counts. I will eventually write all that up at a later time.

I really want the analysis info to see what else is in the oil. This is where the additives as well as the "contaminants" should show up. We could see which companies use what additives to do their jobs since some use additives that other companies don't. I'd also like to see the proportion differences between them. It would be nice to try to make a correlation on which oils are more likely to leave deposits and which ones aren't. The nice thing about doing it this way is that it will take the whole conventional synthetic debate out of it and get right to the heart of the matter. This is something that may take some time.

Oil analysis costs money. Not much but when you add up all of the different oils out there it can get expensive. Maybe each of us interested in this information should all decide to buy 1 quart of new oil (everyone having a different one of course), using as close to the same weight as possible, and send it in for analysis. Then we could all pool our data and discuss a way to judge and interpret it. That sounds like a neat idea and at the very least we could all learn something from it.

MazdaManiac

iTrader: (3)

Where would you suggest one go about having oil analyzed?

OMG! Another page-topper!!! I'm up to almost two dozen in a month.

jeffe19007

MazdaManiac, sorry to hear about your motor. I hope something good comes of it.

You have the new one in already? I was about to offer some hands, but it sounds like the install is done and over.

About oil testing. I am up for doing a sample or two. Let me know what I need to do.

I am using Amsoil at the moment, but the case is gone, and I don't have a handy supplier anymore. But I am convinced that in the heat we need at least something as tough as a decent synthetic if not a heavier weight.

Flash or no flash.

MazdaManiac

iTrader: (3)

Oh yeah. The motor is already swapped out. But thanks for the offer!
I've got a few of these swaps under my belt so, even with regular nap/beer/steak breaks it still only took a few hours here and there over three days. Didn't even break/loose anything and the garage is mostly clean!
Now, I need to decide what to do with the old motor!

I'm still running Mobil 1 (5w-30 with some 5w-40 on the shelf), but I have 3 gallons of Royal Purple on the way.

Fred - let me know how to proceed. I'd like to see some data.

rotarygod

Blackstone Labs does oil testing. They have several different levels of testing as they look for different info in each test. They range in price from $20 and up per sample depending on what you want. I should probably call them to see how much it would cost to get the info that we want. An ash content test is expensive at $70. Depending on what we want to know, this could get expensive.

http://www.blackstone-labs.com/index.html

dannobre

iTrader: (3)

Blackstone does discounts for volume....a 50 pack should do more than enough samples

I think we should set up a Paypal address for this...and all contribute an amout...like $15-20
each and have someone ( RG ) do the Submissions. I'm sure a more detailed analysis
would run in the $40 range per oil sample??

Count me in for doing this....

rotarygod

Aw man, I'm not sure I want the responsibility for a Paypal account. I'll call them on Monday to get more info.

dannobre

iTrader: (3)

If you can handle the trust accounts...you should be OK with a few bucks in a Paypal account

I'd do it...but it's a PIA from Canada to even do my own oil analysis...let alone organize something like this

rxeightr

Before we do this, has anyone spent time at BTOG to see if this has already been done?

If the research proves nada, I'm in for donating to the cause.

kowzan5

Just a quick question has anyone used synthetic royal purple 5w-30?

rotarygod

Many of us use it. All Royal Purple is synthetic.

kowzan5

Ya but is 5W-30 ok to use on the 8. Just want to make sure before I change my oil dont wanna mess stuff up.

rotarygod

5W30 is recommended in all coutries except the US and the only reason 5W20 is recommended here as opposed to 5W30 is political based. It's fine. Use it. I've gotten to the point where I prefer 5W30 over 5W20 anyways. I've been using 5W20 but have recently changed.

rotarygod

Good idea to check there! They have many different oil tests. Someone make an excel spreadsheet on these.

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/voalibrary.html

Nubo

Here's a start. You'll have to replace .doc with .xls

I skipped single-weights and stuff that didn't look like automobile engine oil.

Anyone else want to add a few?

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

Count me into this.

I have a quart of Mobil 1 Extended Performance unused, I bought it as a case of 6, brother used 5 in his Altima, 1 left unused. ITs still fresh cuz I just got it for maybe a month or so.

I can send it in to blackstone or should we setup a paypal. Im going to watch this closely.