Name Your Premix!!
07-27-2009, 11:15 PM
#52
Super Moderator
QUOTES From the "The Great OIL Debate" pdf
Unfortunately it just costs more to manufacture API-TC oils than TCW3 oils.
If you walk into a store that handles a variety of 2-stroke oils, it is relatively easy to find TCW3 certified oil. The TCW3 market is about 10 times the size of the API-TC market.
They simply need more protection than TCW3 oils can give. Those that use TCW3 oils are risking high temp. Seizure if the engine cooling system plugs or and internal fuel filter plugs (lean condition). These things may not happen very often, but when they do, it’s better to have a little extra protection that only a TI-TC oil can give.
Do not use TCW3 in your SeaDoo PWC. I don’t care if it’s a full synthetic or your brother-in-law uses it; for the reasons stated above, it will not protect your motor when conditions get tough in your motor.
HE is talking about the use of TCW3's in marine applications, which is what they are designed for..MARINE USE!
Unfortunately it just costs more to manufacture API-TC oils than TCW3 oils.
If you walk into a store that handles a variety of 2-stroke oils, it is relatively easy to find TCW3 certified oil. The TCW3 market is about 10 times the size of the API-TC market.
They simply need more protection than TCW3 oils can give. Those that use TCW3 oils are risking high temp. Seizure if the engine cooling system plugs or and internal fuel filter plugs (lean condition). These things may not happen very often, but when they do, it’s better to have a little extra protection that only a TI-TC oil can give.
Do not use TCW3 in your SeaDoo PWC. I don’t care if it’s a full synthetic or your brother-in-law uses it; for the reasons stated above, it will not protect your motor when conditions get tough in your motor.
HE is talking about the use of TCW3's in marine applications, which is what they are designed for..MARINE USE!
Last edited by ASH8; 07-27-2009 at 11:54 PM.
07-27-2009, 11:26 PM
#53
Super Moderator
So, Basically TCW3 2 Stroke oils are CHEAP, to Buy, cheap to manufacture, and are suspect for high temp operations.
This is what you do NOT want in your RX-8 as the rotary is a VERY High temp operational motor in combustion/ignition phase.
YOU ONLY GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR........
This is why I stick with Amsoil Saber Pro, yes it is more expensive, but like a few other brands it is far superior for lubrication, NOT Burning or leaving deposits.
Again IMO keep it simple (KISS), I really do not know why others are concocting all these recipe's and blending all these brands together with high solvents and cleaners..
You want a 2 stroke that will LUBRICATE at HIGH Temperatures, not to 'bake a cake' or 'mix a drink'.
This is what you do NOT want in your RX-8 as the rotary is a VERY High temp operational motor in combustion/ignition phase.
YOU ONLY GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR........
This is why I stick with Amsoil Saber Pro, yes it is more expensive, but like a few other brands it is far superior for lubrication, NOT Burning or leaving deposits.
Again IMO keep it simple (KISS), I really do not know why others are concocting all these recipe's and blending all these brands together with high solvents and cleaners..
You want a 2 stroke that will LUBRICATE at HIGH Temperatures, not to 'bake a cake' or 'mix a drink'.
07-27-2009, 11:35 PM
#54
07-27-2009, 11:48 PM
#55
Super Moderator
/\ Yeah, I know....
I found this interesting on what makes up MMO..
Naphthenic Hydrocarbons, Mineral Spirits, Chlorinated Hydrocarbons.
I knew there was a "drink mix" somewhere...good old Mineral Spirits...probably Turpentine!!
Yep it is a mystery all right...
I found this interesting on what makes up MMO..
Naphthenic Hydrocarbons, Mineral Spirits, Chlorinated Hydrocarbons.
I knew there was a "drink mix" somewhere...good old Mineral Spirits...probably Turpentine!!
Yep it is a mystery all right...
07-27-2009, 11:49 PM
#56
so I put in that Valvoline I posted that is the API certified, I took my car on the freeway, about 84 outside temp, for about 10 miles, got off the freeway, the car would still go, but it did not have that Pulling feeling. ate at a restorant, then drove the car around the lake about 20miles, got back on the same stretch of highway and came home outside temps dropped about 5-8degrees as the evening progress, but after the highway run so about 40miles of driving sense premix.
the car pulled this time around
so either my engine is on its way out, or this stuff works really really good
the car pulled this time around
so either my engine is on its way out, or this stuff works really really good
07-27-2009, 11:51 PM
#57
07-27-2009, 11:59 PM
#58
Super Moderator
07-28-2009, 12:06 AM
#60
Super Moderator
so I put in that Valvoline I posted that is the API certified, I took my car on the freeway, about 84 outside temp, for about 10 miles, got off the freeway, the car would still go, but it did not have that Pulling feeling. ate at a restorant, then drove the car around the lake about 20miles, got back on the same stretch of highway and came home outside temps dropped about 5-8degrees as the evening progress, but after the highway run so about 40miles of driving sense premix.
the car pulled this time around
so either my engine is on its way out, or this stuff works really really good
the car pulled this time around
so either my engine is on its way out, or this stuff works really really good
Definitely do my Oil Cooler vent mod which will help lower oil temps at oil cooler by 15%,... cooler oil = cooler engine = happier engine..
https://www.rx8club.com/series-ii-diy-161/diy-improve-oil-cooler-air-flow-up-10-15%25-168650/
07-28-2009, 06:07 AM
#61
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Thats the thing, I have read, probably as much if not more than most here.
And my conclusions based on all that reading.
- TCW-3 is not the best option.
- Boat oil, should be avoided.
Go for any 2cycle premix that is ISO EGD or JASO FC, that is not made for Marine applications.
What confused me is after all this time, I see some of you guys who have been here a while still using boat oil.
Now, is all this scientificaly proven... I dont have numbers no.
But its a reasonable conclusion. Marine oil isnt made for road vehicles at all. And doesnt play well with an exhaust system and the CAT least of all.
And my conclusions based on all that reading.
- TCW-3 is not the best option.
- Boat oil, should be avoided.
Go for any 2cycle premix that is ISO EGD or JASO FC, that is not made for Marine applications.
What confused me is after all this time, I see some of you guys who have been here a while still using boat oil.
Now, is all this scientificaly proven... I dont have numbers no.
But its a reasonable conclusion. Marine oil isnt made for road vehicles at all. And doesnt play well with an exhaust system and the CAT least of all.
07-28-2009, 06:21 AM
#62
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Ah, I hadnt seen this whole page of replies when I wrote my above comment.
Exactly, my point, Stealth has gone over this thousands of times.
Ash, that was a good read.
I had come to these conclusions too, which is what confused me... why people still insisted on using TCW-3 or boat oils.
Exactly, my point, Stealth has gone over this thousands of times.
Ash, that was a good read.
I had come to these conclusions too, which is what confused me... why people still insisted on using TCW-3 or boat oils.
07-28-2009, 10:13 AM
#64
SARX Legend
Thread Starter
iTrader: (46)
ASH, you are a bastard. I read all freakin' 75 pages of the premix thread as well as stuff on many other sites and now you throw a huge wrench into my thinking again.
07-28-2009, 11:14 AM
#65
your gonna have to go in and see, I went to autozone, napa, and shucks/checkers. shucks was the only one that had none tcw-3 2 stroke. I gonna use this for a bit, but plan to order some Idemitsu,
07-28-2009, 11:19 AM
#66
Definitely do my Oil Cooler vent mod which will help lower oil temps at oil cooler by 15%,... cooler oil = cooler engine = happier engine..
https://www.rx8club.com/showthread.php?t=168650
07-28-2009, 01:25 PM
#67
SARX Legend
Thread Starter
iTrader: (46)
okay so does anyone know the temperature ranges that the Renesis operates under internally? I understand the TCW3 are not as good at high loads under high temperatures but are the temperatures internally of a PWC motor in the same range as our motors? Just wondering because if they operate at a much higher temperature then TCW3 should be fine.
07-28-2009, 03:42 PM
#71
Super Moderator
Seriously, I have been saying this for some time, but you get tired of repeating yourself...
DON'T USE ANY TCW3 2 stroke oils
07-28-2009, 04:16 PM
#73
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07-28-2009, 04:31 PM
#74
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MMO , Research is good , price is good and it has oz. marks on side if bottle, easy to squirt in the tank... what else could you ask for...Wm stocks it...
