delhi

Meh, it's under the new extended warranty. I hope mine goes before 2014. Maybe by that time, they will either give me the 09+ motors or 16x will be the only engine available! SWEET!

dynamho

An option to upgrade to 16x WOULD be cool!

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

well, there was nothing wrong with the diagostic method. the car still works, everthing fails after a while

mechanical stuff can fail without any warning.

i think its safe to say that, mazda's recall flash came out a little bit too late. damage is already done.

good luck with that

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

engine is gg. now waiting for tranny's result.

DOMINION

^You got a new one? cool. You going to get the 2009 tranny?

I got a used 2004. She pulls strong and I love it. But I think its the second motor. But what do you expect, I mean its an 04 its Vegas and I was not the og owner of the car to take care of it lol I have to find that car fax. Dang where did I put it.

delhi

Now that Mazda has made a revised 13b with side injectors, there really isn't any reason to keep making these old 13bs for replacements. So what gives?

DOMINION

^Good one!

robrecht

I would think that such terrible gas mileage over the last few years is a pretty good indicator that there was something wrong. Hope you'll soon see what I mean when you start getting some tanks over 300 miles.

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

i still wonder why the compression gone down so fast in just a bit more than half a year

for the tranny, i freaking wish they would give me a 09 tranny

but it wont happen

so ....


the pcm, and bunch of other things needs to be changed

so nope, that wont happen

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

too bad mpg is NOT part of the test :p

well i mean, last sept it was still fine. but its better to fail now than later, at least i dont have to pay for plugs and coils :p

hahaha, 300 miles? maybe 16x. it will never happen on 13b-msp

shaunv74

'09 tranny won't work with 04-08 diff. and PPF. The PPF bolts to the other side on the '09s.

Now if you could figure out how to blow out your diff at the same time...

Brettus

iTrader: (2)

Bad luck man .
how many times did you decarb it ? I do wonder if doing this to a healthy engine is a good idea .....

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

Gee, all that crap you talked about running synthetic. Just think, you threw all that money away just like I did on my first engine. Talk about putting your foot in your mouth. Didn't you premix too? Sorry to hear about your engine though.

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

wrong

its direct bolt on

mazmart selling them, 2 grand brand new

kevin decarb it probably four times already(in total), he even tried the old school atf method still no good.

i believe this has a lot to do with insufficient omp rate than anything. mazda knew they messed up, thats why they have to issued a recall. but sadly, damage is already done. nothing can help a patient that has been certified dead.

just remember, my motor is FREE of carbon. kevin believe its worn leading apex seals. if thats true, nothing i use could help. think of it this way, if i didnt use synthetic my motor could've failed at 22k just like urs . also im sure that my stationary bearing still good

robrecht

But I think the test should be better calibrated such that it does correspond better to the actual condition of the engine. 300 miles on a tank of gas is not hard at all with a Renesis. Think about it. 22 mpg highway driving x 14 gallons = 308 miles. Someone here got 29 mpg in highway driving. I've gotten 26-28 mpg at 65 mph. That's not the way I normally drive but every once in a while I do try to see what the maximum mileage I can get is just to get a sense of what kind of condition my engine is in. Long Interstate driving isn't much fun anyway.

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

lol

maybe im out of the good mpg forfar too long ....

shazy

if i drive slowly i can get 320 miles...

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

But in reality you don't know jack. Just admit that synthetic offers no more protection and neither does premixing in a daily driver. I'm just bustin' your ***** because you were so adamant that premixing and using synthetic would allow your motor to run long into the future.

robrecht

Premixing can't reverse wear that's already happened. It can mask a problem to a certain extent, just like doing a wet compression test. Why do you say premixing offers no protection in a daily driver?

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

I believe he has always premixed and because I know people who have premixed since day one and still had engine failures. I'm no expert though. I think for track duty, the more lubrication the better due to the extreme conditions. My only point is that synthetic oil and premixing have proved to be a huge waste of money IMO.

robrecht

No, he said he didn't start premixing until sometime in the 3rd year, when he was already only getting 150-160 miles per tank. I think most of the wear took place before then. Failure didn't happen until after he stopped premixing. If it helps for the track, why wouldn't it be helpful for daily driving?

teknics

just to clear up something in my last post, there's no "leading" apex seal, i was talking about the tips of the rotor and its faces. each "face" is contained by two apex seals. the one on the bottom of the face is that chambers leading apex, the one above it is that face's trailing apex.

As for MPG, I have driven my evo 9 hard enough to go down to 15mpg and have cruised calmly enough to get 30mpg (more then once) the car's rating is like 22mpg highway.

Fuel mileage changes based on so many different factors that its hardly useful information in a technical diagnostic. Hell just using a different gas station can effect it. Nevermind the fact that as far as I know, the mileage wasn't mentioned (no one ever said it to me at least) so it wasn't even looked at.

After the first compression test results I was pretty sure that we were experiencing a sticking seal internally, stalling was random, hard start (while it was in my possession) wasn't an *everytime* thing, i could recreate it but not 100%.

In all honesty I've still never made it stall while test driving it, i can force it to stall since i know it's a compression problem but otherwise it never "just happened" to me, again making diagnostics difficult.

mazda's spec for engine compression cutoff is 7.0kgf/cm2 (kpa x 100) per face at 250rpm. Most new motors will start in the high 9's as an average. Considering last test he was in mid 7's the motor was close but i had no idea what his compression was a few months before, so going off one data point which is above spec I diaged the motor as being low, but good.

6 months later dropping ~2kgf/cm2 may SEEM serious but that is ~.3kgf/cm2(300kpa) a month on the one face. Also he stated himself the problem got progressively worse. That alone proves it isn't a catastrophic failure, but a wear issue instead. In a rotary a catastrophic failure (aka a sudden serious failure) is very noticeable. Car will take forever to start, feeling flooded at all times, car will drive but have no lowend power and be rough as hell, it'll smooth out in the higher rpms but will produce no real torque to keep you going.
His car/engine drove fine, there was a slight lack in low-end but 99% of the people here wouldnt have noticed it at all.

I mean you guys can just keep going with the catastrophic failure, bad oil, bla bla bla stuff. But I'm just letting you know how/what it is. This is not the result of any seals breaking, this most likely is simply an excessively worn apex seal which, given his history of stalling since he first bought the car, was possibly barely within spec when originally used and therefore wore quicker. In reality it could even simply be an apex seal spring flattening enough to prevent good contact between the housing and the seal.

Basically it's something simply falling out of spec, NOT something actually breaking. Yes the timeline may seem drastic but you have to look at the whole picture, and you need to understand once a part reaches it's spec limit the timeline will shorten and things will get worse quicker because you now have a faulty assembly.

In other news, messed with the trans today a bit, unfortunately i won't get to authorize anything until monday as when i last spoke with tech line they needed me to check a few more things and they arent open on saturdays, so monday I'll relay them the necessary info and we will go from there. I'm sure I'll be receiving a visit from a regional rep about this RO.

kevin.

shaunv74

Thanks for the info. Yes I thought that's what you meant by leading and trailing face. Thanks for clarifying. I believe you when you say something isn't broken but just worn out. I'm just suprised that it went down hill so quickly once it got bad enough to notice.

I really am anxious to see your boroscope pics/video to see what it looks like in there.

robrecht

I agree. But what if you couldn't get better than 15 mpg no matter how conservatively you drove it on the highway even after a good tune up--wouldn't you suspect a problem?

teknics

Also about premixing, if you're not premixing you're asking for a blown motor. You'd think you guys would research the things the previous rotary communities have proven.

Look for pics of a rotor housing that used only the stock OMP with say 40k miles on it, then look at a pic of a rotor housing which was fully premixed every tank with 40k miles on it. The difference in corrosion, carbon, and overall condition of the rotor housing surface has SEVERE differences. The OMP and oil injection system as a whole is a bandaid created by Mazda to prevent having to make everyone premix. No one would buy a brand new car that needed you to put oil in it every fillup.

Nevermind the fact that the OMP is dumping dirty oil into your motor.

And on that topic, why do most rx8 guys buy fancy premix? Idemitsu etc etc. You can use ANY 2 stroke oil which is TCW3 rated...hell most gas stations have it available. There is no need for a "special" premix, as long as it's TCW3 rated.

seriously guys, you should go research these topics from the old 13b motors, there are some very indepth analysis on lots of subjects that seem to be foggy around here.

kevin.