20B renesis pics!!!!!!!
03-25-2008, 09:01 AM
#51
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"Short" 3 rotor engines have been available aftermarket for a while now.
I am actually going to back up Team on his comment. While I'm sure the engine does run well, there just isn't going to be equal flow between the center rotor and the outer rotors. There can't be. It's not about port area, it's about runner flow. I'm not even talking about it being siamesed. There just isn't much runner area in each center port. More flow goes through the larger outer runners. While I have no doubt that the engine runs and probably runs well, I doubt that flow is even between all rotors. I would also surmise that the center rotor makes less power than the outer 2 as a result. It should and probably does. This isn't to say the engine can't still make 300hp. It probably does. I guarantee when the power wall gets hit, it'll be due to the center rotor breathing ability. I'm being overly picky of course but it is a valid topic to bring up.
Nevertheless I'd love to see it run. It looks cool and I've always wanted to see a 3 rotor Renesis. I personally believe the peripheral exhaust port is a thing of the past and that the future is all side port. More work needs to be done with side exhaust ports. I commend you for your efforts on this engine and I hope we see more of them.
I am actually going to back up Team on his comment. While I'm sure the engine does run well, there just isn't going to be equal flow between the center rotor and the outer rotors. There can't be. It's not about port area, it's about runner flow. I'm not even talking about it being siamesed. There just isn't much runner area in each center port. More flow goes through the larger outer runners. While I have no doubt that the engine runs and probably runs well, I doubt that flow is even between all rotors. I would also surmise that the center rotor makes less power than the outer 2 as a result. It should and probably does. This isn't to say the engine can't still make 300hp. It probably does. I guarantee when the power wall gets hit, it'll be due to the center rotor breathing ability. I'm being overly picky of course but it is a valid topic to bring up.
Nevertheless I'd love to see it run. It looks cool and I've always wanted to see a 3 rotor Renesis. I personally believe the peripheral exhaust port is a thing of the past and that the future is all side port. More work needs to be done with side exhaust ports. I commend you for your efforts on this engine and I hope we see more of them.
03-25-2008, 05:39 PM
#52
If you actually look at a center plate from an RX8 it is possible to improve the exhaust flow considerably.(We have done it)
The engine will not hit a wall because of the middle rotor I can assure you.
When we have a few more miles on it then I'll dyno it and take the revs up higher too. The engine has not reached a point where the power has fallen off yet at 7000rpm,which is it's current RPM limit due to the low mileage that it has run,it is pulling harder up there than below.
I guess time will tell.
What I really want to play with is 16X components!!!
Regards
Carl
The engine will not hit a wall because of the middle rotor I can assure you.
When we have a few more miles on it then I'll dyno it and take the revs up higher too. The engine has not reached a point where the power has fallen off yet at 7000rpm,which is it's current RPM limit due to the low mileage that it has run,it is pulling harder up there than below.
I guess time will tell.
What I really want to play with is 16X components!!!
Regards
Carl
03-25-2008, 05:43 PM
#53
We don't use other peoples components for the engines,but make the E shaft over here in England,also this shaft is similar to the 20b in that it has a tapered coupling,but just 50mm shorter,and we fit a stationary gear and main bearing into a stock center plate from the 13B.
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03-25-2008, 06:00 PM
#55
I'm certainly open-minded on the subject and always appreciate learning new things that expand my horizons beyond the current view. I look forward to following your progress and results.
MS
MS
If you actually look at a center plate from an RX8 it is possible to improve the exhaust flow considerably.(We have done it)
The engine will not hit a wall because of the middle rotor I can assure you.
When we have a few more miles on it then I'll dyno it and take the revs up higher too. The engine has not reached a point where the power has fallen off yet at 7000rpm,which is it's current RPM limit due to the low mileage that it has run,it is pulling harder up there than below.
I guess time will tell.
What I really want to play with is 16X components!!!
Regards
Carl
The engine will not hit a wall because of the middle rotor I can assure you.
When we have a few more miles on it then I'll dyno it and take the revs up higher too. The engine has not reached a point where the power has fallen off yet at 7000rpm,which is it's current RPM limit due to the low mileage that it has run,it is pulling harder up there than below.
I guess time will tell.
What I really want to play with is 16X components!!!
Regards
Carl
Last edited by TeamRX8; 03-25-2008 at 06:02 PM.
03-25-2008, 06:21 PM
#56
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Back to the center rotors exhaust,think about it for a moment,what sort of pressure is the combustion gas at when the exhaust port first opens? It is seriously higher than atmospheric,so where does that exhaust gas naturally want to go? And it does this very easily, also I have not revealed what we have done internally on the engine regarding the exhaust.
He does make a very reasonable point besides mentioning that there is no port overlap.
The VW Golf TSI has 1.4 liter engine and makes 170 HP (no tuning). Its exhaust valves and the average opening area they create during the exhaust cycle is way way smaller than the exhaust port area of the Renesis. Not to mention the port opening time in case of the rotary engine is higher too.
He does make a very reasonable point besides mentioning that there is no port overlap.
The VW Golf TSI has 1.4 liter engine and makes 170 HP (no tuning). Its exhaust valves and the average opening area they create during the exhaust cycle is way way smaller than the exhaust port area of the Renesis. Not to mention the port opening time in case of the rotary engine is higher too.
Thanks for sharing. I hope you quickly get to guru status!
03-26-2008, 02:35 PM
#60
03-26-2008, 03:21 PM
#64
03-27-2008, 02:27 AM
#66
In that vid that was the 3rd time we started the engine,the timing was a bit far advanced,but now it is tuned the engine revs easy.
Also we only took it to around 3000rpm on that vid.
the quality lacks due to using a phone.
In real life it sounds really sweet!
Regards
Carl
Also we only took it to around 3000rpm on that vid.
the quality lacks due to using a phone.
In real life it sounds really sweet!
Regards
Carl
03-27-2008, 04:19 AM
#67
Wow! If successful, start making 3 rotor engines + kit.
Would love to know what the HP and MPG are on this. I have a feeling this might be another "slap in the face" to wake Mazda up. As for Mazdaspeed... they are showing to be worthless with anything concerning the rotary.
Heaven forbid if this thing makes 350HP and manages 15-16mpg with tuning. Even more interesting is how it would compare to the 16X.
Would love to know what the HP and MPG are on this. I have a feeling this might be another "slap in the face" to wake Mazda up. As for Mazdaspeed... they are showing to be worthless with anything concerning the rotary.
Heaven forbid if this thing makes 350HP and manages 15-16mpg with tuning. Even more interesting is how it would compare to the 16X.
Last edited by sosonic; 03-27-2008 at 04:24 AM.
03-27-2008, 04:44 PM
#72
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I am actually curious about the mileage on this engine!, please don't flame me haha.
as for the 20B renny, it looks great!!! I remember we had a thread long ago discussing the possibilities of a 3-rotor renny and we all said it couldn't be done and came up with other ideas for it as well. But here you are starting and revving up a 20B renny. Good work!!
Yes, with 16X components it'll be sweet, it certainly can be a great investment, as the dimensions aren't changing. Your e-shaft should fit in the 16X as well.
anyways. i think this engine could get pretty good mpg when fitted on a lighter car (RX-7) and appropriate gearing for highway cruising. Now we have TORQUE.
________
Carie cam
as for the 20B renny, it looks great!!! I remember we had a thread long ago discussing the possibilities of a 3-rotor renny and we all said it couldn't be done and came up with other ideas for it as well. But here you are starting and revving up a 20B renny. Good work!!
Yes, with 16X components it'll be sweet, it certainly can be a great investment, as the dimensions aren't changing. Your e-shaft should fit in the 16X as well.
anyways. i think this engine could get pretty good mpg when fitted on a lighter car (RX-7) and appropriate gearing for highway cruising. Now we have TORQUE.
________
Carie cam
Last edited by Renesis_8; 09-11-2011 at 02:38 PM.
04-02-2008, 03:06 PM
#74
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I am actually curious about the mileage on this engine!, please don't flame me haha.
as for the 20B renny, it looks great!!! I remember we had a thread long ago discussing the possibilities of a 3-rotor renny and we all said it couldn't be done and came up with other ideas for it as well. But here you are starting and revving up a 20B renny. Good work!!
Yes, with 16X components it'll be sweet, it certainly can be a great investment, as the dimensions aren't changing. Your e-shaft should fit in the 16X as well.
anyways. i think this engine could get pretty good mpg when fitted on a lighter car (RX-7) and appropriate gearing for highway cruising. Now we have TORQUE.
as for the 20B renny, it looks great!!! I remember we had a thread long ago discussing the possibilities of a 3-rotor renny and we all said it couldn't be done and came up with other ideas for it as well. But here you are starting and revving up a 20B renny. Good work!!
Yes, with 16X components it'll be sweet, it certainly can be a great investment, as the dimensions aren't changing. Your e-shaft should fit in the 16X as well.
anyways. i think this engine could get pretty good mpg when fitted on a lighter car (RX-7) and appropriate gearing for highway cruising. Now we have TORQUE.
When dumping 20-30k in an engine set up, the last thing on that persons mind is gas mileage.
Especially with a rotary.
04-02-2008, 03:20 PM
#75
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[I]
The VW Golf TSI has 1.4 liter engine and makes 170 HP (no tuning). Its exhaust valves and the average opening area they create during the exhaust cycle is way way smaller than the exhaust port area of the Renesis. Not to mention the port opening time in case of the rotary engine is higher too.
The VW Golf TSI has 1.4 liter engine and makes 170 HP (no tuning). Its exhaust valves and the average opening area they create during the exhaust cycle is way way smaller than the exhaust port area of the Renesis. Not to mention the port opening time in case of the rotary engine is higher too.
It's compression ratio is also very high, and because it's boosted, the dynamic compression is even more impressive, which allows the use of smaller valves and ports on the exhaust side.
At a guess the split in the exhausts has been altered to allow more bias to flow from the centre rotor?