tdiddy

I don't think Jeff is going to abandon his customers at all!!!!

I understand why you went the direction you did and I am still using the AP myself. My problem is I can't use my car in its current state. I tried to do something custom in using the AP with a turbo kit that was designed for use with a MAP based EMS and my attempt is failing. I am looking for options to fix it but every time I find something that I think might help I find another problem. I am just getting tired of trying to come up with work arounds when I am pretty sure the Int-X will at least function.

mysql

Go with the int-x if that is what your kit works best with. Hopefully you haven't bought the int-x yet, cause they're damn cheap now.

tdiddy

No, I have not bought one yet. I'm just not one to easily give up. I think it can be done, I just don't know if I want to spend the time and money trying to do it. Maybe next winter or something.

VarneyMazda

Your going to wait all winter to get your 8 running again!!

Grouch

Just wondering if the LTFT should be locked at 0. I don't remember this happening to me before, but it seems that on my last two calibrations that I tried, my LTFT was at 0 under all conditions and never deviated from that. STFT still moves around as expected.

I am now on 3-5b and it seems that at WOT, AFR's are slightly richer than with the 3-3b (strange, isn't it?). At lower rpms though, it seems a little leaner or better than before. I still have the 'confused' idle and that feeling that I'm pumping the gas pedal rapidly when accelerating, but not as noticable as before. Is LTFT supposed to stay at 0 under all conditions? Thanks

tdiddy

Did you ever get a chance to datalog?

mysql

ltft can change while driving. it's not static.

Grouch

I haven't datalogged yet because I'm waiting on my silicone couplers which should be here within a week. I also was looking for a screen. I wanted to wait till I had these two things done before I borrowed a datalogger.

The LTFT I've seen change before which is why I think something may be wrong with my AP. The LTFT just seems 'stuck' at zero under all conditions. I wasn't sure if that was a problem or a good thing.

mysql

I don't think so. 0 is good. What's the problem?

Grouch

for some reason i thought it was a glitch or that it was 'frozen' or the thing crashed because the ltft didn't move, but I guess it's a good thing! the only problems I have now is the ones I described previously so I'm going to try out the better fitting couplers and a screen.

kenkamm

I have a few questions and haven't heard back from Jeff yet after leaving an email and voice mail. Maybe you guys can help me out.

I have the stock greddy intake system, but have installed Jeff's upgrade kit. I also have the RP cat pipe. I used to have the EMU before switching to the AP when the upgrade was installed. So I have new hardware, and new electronics. I used to have the Innovate LC-1 hooked up to the EMU, so logging AFR vs RPM vs boost was pretty easy. Now, I don't have a way of doing that, and I'm trying to figure out what is the best course of action.

After installing the AP and following Jeff's instructions (which said to drive the car gently and then look at the STFT numbers) I found the STFT to be hovering very close to zero. Sometimes as low as -4, sometimes as high as +4, but on average, hovering right around zero. I think this is a good thing but I am a novice here. The LTFT after driving around a bit more is right around -7.

Problem is, as I drove the car harder, little by little, to generate some boost, I'm seeing AFRs that are scaring me a little. I've seen numbers as high as 14:1 under 5 psi or so. This scares me, even though I don't hear any detonation thank God.

Jeff said I should be particularly careful about the AFR in the 5-7k RPM range going above 12, but I think I've seen spikes as high as 14! So right now as I see it, I can't drive the car safely.

Granted, I'm reading AFRs off the AP screen. I don't know how accurate this is, since the refresh rate on this thing is kinda slow - and under boost the car goes through the rev range pretty quickly.

Do I need to find a system that will once again let me hook up my LC-1 and log AFR vs RPM and boost? If so, what would be a cost effective way of doing that?

Thanks,
Ken

mysql

ken, the afr is not based on psi. The AP maps don't know pressure. They only know airflow. If you had 100% load, the AFR will drop. 5 psi isn't very high, 14 is possible depending on rpm and load.

it would help if you have a datalog of the runs so we can view it.

kenkamm

That's what I'm saying... I understand the AP doesn't know pressure like the EMU did.

My concern is... I was seeing AFRs in the 14s AT 5 psi.

I don't have a way to datalog anymore after getting rid of the EMU that my LC-1 was hooked up to, so I'm looking for advice on the most cost effective way of getting that functionality back, if indeed I truly need it.

Thanks,
Ken

kenkamm

Also... I have a manual boost controller right now. I've adjusted it so I can reach a max of about 8 psi. But it only reach 8 psi at around 4k rpm. Then, for each additional 1000 rpm it drops about a psi, like... 8 psi at 4k, 7 psi at 5k, 6 psi at 6k, 5 psi at 7k, 4 psi at 8k to 9k. Is that drop normal? I'd like it to hold boost out to redline better than that.

Thanks
Ken

mysql

what was the throttle position and rpm when you hit 14 afr?

I do not try to "test" in low gears at low speed ... what I do is get on the highway, and drive around 70-80 mph and ease into the throttle till it goes into boost. This way I can watch it and have time to monitor what it's doing.

mysql

greddy turbo should be able to hold a decent psi till 7k rpm, at that point it drops to ~6 psi and cannot go higher.

kenkamm

mysql, I do appreciate your help. However I don't think you are reading my posts.

I am telling you I don't have a way to log now that I don't have the EMU anymore. All I have now is the AP and a boost gauge. So I can't tell you precisely what RPM and throttle position I had when I hit 14 AFR. I can tell you it was less than full throttle and it was around 5 psi somewhere between 5k and 7k RPM. As I understand it, that indicates a problem based on what Jeff told me. Correct?

I have Jeff's upgraded turbo, not the stock greddy turbo. I'm seeing that drop (that I mentioned in my previous post) in boost as RPM rises. Does that indicate a problem or not?

mysql

You don't need to data log in order to know how much throttle you used :P

If you have jeff's turbo, it can easily push more air than your engine can handle... so you do have a problem. It could be as simple as configuring your boost controller, or something hardware wise .... I cannot tell from the limited info you've presented.

it might be helpful if you watch my video and see how my car reacts to boost (left gauge) vs afr (right):

http://youtube.com/watch?v=5YKErd6MvXE

mysql

9 o'clock is 0 psi btw

kenkamm

Well, after watching your video, I know something is wrong with mine. The AFRs I am reading from the AP screen are all over the place as RPM rises. But I don't know what to do to fix it. Hopefully Jeff will get back to me soon with some ideas. I can't tune this myself like I did with the EMU so the car has to sit, I guess.

What tools are you using to log AFR vs RPM? And what boost controller do you use?

Thanks,
Ken

mysql

what's your intake setup like?

i'm using the scanalyser right now ... greddy boost controller. aem uego wideband

Razz1

Its good to be careful.

We see the samething NA

Spikes can be attributed to load and throttle.

after data logging the spikes correlate with load and throttle. So when you see 14
your load dropped or throttle or both.

I assume this is what you are seeing. Especially with the AP lag. By the time you read 14 your backed off the throttle. It doesn't take much.

I bet your alright. You just need to data log to confirm.

kenkamm

Using the greddy turbo kit supplied filter and intake. I hear that may not be the best thing for the AP, but I didn't know that when I bough the AP of course.

Is your boost controller manual or electronic?

slavearm

Something to consider... the AP log is somewhat delayed... just keep that in mind when using it to monitor AFRs.

mysql

yeah, it's not ideal, but should run too rich in boost.

my mod list is in my sig.