Syncro Saver Customer Feedback
save your synchros?
03-31-2009, 05:57 PM
#27
Registered
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: May 2003
Location: PA
Posts: 3,754
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I suggest you read on how a synchro gets wear in the first place - Its from a) doing its job and )synchronizing shaft speeds in your tranny going from one gear to another, or b) from abnormal wear and not having full engagement.
I'd really reallly realllly love to hear how you over engage a synchro and how that mythical thing can cause wear to it...
I'd really reallly realllly love to hear how you over engage a synchro and how that mythical thing can cause wear to it...
Last edited by r0tor; 03-31-2009 at 06:00 PM.
03-31-2009, 06:11 PM
#28
i was answering a question. i suggest you learn to follow a discussion.
i.e., i didn't take stance on the issue. i merely read the name "sychrosavers" and suggested in response to you that those who have them believe the sychrosaver saves sychros.
i understand you have a different opinion. that's interesting.
i.e., i didn't take stance on the issue. i merely read the name "sychrosavers" and suggested in response to you that those who have them believe the sychrosaver saves sychros.
i understand you have a different opinion. that's interesting.
Last edited by myriadshalaks; 03-31-2009 at 06:14 PM.
03-31-2009, 07:43 PM
#31
Registered
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: San Antonio --> San Diego
Posts: 872
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I know nothing of transmissions, but I was kinda wondering the same thing r0tor is talking about... I just assumed it was my lack of knowledge of transmissions and it's guts... I'm glad he brought up this question.
03-31-2009, 08:01 PM
#32
Well any good trans shop will replace all of the synchros as standard in any manual trans rebuild, so in the sense this will help minimize trans blow ups it will then also save the synchros .... 
ask me how I know about Rx-8 trans failures
ask me how I know about Rx-8 trans failures
04-01-2009, 06:26 AM
#34
If it's a thousands of an inch clearance inside the transmission how do we know that this will do exactly the right thing for our car? There's a different clearance on these parts from car to car also around the shifter itself.
Gotta agree with r0tor and wait for an explanation.
Gotta agree with r0tor and wait for an explanation.
04-01-2009, 06:42 AM
#35
Registered
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: May 2003
Location: PA
Posts: 3,754
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
If it's a thousands of an inch clearance inside the transmission how do we know that this will do exactly the right thing for our car? There's a different clearance on these parts from car to car also around the shifter itself.
Gotta agree with r0tor and wait for an explanation.
Gotta agree with r0tor and wait for an explanation.
The clearance of any good gear set is measured inthe thousands of an inch. Movement of the gears in the tranny is controlled to tolerances in the thousands of an inch.
... However, the slop in the shifter mechanism is 200x more then that a thousandths of an inch...
04-01-2009, 08:33 AM
#36
His 8
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Leander, Tx
Posts: 381
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
A little bit more info on why syncros fail. Just a post from another board somewhere:
Originally Posted by Terry Haines
Why do syncros wear out?
The syncro is a mini-cone clutch. as you change up the gears it starts to engage with the next gear you are going into before the 'cogs' mate....for example say you are in 2nd gear and second gear is spinning at 4000 rpm and you want to shift without a 'crunch'...the syncro on 3rd gear has to spin up 3rd gear to 4000rpm also to 'syncronise' the gear speeds...it does this with the cone clutch 'blocker rings' all in the space of time it takes to move the stick out of 2nd and towards 3rd....it works damn hard
why does it wear?
if you go over the normal revs for a gear and the engine speed is higher the syncro has to work harder to speed up the next gear. in the same time it wears more in this situation.
OK but what about downshift?
Same rule applies, if you are in 5th at 3000rpm and want to shift to a lower gear the syncro has to do the same job in reverse on 4th gear....unless you can 'double de-clutch' on down shifts,in which case YOU are setting the speed of the next lower gear to syncronise the 'cogs' without a crunch...saves a lot of sycro wear if you can double de-clutch'.
Why do the diffs fail?
The V6 is a bit over on power for the MTX75 trans. for example diff components are the same for an MTX in a Zetec as they are in a V6!..as its an 'open' diff the planet and side gears take a lot of 'shock' loads in say wheelspin and 'wheel hop' situations and can break very easy or worse send the gears or parts of the diff thru the gear casing...best cure is to have a Quaife or Torsen diff fitted.
Why did my gears jam or get stuck in one gear?
On the cable shift boxes prior to 2000 the 'tower' on top of the trans was/is prone to 'jumping the gate' and not pulling one gear out of engagement before trying to select another,this causes the 'jammed in gear' problem.
Total loss of all gears is usually a pinch bolt that holds the main vertical selector shaft to the selector arm. it breaks off and all gears are lost...worse case is it breaks off and the bolt head drops into the trans, gets wedged between a gear and the ally case and is punched thru the case!...
So whats the fix?...Fit either a better designed post 2000 Contour or Focus tower assy......
'How much will the parts be to repair my bad syncro?????
Depends how many 'parts' of the sycro are shot and which gear.Blocker rings (the 'brass') is the first parts that wear out,as can the syncro hub itself.Some
gears have a combined 'blocker' assy,that is two blockers for each gear Vs one on some of the other gears.Between the double blocker gears is a steel cone...just a tapered ring of steel...it wears aswell but not as much as 'the brass'...cost of just the 'cone'...over $45....that is just one piece of many that makes up the syncro assy's.....Just a thought when you 'power shifting'....better wrap the gear stick with $100 bills!...
Originally Posted by Terry Haines
Why do syncros wear out?
The syncro is a mini-cone clutch. as you change up the gears it starts to engage with the next gear you are going into before the 'cogs' mate....for example say you are in 2nd gear and second gear is spinning at 4000 rpm and you want to shift without a 'crunch'...the syncro on 3rd gear has to spin up 3rd gear to 4000rpm also to 'syncronise' the gear speeds...it does this with the cone clutch 'blocker rings' all in the space of time it takes to move the stick out of 2nd and towards 3rd....it works damn hard
why does it wear?
if you go over the normal revs for a gear and the engine speed is higher the syncro has to work harder to speed up the next gear. in the same time it wears more in this situation.
OK but what about downshift?
Same rule applies, if you are in 5th at 3000rpm and want to shift to a lower gear the syncro has to do the same job in reverse on 4th gear....unless you can 'double de-clutch' on down shifts,in which case YOU are setting the speed of the next lower gear to syncronise the 'cogs' without a crunch...saves a lot of sycro wear if you can double de-clutch'.
Why do the diffs fail?
The V6 is a bit over on power for the MTX75 trans. for example diff components are the same for an MTX in a Zetec as they are in a V6!..as its an 'open' diff the planet and side gears take a lot of 'shock' loads in say wheelspin and 'wheel hop' situations and can break very easy or worse send the gears or parts of the diff thru the gear casing...best cure is to have a Quaife or Torsen diff fitted.
Why did my gears jam or get stuck in one gear?
On the cable shift boxes prior to 2000 the 'tower' on top of the trans was/is prone to 'jumping the gate' and not pulling one gear out of engagement before trying to select another,this causes the 'jammed in gear' problem.
Total loss of all gears is usually a pinch bolt that holds the main vertical selector shaft to the selector arm. it breaks off and all gears are lost...worse case is it breaks off and the bolt head drops into the trans, gets wedged between a gear and the ally case and is punched thru the case!...
So whats the fix?...Fit either a better designed post 2000 Contour or Focus tower assy......
'How much will the parts be to repair my bad syncro?????
Depends how many 'parts' of the sycro are shot and which gear.Blocker rings (the 'brass') is the first parts that wear out,as can the syncro hub itself.Some
gears have a combined 'blocker' assy,that is two blockers for each gear Vs one on some of the other gears.Between the double blocker gears is a steel cone...just a tapered ring of steel...it wears aswell but not as much as 'the brass'...cost of just the 'cone'...over $45....that is just one piece of many that makes up the syncro assy's.....Just a thought when you 'power shifting'....better wrap the gear stick with $100 bills!...
04-01-2009, 09:14 AM
#37
That's why syncros wear, but it's not why we should worry about syncro wear in the gear shift itself. Do people in general slam the gearshifter through the cubbybox or what? :P
I have a feeling the positive feedback here is all due to the added feedback of the shifter stopping "harder". If it actually makes a difference internally I have not found out.
I have a feeling the positive feedback here is all due to the added feedback of the shifter stopping "harder". If it actually makes a difference internally I have not found out.
04-01-2009, 02:00 PM
#38
His 8
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Leander, Tx
Posts: 381
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
That's why syncros wear, but it's not why we should worry about syncro wear in the gear shift itself. Do people in general slam the gearshifter through the cubbybox or what? :P
I have a feeling the positive feedback here is all due to the added feedback of the shifter stopping "harder". If it actually makes a difference internally I have not found out.
I have a feeling the positive feedback here is all due to the added feedback of the shifter stopping "harder". If it actually makes a difference internally I have not found out.
04-01-2009, 07:17 PM
#39
To clear up the confusion here,
This product stops the driver from forcing the shift lever past the point where the transmission is already in gear. During overshifting the synchronizer is forced farther on the hub than required for proper operation. This actually attempts to stretch the synchronizer cone over the hub which can distort the soft synchronizer changing the clearances and eventually may cause the synchronizer to actually break. Over shifting has caused synchronizer problems in transmissions for years, not just in Mazda automobiles but across a wide range of vehicles. If you look at many aftermarket shifters (for domestic vehicles) this is why they have shifter stops incorporated into them.
BTW, this product was referred to as a “shift gate” which it is clearly not and is designed for a different purpose.
This product stops the driver from forcing the shift lever past the point where the transmission is already in gear. During overshifting the synchronizer is forced farther on the hub than required for proper operation. This actually attempts to stretch the synchronizer cone over the hub which can distort the soft synchronizer changing the clearances and eventually may cause the synchronizer to actually break. Over shifting has caused synchronizer problems in transmissions for years, not just in Mazda automobiles but across a wide range of vehicles. If you look at many aftermarket shifters (for domestic vehicles) this is why they have shifter stops incorporated into them.
BTW, this product was referred to as a “shift gate” which it is clearly not and is designed for a different purpose.
04-01-2009, 08:28 PM
#43
04-01-2009, 08:48 PM
#44
White is purdy...
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Jersey Shore
Posts: 656
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
04-01-2009, 10:45 PM
#47
His 8
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Leander, Tx
Posts: 381
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I'm thinking if you already have a SS, you probably wouldn't need this thing. I just installed my AxialFlow last night...that thing is very tight and precise. It's not moving any further. I might try to sell mine.
04-01-2009, 10:46 PM
#48
