OBX RX8 Header
02-19-2008, 01:48 AM
#426
the shit starter
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I have the OBX header... Let me say, I started on my car thinking this:
"I'm going to go all N/A, and somehow be satisfied at the end"
In the end with an RB "race flash" and a bottle of nitrous, I think the only good exhaust manifold worth thinking about is one leading to a turbo...
...the point is, save you money...
"I'm going to go all N/A, and somehow be satisfied at the end"
In the end with an RB "race flash" and a bottle of nitrous, I think the only good exhaust manifold worth thinking about is one leading to a turbo...
...the point is, save you money...
02-19-2008, 02:46 PM
#428
I don't buy Kool-Aid
So the OBX header almost the same weight as stock, maybe save 2 to 3 pounds (14.4 pounds?). Not much savings there.
In comparison the R-magic header weighs 11 pounds vs 16.75 pounds for the stock weight, but that is not that much either, and its very expensive (around $1,000 dollars). Knight Sports header weighs 15 pounds, but has 4 pipes instead of 3. However HP result seems to be the same at around 5HP and it costs $1,000 dollars +
Nobody has clearly indicated a performance increase for the OBX. Maybe it will give 5 HP?
Any owners that have the OBX header and have not modified it in some weird way, what do you think of it? Any O2 sensor related problems?
Is it worth it?
In comparison the R-magic header weighs 11 pounds vs 16.75 pounds for the stock weight, but that is not that much either, and its very expensive (around $1,000 dollars). Knight Sports header weighs 15 pounds, but has 4 pipes instead of 3. However HP result seems to be the same at around 5HP and it costs $1,000 dollars +
Nobody has clearly indicated a performance increase for the OBX. Maybe it will give 5 HP?
Any owners that have the OBX header and have not modified it in some weird way, what do you think of it? Any O2 sensor related problems?
Is it worth it?
Thing is no one is ballzy to spend all that money on the parts and feel the performance. Trust me its there you just have to buy the parts. Most guys just buy one thing and expect to get a good hp gain. Not happening. You must use fusion when moding.
02-19-2008, 05:05 PM
#429
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Its not just about the header(s). Its about the right combo set up, Intake, Exhaust, Pulley and Header.
Thing is no one is ballzy to spend all that money on the parts and feel the performance. Trust me its there you just have to buy the parts. Most guys just buy one thing and expect to get a good hp gain. Not happening. You must use fusion when moding.
Thing is no one is ballzy to spend all that money on the parts and feel the performance. Trust me its there you just have to buy the parts. Most guys just buy one thing and expect to get a good hp gain. Not happening. You must use fusion when moding.
02-19-2008, 07:03 PM
#430
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The problem with that logic is that let's say you install just a test pipe and pick up 7 hp. Let's say you install only a muffler and pick up 3. Yes you put the cat back on first! Then let's say you reinstall everything back to stock but now install a header and pick up 4 hp. The problem is that if you install all of these things, you won't pick up the sum of the parts. You won't pick up 14 hp. You might gain 7 or 8 which isn't really any more than the max you picked up with the best mod. Gains just aren't cumulative even though logic would say they are.
I remember going to a Barnes and Noble and was flipping through a book in the automotive section. 2 ricers were looking at a book. One kid who I'm going to call the "dumber kid" was asking his apparently knowledgable friend what kinds of gains he could expect on his Civic. Yes it was a Civic. The "less dumb" kid (maybe that's not quite accurate?) drove a Cavalier that was "modded". LDK proceeded to tell DK that he could expect about 10 hp from an intake, 3 from an exhaust tip (Seriously! I can't make this **** up!), 5 from a muffler, 10 from a header, and so forth and so on. You get the idea of where he was going. At the end they added all of these gains up cumulatively and came up with something ridiculous like a 40+ hp gain from bolt ons. On a Civic! DK was ecstatic and LDK held his head high because he was smart and knew his stuff!
Anyone that know's me knows that I couldn't help myself. I didn't shout bs but I did give a chuckle which got their attention. They immediately got defensive and asked me what I drove. I told them an RX-7. The next question back is ALWAYS, "is it a turbo?". This is the #1 question people ask when they say they drive an RX-7. I told them no it's an '84 model. I don't even think that these kids were alive back then. They laughed and said my car was slow. I just chuckled back and gave them a typical RG technical answer. It was a total deer in the headlights moment. A look of ultimate stupidity that was so priceless and empty that it could easily have won these kids the Nobel Peace Prize last year. They basically ignored what I said and went back to the whole no turbo and it's a 1.3L remarks and left feeling superior. I let it go but it was still funny. I turned down their offer to race me and of course it meant that I knew I'd lose. I actually just didn't want some idiot street racer to kill someone.
Don't associate yourself with immature riceballs. Please don't think gains are cumulative like this. They aren't.
I remember going to a Barnes and Noble and was flipping through a book in the automotive section. 2 ricers were looking at a book. One kid who I'm going to call the "dumber kid" was asking his apparently knowledgable friend what kinds of gains he could expect on his Civic. Yes it was a Civic. The "less dumb" kid (maybe that's not quite accurate?) drove a Cavalier that was "modded". LDK proceeded to tell DK that he could expect about 10 hp from an intake, 3 from an exhaust tip (Seriously! I can't make this **** up!), 5 from a muffler, 10 from a header, and so forth and so on. You get the idea of where he was going. At the end they added all of these gains up cumulatively and came up with something ridiculous like a 40+ hp gain from bolt ons. On a Civic! DK was ecstatic and LDK held his head high because he was smart and knew his stuff!
Anyone that know's me knows that I couldn't help myself. I didn't shout bs but I did give a chuckle which got their attention. They immediately got defensive and asked me what I drove. I told them an RX-7. The next question back is ALWAYS, "is it a turbo?". This is the #1 question people ask when they say they drive an RX-7. I told them no it's an '84 model. I don't even think that these kids were alive back then. They laughed and said my car was slow. I just chuckled back and gave them a typical RG technical answer. It was a total deer in the headlights moment. A look of ultimate stupidity that was so priceless and empty that it could easily have won these kids the Nobel Peace Prize last year. They basically ignored what I said and went back to the whole no turbo and it's a 1.3L remarks and left feeling superior. I let it go but it was still funny. I turned down their offer to race me and of course it meant that I knew I'd lose. I actually just didn't want some idiot street racer to kill someone.
Don't associate yourself with immature riceballs. Please don't think gains are cumulative like this. They aren't.
02-19-2008, 08:01 PM
#431
I agree that 5 HP here + 5 HP there + 10 HP over there will not necessarily equal 20 HP gained.
It's more about looking at overall performance enhancement. The biggest obviously being FI and tuning.
There is debate about the effects of a good header in supercharger applications and with tuning.
Obviously in NA applications the HP gain would be small, but if we are talking low cost and maybe some weight savings, than that is not necessarily a bad thing.
It's more about looking at overall performance enhancement. The biggest obviously being FI and tuning.
There is debate about the effects of a good header in supercharger applications and with tuning.
Obviously in NA applications the HP gain would be small, but if we are talking low cost and maybe some weight savings, than that is not necessarily a bad thing.
02-19-2008, 08:44 PM
#432
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I agree that 5 HP here + 5 HP there + 10 HP over there will not necessarily equal 20 HP gained.
It's more about looking at overall performance enhancement. The biggest obviously being FI and tuning.
There is debate about the effects of a good header in supercharger applications and with tuning.
Obviously in NA applications the HP gain would be small, but if we are talking low cost and maybe some weight savings, than that is not necessarily a bad thing.
It's more about looking at overall performance enhancement. The biggest obviously being FI and tuning.
There is debate about the effects of a good header in supercharger applications and with tuning.
Obviously in NA applications the HP gain would be small, but if we are talking low cost and maybe some weight savings, than that is not necessarily a bad thing.
02-19-2008, 09:18 PM
#433
02-19-2008, 10:17 PM
#434
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The problem with that logic is that let's say you install just a test pipe and pick up 7 hp. Let's say you install only a muffler and pick up 3. Yes you put the cat back on first! Then let's say you reinstall everything back to stock but now install a header and pick up 4 hp. The problem is that if you install all of these things, you won't pick up the sum of the parts. You won't pick up 14 hp. You might gain 7 or 8 which isn't really any more than the max you picked up with the best mod. Gains just aren't cumulative even though logic would say they are.
I remember going to a Barnes and Noble and was flipping through a book in the automotive section. 2 ricers were looking at a book. One kid who I'm going to call the "dumber kid" was asking his apparently knowledgable friend what kinds of gains he could expect on his Civic. Yes it was a Civic. The "less dumb" kid (maybe that's not quite accurate?) drove a Cavalier that was "modded". LDK proceeded to tell DK that he could expect about 10 hp from an intake, 3 from an exhaust tip (Seriously! I can't make this **** up!), 5 from a muffler, 10 from a header, and so forth and so on. You get the idea of where he was going. At the end they added all of these gains up cumulatively and came up with something ridiculous like a 40+ hp gain from bolt ons. On a Civic! DK was ecstatic and LDK held his head high because he was smart and knew his stuff!
Anyone that know's me knows that I couldn't help myself. I didn't shout bs but I did give a chuckle which got their attention. They immediately got defensive and asked me what I drove. I told them an RX-7. The next question back is ALWAYS, "is it a turbo?". This is the #1 question people ask when they say they drive an RX-7. I told them no it's an '84 model. I don't even think that these kids were alive back then. They laughed and said my car was slow. I just chuckled back and gave them a typical RG technical answer. It was a total deer in the headlights moment. A look of ultimate stupidity that was so priceless and empty that it could easily have won these kids the Nobel Peace Prize last year. They basically ignored what I said and went back to the whole no turbo and it's a 1.3L remarks and left feeling superior. I let it go but it was still funny. I turned down their offer to race me and of course it meant that I knew I'd lose. I actually just didn't want some idiot street racer to kill someone.
Don't associate yourself with immature riceballs. Please don't think gains are cumulative like this. They aren't.
I remember going to a Barnes and Noble and was flipping through a book in the automotive section. 2 ricers were looking at a book. One kid who I'm going to call the "dumber kid" was asking his apparently knowledgable friend what kinds of gains he could expect on his Civic. Yes it was a Civic. The "less dumb" kid (maybe that's not quite accurate?) drove a Cavalier that was "modded". LDK proceeded to tell DK that he could expect about 10 hp from an intake, 3 from an exhaust tip (Seriously! I can't make this **** up!), 5 from a muffler, 10 from a header, and so forth and so on. You get the idea of where he was going. At the end they added all of these gains up cumulatively and came up with something ridiculous like a 40+ hp gain from bolt ons. On a Civic! DK was ecstatic and LDK held his head high because he was smart and knew his stuff!
Anyone that know's me knows that I couldn't help myself. I didn't shout bs but I did give a chuckle which got their attention. They immediately got defensive and asked me what I drove. I told them an RX-7. The next question back is ALWAYS, "is it a turbo?". This is the #1 question people ask when they say they drive an RX-7. I told them no it's an '84 model. I don't even think that these kids were alive back then. They laughed and said my car was slow. I just chuckled back and gave them a typical RG technical answer. It was a total deer in the headlights moment. A look of ultimate stupidity that was so priceless and empty that it could easily have won these kids the Nobel Peace Prize last year. They basically ignored what I said and went back to the whole no turbo and it's a 1.3L remarks and left feeling superior. I let it go but it was still funny. I turned down their offer to race me and of course it meant that I knew I'd lose. I actually just didn't want some idiot street racer to kill someone.
Don't associate yourself with immature riceballs. Please don't think gains are cumulative like this. They aren't.
Last edited by Mikeluvs8; 02-19-2008 at 10:24 PM.
02-20-2008, 12:26 AM
#437
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im sure he's a good guy and im sure that everyone appreciates him helping fellow members, i have no prob with him but this one i got to disagree, i've seen different setups put out different #'s from other setups some made more power others made less power, and i've seen this through experience.
02-20-2008, 12:43 AM
#438
I don't buy Kool-Aid
The problem with that logic is that let's say you install just a test pipe and pick up 7 hp. Let's say you install only a muffler and pick up 3. Yes you put the cat back on first! Then let's say you reinstall everything back to stock but now install a header and pick up 4 hp. The problem is that if you install all of these things, you won't pick up the sum of the parts. You won't pick up 14 hp. You might gain 7 or 8 which isn't really any more than the max you picked up with the best mod. Gains just aren't cumulative even though logic would say they are.
I remember going to a Barnes and Noble and was flipping through a book in the automotive section. 2 ricers were looking at a book. One kid who I'm going to call the "dumber kid" was asking his apparently knowledgable friend what kinds of gains he could expect on his Civic. Yes it was a Civic. The "less dumb" kid (maybe that's not quite accurate?) drove a Cavalier that was "modded". LDK proceeded to tell DK that he could expect about 10 hp from an intake, 3 from an exhaust tip (Seriously! I can't make this **** up!), 5 from a muffler, 10 from a header, and so forth and so on. You get the idea of where he was going. At the end they added all of these gains up cumulatively and came up with something ridiculous like a 40+ hp gain from bolt ons. On a Civic! DK was ecstatic and LDK held his head high because he was smart and knew his stuff!
Anyone that know's me knows that I couldn't help myself. I didn't shout bs but I did give a chuckle which got their attention. They immediately got defensive and asked me what I drove. I told them an RX-7. The next question back is ALWAYS, "is it a turbo?". This is the #1 question people ask when they say they drive an RX-7. I told them no it's an '84 model. I don't even think that these kids were alive back then. They laughed and said my car was slow. I just chuckled back and gave them a typical RG technical answer. It was a total deer in the headlights moment. A look of ultimate stupidity that was so priceless and empty that it could easily have won these kids the Nobel Peace Prize last year. They basically ignored what I said and went back to the whole no turbo and it's a 1.3L remarks and left feeling superior. I let it go but it was still funny. I turned down their offer to race me and of course it meant that I knew I'd lose. I actually just didn't want some idiot street racer to kill someone.
Don't associate yourself with immature riceballs. Please don't think gains are cumulative like this. They aren't.
I remember going to a Barnes and Noble and was flipping through a book in the automotive section. 2 ricers were looking at a book. One kid who I'm going to call the "dumber kid" was asking his apparently knowledgable friend what kinds of gains he could expect on his Civic. Yes it was a Civic. The "less dumb" kid (maybe that's not quite accurate?) drove a Cavalier that was "modded". LDK proceeded to tell DK that he could expect about 10 hp from an intake, 3 from an exhaust tip (Seriously! I can't make this **** up!), 5 from a muffler, 10 from a header, and so forth and so on. You get the idea of where he was going. At the end they added all of these gains up cumulatively and came up with something ridiculous like a 40+ hp gain from bolt ons. On a Civic! DK was ecstatic and LDK held his head high because he was smart and knew his stuff!
Anyone that know's me knows that I couldn't help myself. I didn't shout bs but I did give a chuckle which got their attention. They immediately got defensive and asked me what I drove. I told them an RX-7. The next question back is ALWAYS, "is it a turbo?". This is the #1 question people ask when they say they drive an RX-7. I told them no it's an '84 model. I don't even think that these kids were alive back then. They laughed and said my car was slow. I just chuckled back and gave them a typical RG technical answer. It was a total deer in the headlights moment. A look of ultimate stupidity that was so priceless and empty that it could easily have won these kids the Nobel Peace Prize last year. They basically ignored what I said and went back to the whole no turbo and it's a 1.3L remarks and left feeling superior. I let it go but it was still funny. I turned down their offer to race me and of course it meant that I knew I'd lose. I actually just didn't want some idiot street racer to kill someone.
Don't associate yourself with immature riceballs. Please don't think gains are cumulative like this. They aren't.
.But hey, I did got to go for a ride in my friends MT 8 when it was bone stock. Then I got to go for a ride in his MT 8 when he had all his mods. I can tell you this. His 8 is faster then any other N/A MT 8 in Vegas
02-20-2008, 04:49 AM
#440
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I belong to one other forum besides this one and it concerns Swiss watches, which I happen to collect.
It's time to spend more time on that forum because of these kind of posts.
It's time to spend more time on that forum because of these kind of posts.
02-20-2008, 07:49 AM
#441
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Guys, I don't know what started this, but stop the pissing match, and go read the TOS you agreed to when you signed up. I can't find any possible reason for anyone to be so completely antagonistic towards RotaryGod, and per forum rules, I should ban everyone involved. Consider this a final warning.
02-20-2008, 08:17 AM
#442
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Guys, I don't know what started this, but stop the pissing match, and go read the TOS you agreed to when you signed up. I can't find any possible reason for anyone to be so completely antagonistic towards RotaryGod, and per forum rules, I should ban everyone involved. Consider this a final warning.
im sorry i think i have rx8 forum Tourette syndrome
02-20-2008, 08:24 AM
#443
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Guys, I don't know what started this, but stop the pissing match, and go read the TOS you agreed to when you signed up. I can't find any possible reason for anyone to be so completely antagonistic towards RotaryGod, and per forum rules, I should ban everyone involved. Consider this a final warning.
is this gonna be a temporary or permanent ban? i'm just wondering because i'm gonna have to come up with a new name!!! that would really suck and can you ban that other dude from NY too if you ban me?
Last edited by 07BB08; 02-20-2008 at 08:29 AM.
02-20-2008, 10:43 AM
#447
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wow this thread degenerated so quickly. RG has a really good point. Ricer math where things add up like that ALMOST always doesn't work that way. Sometimes there is synergy with add on parts and sometimes there isn't. The 8 doesn't seem to have this type off synergy at least not on the same level as the 350Z. If one installs an intake and get 3 hp and installs a header(after putting back the intake) and gets 3 hp when they install both they arne't going to get 6hp. They'll be lucky to get 5. At least on this car.
02-20-2008, 11:11 AM
#448
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Wow! What the hell happened with this thread? Thanks to those who stuck up for me but against people like that, I just let them go. That guy was probably at Barnes and Noble that night!
Let me clarify about what I said to those who want to show some Nissan videos and crap like that. I never said that multiple mods won't give multiple gains that add up on top of each other. What I did say is that if you gain every single one of them independently on their own to see what gains you get, adding them up for a cumulative total will not be the same as actually installing all of them at once and going to the dyno. See the issue? Gains are not cumulative based on the max gain of them independently. This has been more than proven multiple times. I don't need to waste my time going to a dyno to prove this.
This does not mean that you can't get 30 hp gains from bolt on's. It really depends on the engine. Different engines repsond differently to mods than others. The youtube video quite frankly is irrelevant when it comes to this thread as it's obvious that engine is highly choked from the factory. 2nd gen n/a RX-7's could get 30+ rwhp gains from exhaust alone for the same reason. However if you installed an intake and got 5 more hp out of it in addition to the exhaust gains it doesn't mean that the intake would have given you 5 hp with the stock exhaust. It wouldn't. You've changed the rules with overlap. The Renesis has none. Gains don't work the same. Even still gains are never cumulative based on the sum of the individual gains. This would mean that stickers add too!
Let me clarify about what I said to those who want to show some Nissan videos and crap like that. I never said that multiple mods won't give multiple gains that add up on top of each other. What I did say is that if you gain every single one of them independently on their own to see what gains you get, adding them up for a cumulative total will not be the same as actually installing all of them at once and going to the dyno. See the issue? Gains are not cumulative based on the max gain of them independently. This has been more than proven multiple times. I don't need to waste my time going to a dyno to prove this.
This does not mean that you can't get 30 hp gains from bolt on's. It really depends on the engine. Different engines repsond differently to mods than others. The youtube video quite frankly is irrelevant when it comes to this thread as it's obvious that engine is highly choked from the factory. 2nd gen n/a RX-7's could get 30+ rwhp gains from exhaust alone for the same reason. However if you installed an intake and got 5 more hp out of it in addition to the exhaust gains it doesn't mean that the intake would have given you 5 hp with the stock exhaust. It wouldn't. You've changed the rules with overlap. The Renesis has none. Gains don't work the same. Even still gains are never cumulative based on the sum of the individual gains. This would mean that stickers add too!
02-20-2008, 12:15 PM
#450
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Wow! What the hell happened with this thread? Thanks to those who stuck up for me but against people like that, I just let them go. That guy was probably at Barnes and Noble that night!
Let me clarify about what I said to those who want to show some Nissan videos and crap like that. I never said that multiple mods won't give multiple gains that add up on top of each other. What I did say is that if you gain every single one of them independently on their own to see what gains you get, adding them up for a cumulative total will not be the same as actually installing all of them at once and going to the dyno. See the issue? Gains are not cumulative based on the max gain of them independently. This has been more than proven multiple times. I don't need to waste my time going to a dyno to prove this.
This does not mean that you can't get 30 hp gains from bolt on's. It really depends on the engine. Different engines repsond differently to mods than others. The youtube video quite frankly is irrelevant when it comes to this thread as it's obvious that engine is highly choked from the factory. 2nd gen n/a RX-7's could get 30+ rwhp gains from exhaust alone for the same reason. However if you installed an intake and got 5 more hp out of it in addition to the exhaust gains it doesn't mean that the intake would have given you 5 hp with the stock exhaust. It wouldn't. You've changed the rules with overlap. The Renesis has none. Gains don't work the same. Even still gains are never cumulative based on the sum of the individual gains. This would mean that stickers add too!
Let me clarify about what I said to those who want to show some Nissan videos and crap like that. I never said that multiple mods won't give multiple gains that add up on top of each other. What I did say is that if you gain every single one of them independently on their own to see what gains you get, adding them up for a cumulative total will not be the same as actually installing all of them at once and going to the dyno. See the issue? Gains are not cumulative based on the max gain of them independently. This has been more than proven multiple times. I don't need to waste my time going to a dyno to prove this.
This does not mean that you can't get 30 hp gains from bolt on's. It really depends on the engine. Different engines repsond differently to mods than others. The youtube video quite frankly is irrelevant when it comes to this thread as it's obvious that engine is highly choked from the factory. 2nd gen n/a RX-7's could get 30+ rwhp gains from exhaust alone for the same reason. However if you installed an intake and got 5 more hp out of it in addition to the exhaust gains it doesn't mean that the intake would have given you 5 hp with the stock exhaust. It wouldn't. You've changed the rules with overlap. The Renesis has none. Gains don't work the same. Even still gains are never cumulative based on the sum of the individual gains. This would mean that stickers add too!