The STX thread!
04-08-2012, 04:47 PM
#2426
it's all relative, but people always like to play it out as a positive relative rather than the reality that it can just as well be in the other direction, being faster than the slow people is not necessarily the same as being fast in the overall scheme of what fast is
so don't take it personal, the PAX fantasy is one of my biggest nits
so don't take it personal, the PAX fantasy is one of my biggest nits
04-08-2012, 11:28 PM
#2427
maybe that's why I run 8" Hyperco at all four corners, maybe ....
and real race cars don't have preload, my car is very low and I don't have any issues with rubbing the liners using the typical STX tire sizes so it sounds like you have the JDM setup that lets you lower the car separate of of the spring which is probably why the issue is present
and real race cars don't have preload, my car is very low and I don't have any issues with rubbing the liners using the typical STX tire sizes so it sounds like you have the JDM setup that lets you lower the car separate of of the spring which is probably why the issue is present
Had a few springs laying around and had an opportunity to test them on a Roehrig dyno. Key things learned...springs tested were not linear when pushed to their maximum travel ratings and manufacturer provided maximum travel ratings are not necessarily accurate.
For reference, the Eibachs are 600lb 7" x 2.5" and are listed to have 3.78" of travel. Unfortunately I was looking forward to trying them on the car but they don't seem to be option. Estimating the front spring to compress 1.56" when the car is on the ground it only offers approximately .75" to 1" of usable travel in compression. All other springs were 7" except the Hyperco which was just sitting around and looked to be a 8" x 2.25" spring.
Additional info found and per Eibach's literature: "All Eibach motorsport springs are tested between 20% and 70% of the spring’s total travel." Based on this and the results you should count on having about 50% of their rated travel to work with.
For reference, the Eibachs are 600lb 7" x 2.5" and are listed to have 3.78" of travel. Unfortunately I was looking forward to trying them on the car but they don't seem to be option. Estimating the front spring to compress 1.56" when the car is on the ground it only offers approximately .75" to 1" of usable travel in compression. All other springs were 7" except the Hyperco which was just sitting around and looked to be a 8" x 2.25" spring.
Additional info found and per Eibach's literature: "All Eibach motorsport springs are tested between 20% and 70% of the spring’s total travel." Based on this and the results you should count on having about 50% of their rated travel to work with.
Last edited by TeamRX8; 04-09-2012 at 07:13 AM.
04-09-2012, 01:37 AM
#2430
it's all relative, but people always like to play it out as a positive relative rather than the reality that it can just as well be in the other direction, being faster than the slow people is not necessarily the same as being fast in the overall scheme of what fast is
so don't take it personal, the PAX fantasy is one of my biggest nits
so don't take it personal, the PAX fantasy is one of my biggest nits
In the end PAX is like any other class - you have to ask who else is registered.
Last edited by GeorgeH; 04-09-2012 at 01:39 AM.
04-09-2012, 06:56 AM
#2431
Not really, that is just an assumption like any other. Not to mention that your performance at any particular event or event series is no guarantee of future performance; either yours or theirs, particulary against your own direct competitors who aren't present. Maybe you figured something out here that you miss somewhere else, or you run certain types of courses locally that are not anything like you will see else where, vehicle setup for a particular surface as compared to others, etc.
This is without getting into the whole magic number generating process which is not entirely objective to boot. The STX factor as compared to STC (formerly ST) is a perfect example. When did the best current STX car ever beat the best current ST car? The only real answer is the person making that number thinks the class is soft compared to car prep and/or driver skill or maybe even refuses to accept that the results are what they are.
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This is without getting into the whole magic number generating process which is not entirely objective to boot. The STX factor as compared to STC (formerly ST) is a perfect example. When did the best current STX car ever beat the best current ST car? The only real answer is the person making that number thinks the class is soft compared to car prep and/or driver skill or maybe even refuses to accept that the results are what they are.
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Last edited by TeamRX8; 04-09-2012 at 07:17 AM.
04-09-2012, 08:53 AM
#2432
Yes it is far from exact - particularly the magic number business - but if you can't place within 1 pax second (or thereabouts) consistently of the likes of Jenkins/Deitz/Bauer at a lot like Packwood its going to be a battle to rise above a lower trophy spot at nats in my experience.
Of course, as you say, you still have to make sure your car can perform on concrete, and that you can perform two days in a row under the pressure of nats. There are no guarantees. But I know I have to be in the hunt for a top spot in my local PAX classes if I expect to have a shot at the same nationally. And I also know that competing with these guys has made me a faster driver, magic number and all.
Of course, as you say, you still have to make sure your car can perform on concrete, and that you can perform two days in a row under the pressure of nats. There are no guarantees. But I know I have to be in the hunt for a top spot in my local PAX classes if I expect to have a shot at the same nationally. And I also know that competing with these guys has made me a faster driver, magic number and all.
04-09-2012, 05:47 PM
#2434
You're both right but I agree with George more. How I place against Jinx, Jadrice or Feinberg at a local event is an excellent indicator of the opportunity I have to trophy at the higher level.
Last edited by tpdrx8; 04-09-2012 at 05:49 PM.
04-09-2012, 06:09 PM
#2435
Eric Simmons
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04-11-2012, 04:38 PM
#2437
maybe that's why I run 8" Hyperco at all four corners, maybe ....
and real race cars don't have preload, my car is very low and I don't have any issues with rubbing the liners using the typical STX tire sizes so it sounds like you have the JDM setup that lets you lower the car separate of of the spring which is probably why the issue is present
and real race cars don't have preload, my car is very low and I don't have any issues with rubbing the liners using the typical STX tire sizes so it sounds like you have the JDM setup that lets you lower the car separate of of the spring which is probably why the issue is present
If the second comment was directed at my post...my setup is about american as they come. Being on a Japansese car that is. The springs are not pre-loaded but they are loaded when the car is on the the ground. Is it safe to assume yours are too?
04-11-2012, 04:46 PM
#2438
Yes it is far from exact - particularly the magic number business - but if you can't place within 1 pax second (or thereabouts) consistently of the likes of Jenkins/Deitz/Bauer at a lot like Packwood its going to be a battle to rise above a lower trophy spot at nats in my experience.
Of course, as you say, you still have to make sure your car can perform on concrete, and that you can perform two days in a row under the pressure of nats. There are no guarantees. But I know I have to be in the hunt for a top spot in my local PAX classes if I expect to have a shot at the same nationally. And I also know that competing with these guys has made me a faster driver, magic number and all.
Of course, as you say, you still have to make sure your car can perform on concrete, and that you can perform two days in a row under the pressure of nats. There are no guarantees. But I know I have to be in the hunt for a top spot in my local PAX classes if I expect to have a shot at the same nationally. And I also know that competing with these guys has made me a faster driver, magic number and all.
04-12-2012, 08:02 AM
#2439
From the Hotchkis site
MX-5 rear bar:
13/16” (21mm) hollow
595% stiffer than the stock sway bar with a rate of 390 lbs/in
745% stiffer than the stock sway bar with a rate of 470 lbs/in
940% stiffer than the stock sway bar with a rate of 580 lbs/in
RX-8 rear bar:
390% stiffer than the stock sway bar with a rate of 195 lbs/in
470% stiffer than the stock sway bar with a rate of 250lbs/in
580% stiffer than the stock sway bar with a rate of 340 lbs/in
MX-5 rear bar:
13/16” (21mm) hollow
595% stiffer than the stock sway bar with a rate of 390 lbs/in
745% stiffer than the stock sway bar with a rate of 470 lbs/in
940% stiffer than the stock sway bar with a rate of 580 lbs/in
RX-8 rear bar:
390% stiffer than the stock sway bar with a rate of 195 lbs/in
470% stiffer than the stock sway bar with a rate of 250lbs/in
580% stiffer than the stock sway bar with a rate of 340 lbs/in
04-12-2012, 01:29 PM
#2440
Pre-load is not the same. That comment was intended for someone else who asked a question about it. I use 2.25" springs at all four corners. What length you may or may not need depends on rate selection and other factors like shock/perch configuration, aero parts relative to attained speeds, etc. as well as how particular you want to be about some of the other things you noted earlier.
04-18-2012, 11:24 AM
#2441
Simmons and I had the opportunity to weigh our cars at the DC Pro over the weekend. Mine being a 2004 base model with TR wheels and lighter weight battery. Came in at 2788 lbs with about 3 gallons of gas. Still have a ways to go but its going to take $$'s to get there. Happy with where it is for what's been done. A nice bonus is I was able to make sound while removing the muffler (34lbs). So I guees keeping the cat stock and resonator have their pros for now at least.
As for his, I'll let him post the numbers. It seems though that the extra options for the sport do add up.
As for his, I'll let him post the numbers. It seems though that the extra options for the sport do add up.
04-18-2012, 04:22 PM
#2442
Eric Simmons
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Simmons and I had the opportunity to weigh our cars at the DC Pro over the weekend. Mine being a 2004 base model with TR wheels and lighter weight battery. Came in at 2788 lbs with about 3 gallons of gas. Still have a ways to go but its going to take $$'s to get there. Happy with where it is for what's been done. A nice bonus is I was able to make sound while removing the muffler (34lbs). So I guees keeping the cat stock and resonator have their pros for now at least.
As for his, I'll let him post the numbers. It seems though that the extra options for the sport do add up.
As for his, I'll let him post the numbers. It seems though that the extra options for the sport do add up.
Simmons
04-21-2012, 08:34 PM
#2444
It looks like the live timing from Mineral Wells is having issues. Good luck tomorrow, Mark.
2012 Mineral Wells ProSolo
Round 2
April 21-22, 2012
**** UNOFFICIAL RESULTS (INFORMATIONAL ONLY) ****
Class standings for STX [6 Cars] (4/21/2012 6:33:39 PM)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
T 1 99 Mark Sipe 2005 Mazda RX-8 White RT/60ft
49.137(1) 47.416 47.255 28.939 49.252(1) 76.340
DNF 47.401 47.514 RL
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
T 2 77 Barry Booker 2004 Volkswagen R32 blu Yokoham RT/60ft
48.278 47.304 48.726 47.873 94.585
48.047 47.281 47.635 47.490 (18.245)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
3 169 James Wilson 2008 Subaru WRX DGM Dunlop RT/60ft
47.807 48.093 48.816 48.432 94.855
47.842 47.508 47.842 47.048 (0.270)
2012 Mineral Wells ProSolo
Round 2
April 21-22, 2012
**** UNOFFICIAL RESULTS (INFORMATIONAL ONLY) ****
Class standings for STX [6 Cars] (4/21/2012 6:33:39 PM)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
T 1 99 Mark Sipe 2005 Mazda RX-8 White RT/60ft
49.137(1) 47.416 47.255 28.939 49.252(1) 76.340
DNF 47.401 47.514 RL
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
T 2 77 Barry Booker 2004 Volkswagen R32 blu Yokoham RT/60ft
48.278 47.304 48.726 47.873 94.585
48.047 47.281 47.635 47.490 (18.245)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
3 169 James Wilson 2008 Subaru WRX DGM Dunlop RT/60ft
47.807 48.093 48.816 48.432 94.855
47.842 47.508 47.842 47.048 (0.270)
Last edited by BRODA; 04-21-2012 at 08:43 PM.
04-22-2012, 09:20 PM
#2446
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Good job, Mark! See you next weekend in San Diego...where I will likely prove, once and for all, that I truly cannot drive an Elise
04-22-2012, 11:03 PM
#2447
I think I got the lemon, lol. I'm a bit miffed about the RL in the Final 4 against Erik. My video shows me staging and launching exactly the same as all my other runs (full 3rd yellow). I just couldn't believe it; stopped after launching and just sat there on course for several seconds wondering WTF just happened. I had a 0.38 sec lead going out on the faster side and poof ... I had plenty of gifts too. I was down a cone on my first run three times in a row and came back to win on all of them; never give up!
but apparently they more or less fixed most of the issues we were experiencing on Saturday. There were still a few minor errors and subsequent reruns today, but nothing like the day before.
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but apparently they more or less fixed most of the issues we were experiencing on Saturday. There were still a few minor errors and subsequent reruns today, but nothing like the day before.
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Last edited by TeamRX8; 04-22-2012 at 11:10 PM.
