Digisan

Yes they did, not in print but verbally at the _MAZDA_ RX-8 press event.

Rotarynews

I doubt the Mazda guys dreamt those numbers up...

D-san

Digisan

Maybe the ECU is stuck?

73JPS

Not worried in the least...

This is a classic case of Internet Hysteria, with everybody up in arms and reacting to information which is at the very least relatively unexamined, and at the worst unsubstantiated nonsense.

I am with BillK on this one: the car drives great, feels great, performs great... I frankly couldn't give a s--t how much or little horsepower this engine makes.

RX8-U-UP

Throughout this thread we have many other unreliable and inaccurate sources of information being passed on and believed over manufactuers specs. I list a few in order of unbelieveability.
1) What a car salesman verbally told people at a car selling event when asked a question they knew nothing about. Horse power at the rear wheels.
2) An article from a numbers based performance magazine quoting the wrong spec for the car they are testing, yet I'm supposed to believe the rest of the article. Along with many quotes from a guy who subscribes to this magazine. There are more made up stories in jounalism these days than there are false assumptions in this thread.
3) Somebody keeps posting with a big picture of a silver land yacht, and wants us to believe they are really really concerned about a couple of horse power or a few tenth of a second.
4) Some one in one post says he has ran a 6.0 second 0-60, then agree with a post that he missing all his top end.
5) Besides the usual 2 to 3 trolls stirring the witches brew, and spouting more unsubstatiated BS than the car salesman in number 1.
I found it very entertaining.
Sorry got to go, got to drive my super slow lead sled to work, I only have a half hour to go 5 miles I hope I can make it. Have fun worrying, I choose driving my winning blue, 6MT, 2?? HP, RX8. semi ZOOM, semi ZOOM.

pelucidor

Don't forget the whole idea of electric power steering and one piece CF driveshafts etc was to reduce power losses from the engine. I would expect the RX-8 to have lower losses than an FD RX-7 (i.e. < 18%) rather than compare it to a Miata at 23%.

To those that don't think Mazda needs to do anything about this situation - I take it that if Mazda eventully admits a mistake in HP and offers everyone, say, free servicing for the warranty period (50k miles) then they will not accept the offer. I think the performance of the car is good enough for my personal needs, but I will hold Mazda accountable for their past and current marketing claims, and expect recompense if it is in error. I hope there is not an error for the sake of Mazda's reputation, even if it costs me freebies.

To RX8-U-UP:
1. Robert Davis is Senior VP of Product Development (for a long time) and Marketing (recent additional duties) for Mazda, not a car salesman. He has been with Mazda North America for 13 years and is a 'rotorhead' and a racer - I would expect him to be accurate in what he says to a journalist 'on record'. I am in a senior management for a publicly traded company like Mazda and NOBODY says anything to the media 'of the cuff' - everything is vetted multiple times. The legal fallout and effect on share price can be huge for even the slightest mistake...
2) Don't know which magazine article you are talking about
3)I keep posting with an avatar of two dogs and yet I am concerned about many other things too, including hp numbers for this car. So what?
4)Hercules measured a 0-60 with a handheld stopwatch and got roughly 6 secs. It can easily be a second off depending on speedo error, reaction time, etc. I can believe he thinks the top end is weaker than expected - e.g. at 70mph drop from 5th to 3rd (engine over 6000rpm) and find a slight lack of oomph.
5)I am surprised at only 2-3 'trolls' - considering how many auto forums know about the HP issue I expected dozens by now.

BTW a recent Japanese magazine used timing equipment and got 0-60 in 7.04 secs for a 250PS 6MT (247hp over here) and 7.10 for the 210PS model with 5MT (207hp engine but no equivalent transmission in USA). They also got 400m (1/4 mile) in 14.97 for hi-power and 15.05 for low-power - only 0.08secs difference for supposedly 40hp difference. The article is in Japanese so most of us can only understand the numbers chart - there may have been extenuating circumstances for the 250PS model.

jonalan

I thought Japan did not have the 250PS 6MT? I thought the auto and manual both had the 210PS engine?

Chuck Clifford

A marketing executive for a car company is a high priced car salesman. And I'm sure Robert Davis has not said anything more than the press release on the 8, 247 HP at the engine. Mazda has left it up to everyone else to speculate what that means to the rear wheels. I bet they can prove, and have proved over and over their only released figure (247 HP at the engine). Using any one of 500 speculative calculations that I have seen throughout the forum, this could be anything from 0 to 247 HP at the rear wheels. If they are wrong they will be found out, and all involved will be compensated. Its not going to ruin the fun that I am currently experiecing driving this car. Many people on this and other threads do not appear to buy a car until they have substatiating DYNO results to justify their purchase. DYNO results are not a part of my car purchasing regiment, and never will be. I don't on a daily, weekly, or annual basis bet my pink slip based on my cars performance. Because from my experience there is always somebody bigger, badder, meaner, and faster than anyone on any given day, and Murfy's law tell me that one individual will nine times out of ten be lined up against me. My car seems to run better cold, that doesn't mean I am only going to drive it in the winter. Buy the car you like, and like the car you buy, until its time to get another. Nothing makes me happier than seeing well taken care of cars of all types.

pelucidor

BTW JSG has a 250PS (247hp) 6MT RX-8 in Japan and has posted about his car many times since April - he gave the first review of his 250Ps RX-8 compared to his previous 250PS S2000.

nk_Rx8

I gotta say that for those that say that don't give a rat's *** about the missing HP because the car is already fun. Well, what if the car can be even MORE fun. But anyway, I will bet that if there is a fix, all those that say they don't care will be calling to schedule appointments for the fix "that isn't even needed".

notdeafyet

Never ever forget that very special instrument, the all-important ----------- BUTT DYNO ---------- (aka *** sensor).

If the test drive is impressive and nimbly zips your butt all over the neighborhood and you're smiling, then the power results are great! My *** sensor is particularly fond of the handling and high rpm freeway action...

pelucidor

Well put! Similarly if Mazda eventually offers freebies (free servicing etc) for owners that are unhappy with their lower than marketed HP, will these previously 'happy at whatever hp' owners suddenly become unhappy to get the freebie?

73JPS

Well, duh! No kidding one would take advantage of free improvements offered. Just because I would take what was offered doesn't mean I would care if it wasn't! Typical obtuse and specious reasoning. The fact remains that I wouldn't give a rats *** if nobody made an issue of this and it all died quietly right now: ergo, I don't give a f--k about this "claimed" and "supposed" "lack" of horsepower, which many people all seem to be up in arms about, but which (in my tiny little mind, anyway) isn't even substantiated. I mean dyno tests at 95 degrees F for crying out loud... I don't care how good the dyno software is, that sorta temperature (and possibly humidity) is gonna give questionable results.

What other variables have been ignored? What other shortcuts have been taken? When you go looking for something wrong, YOU USUALLY FIND IT. It seems to me that many people here are screaming to crucify Mazda for something which has yet to be proven. It reeks of a mob mentality, IMHO.

Lensman

Get yer flaming torches here! Flaming torches: 3 for a dollar gettum 'ere. Free map of the road to the Castle on the hill with every torch... Get ya torches 'ere!!!..

73JPS

:D

nk_Rx8

For all the people that "don't give a f--k about this "claimed" and "supposed" "lack" of horsepower", you sure are monitoring the low HP threads closely. And why would you need the free HP? The car is perfect as is! No need to bother the dealer for an unneeded fix.

The bottom line is that Neither Mazda nor any company would lift a finger to fix anything or to advertise truthfully if no consumers complained about it. So many people are just acting like they don't give a rat's *** (maybe to defend their purchase as is) while others cause the stink to get things righted. Then of course in the end, those that didn't need anything more will dive in and reap the benefits also while maintaining that they didn't need it. Sorry, gotta call it like I see it. There were Miata guys denying that the Miata was low on power too, same with the Cobra guys, STi guys are denying that any of them ping, etc. What if the RX8 was advertised as 260hp while still dynoes at 180whp? Then is is still OK? What about 270hp? 300hp? The car still drives the same. Would you still be OK?

I haven't bought yet, but I would be mad too like some of the other guys are. Yes, some test drove the car first. But, most people probably didn't get to thrash it or test that the car meets specs. When I buy something, esp ~$30k, it'd better do everything that was advertised to me and meet the advertised specs.

73JPS

Uh, the thread is "are you WORRIED" about the lack of horsepower...

No. Not worried. It seems the "mob" can do all the worrying for me. And the horsepower loss is "claimed" because I don't trust the sources, and nothing has been substantiated.

Lensman

3 separate dyno results: all with near identical low power conclusions? Paul Yaw stating that other cars have been dynoed and that they have exhibited problems? Low performance statistics from owners (subjective I'll agree), the odd Japanese results??? Clearly there's a grassy knoll involved somewhere.

Skyline Maniac

EXACTLY, I don't understand the mentality of some people here who are defending the RX-8 despite the apparent dyno results and Mazda's inability to provide a straight answer swiftly. For those who claims the car is perfect even with 180whp - what if the RX-8 dynoed at 150whp but still 'feels' fast? So base on that logic, Mazda might as well have advertised the Renesis produces 400hp, and the 180whp is attributed to drive tran loss.

jonalan

Now you guys are being silly. If Mazda comes out and says nothing is wrong with the car, it is what it is - I'm fine with that. Now, if they come out and say "oops", we can make your car faster AND we'll give you free oil changes for life, just bring it in to your dealer - hell yeah, I'm gonna do it! That has NOTHING to do with me being happy or unhappy with the car.

73JPS

Didn't I say that already??:D

73JPS

This is hilarious. Read your own post, dude. You want Mazda to provide a "straight answer swiftly"; a straight answer swiftly to what? "Apparent" dyno results. LOL.

No, with a mob of half baked RX8 forum members jumping wildly to conclusions that Mazda must be wrong, I would think that Mazda will be very careful and methodical regarding how they come up with an answer.

BTW, my 'mentality' is NOT to defend the 8, or claim it is perfect as is. I am actually more of the mindset of the Rotary News guys: wait and see, relax, it may not be that big a deal. But go ahead, run around like a chicken with its head cut off: that's a mentality I don't understand...:p

jonalan

I'm a slow typer.