New 370Z has 100HP on the RX-8, Yet Less Than Second Faster 0-60
01-02-2009, 12:19 PM
#101
We're complaining becuase the RX8 is getting its *** kicked by every car in its class. The 16X 'being in the works' does not hinder the fact that the RX8 has not recieved any power increases during its life span and probably will not in the future until the new RX comes out.
The RX8 is done for if mazda doesnt step up, thats why were all complaining.
The RX8 is done for if mazda doesnt step up, thats why were all complaining.
All sports cars fall behind the competition sooner or later, and are replaced by better ones. Yes, other cars have kept up better, but increasing power on a piston engine is a hell of a lot easier than doing so with a rotary. They need a new engine and a new car to step up the game, and that's what they're doing.
01-02-2009, 12:24 PM
#102
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Yes, the 8 is done for, it's 5 years old and it will soon be replaced by a new RX car.
All sports cars fall behind the competition sooner or later, and are replaced by better ones. Yes, other cars have kept up better, but increasing power on a piston engine is a hell of a lot easier than doing so with a rotary. They need a new engine and a new car to step up the game, and that's what they're doing.
All sports cars fall behind the competition sooner or later, and are replaced by better ones. Yes, other cars have kept up better, but increasing power on a piston engine is a hell of a lot easier than doing so with a rotary. They need a new engine and a new car to step up the game, and that's what they're doing.
I mean, the extra oil injector was nice but you mean to tell me they couldn't have at least TRIED to make that car a tad faster. I lighter flywheel maybe and a different exhaust set up to get maybe 5 extra horsepwer to at least HUMOR the competition.
Nope, they left it all the same, gave it a facelift, gave it an ugly steering wheel, and said here you go enthusiasts, the new RX8 !!!
On a positive note, at least our cars are rare
01-02-2009, 12:34 PM
#103
IMHO, there's only one generation of 8, really. Even the '09 R3 isn't really a new generation, at least not in the sense of the generations of the 7.
There isn't much Mazda could do to increase performance on the Renesis and create a true new generation of 8, short of FI. And there are some good reasons why they wouldn't want to turbo the 8.
There isn't much Mazda could do to increase performance on the Renesis and create a true new generation of 8, short of FI. And there are some good reasons why they wouldn't want to turbo the 8.
01-02-2009, 12:37 PM
#104
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IMHO, there's only one generation of 8, really. Even the '09 R3 isn't really a new generation, at least not in the sense of the generations of the 7.
There isn't much Mazda could do to increase performance on the Renesis and create a true new generation of 8, short of FI. And there are some good reasons why they wouldn't want to turbo the 8.
There isn't much Mazda could do to increase performance on the Renesis and create a true new generation of 8, short of FI. And there are some good reasons why they wouldn't want to turbo the 8.
The sad part is its amazing handling cant hinder its lack of power around the track anymore either; because its so underpowered.
IMHO I think the RX8s run is nearing its end.
Please dont take this as bashing in anyway, I love my car and will keep it for a long time if not forever, but the truth is the truth no matter how much you love/ respect a car.
01-03-2009, 01:33 AM
#105
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I feel the same. The glory of the 8 has been fading. Heck even the Honda Civic Si can be had with Mugen goodies off the showroom floor!? And then there's the lack of any real mazdaspeed trim... where's the 3/6/MX-5 got their due.
01-03-2009, 07:16 AM
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I kinda understand their reasoning, if they made a mazdaspeed 8 it would prob be 40K- 45K + and all the performance parts would add maybe 5-10hp. THe car wouldnt compete well with other cars in the same price margin. Thats why I said they shoulda put some of those parts on the R3 which is still in the sub 40K price range.
01-03-2009, 08:14 AM
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01-03-2009, 10:49 AM
#109
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Yes, the 8 is done for, it's 5 years old and it will soon be replaced by a new RX car.
All sports cars fall behind the competition sooner or later, and are replaced by better ones. Yes, other cars have kept up better, but increasing power on a piston engine is a hell of a lot easier than doing so with a rotary. They need a new engine and a new car to step up the game, and that's what they're doing.
All sports cars fall behind the competition sooner or later, and are replaced by better ones. Yes, other cars have kept up better, but increasing power on a piston engine is a hell of a lot easier than doing so with a rotary. They need a new engine and a new car to step up the game, and that's what they're doing.
The thing Im complaining about the most is the 2nd gen rx8 was hardly changes aside from the facelift.
I mean, the extra oil injector was nice but you mean to tell me they couldn't have at least TRIED to make that car a tad faster. I lighter flywheel maybe and a different exhaust set up to get maybe 5 extra horsepwer to at least HUMOR the competition.
Nope, they left it all the same, gave it a facelift, gave it an ugly steering wheel, and said here you go enthusiasts, the new RX8 !!!
On a positive note, at least our cars are rare
I mean, the extra oil injector was nice but you mean to tell me they couldn't have at least TRIED to make that car a tad faster. I lighter flywheel maybe and a different exhaust set up to get maybe 5 extra horsepwer to at least HUMOR the competition.
Nope, they left it all the same, gave it a facelift, gave it an ugly steering wheel, and said here you go enthusiasts, the new RX8 !!!
On a positive note, at least our cars are rare
I don't know how many more times this needs to be said in order for some people here to understand it:
When the RX-8 program was given the green light, it was understood that the car would see a 10-year cycle. The RX-8 has just received what is commonly called an "MCE", or mid-cycle enhancement. The 04-08 models were the first 5 years. The 2009-2013 models will be the remaining 5 years.
As such, no one should have expected massive, fundamental changes after the first half of the RX-8's life was over. It is now entering the second half of its life with some apparently substantial (despite what some nay-sayers around here believe) changes made to the engine's support systems.
The "Series II" RX-8 is as good as the RX-8 is going to get from the factory. Deal with it.
01-03-2009, 11:11 AM
#110
Stop crushing my dreams.
The 8 can't continue for 5 more years without some kind of substantial power upgrade. Whether they call it an RX-8 or RX-10 or Happy Fun Car, it will have to be different from the '09 8. I just can't see the '09 making it to 2013 without a substantial change in the power plant.
The 8 can't continue for 5 more years without some kind of substantial power upgrade. Whether they call it an RX-8 or RX-10 or Happy Fun Car, it will have to be different from the '09 8. I just can't see the '09 making it to 2013 without a substantial change in the power plant.
01-03-2009, 11:24 AM
#111
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I don't know how many more times this needs to be said in order for some people here to understand it:
When the RX-8 program was given the green light, it was understood that the car would see a 10-year cycle. The RX-8 has just received what is commonly called an "MCE", or mid-cycle enhancement. The 04-08 models were the first 5 years. The 2009-2013 models will be the remaining 5 years.
As such, no one should have expected massive, fundamental changes after the first half of the RX-8's life was over. It is now entering the second half of its life with some apparently substantial (despite what some nay-sayers around here believe) changes made to the engine's support systems.
The "Series II" RX-8 is as good as the RX-8 is going to get from the factory. Deal with it. :)
When the RX-8 program was given the green light, it was understood that the car would see a 10-year cycle. The RX-8 has just received what is commonly called an "MCE", or mid-cycle enhancement. The 04-08 models were the first 5 years. The 2009-2013 models will be the remaining 5 years.
As such, no one should have expected massive, fundamental changes after the first half of the RX-8's life was over. It is now entering the second half of its life with some apparently substantial (despite what some nay-sayers around here believe) changes made to the engine's support systems.
The "Series II" RX-8 is as good as the RX-8 is going to get from the factory. Deal with it. :)
For example the 350Z got bumped to 306 horsepower from 287 in 2006, the GTO got a bump from 350 to 400 horsepower.
Our car, however did not when it desperately needs it.
Thats my gripe, deal with it
01-03-2009, 02:22 PM
#112
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Stop crushing my dreams.
The 8 can't continue for 5 more years without some kind of substantial power upgrade. Whether they call it an RX-8 or RX-10 or Happy Fun Car, it will have to be different from the '09 8. I just can't see the '09 making it to 2013 without a substantial change in the power plant.
The 8 can't continue for 5 more years without some kind of substantial power upgrade. Whether they call it an RX-8 or RX-10 or Happy Fun Car, it will have to be different from the '09 8. I just can't see the '09 making it to 2013 without a substantial change in the power plant.
Im dealing with it just fine, its not like Im considering trading in anyways. However during this "mid life" change, cars typically recieve performance enhancements.
For example the 350Z got bumped to 306 horsepower from 287 in 2006, the GTO got a bump from 350 to 400 horsepower.
Our car, however did not when it desperately needs it.
Thats my gripe, deal with it
For example the 350Z got bumped to 306 horsepower from 287 in 2006, the GTO got a bump from 350 to 400 horsepower.
Our car, however did not when it desperately needs it.
Thats my gripe, deal with it
And it I think Mazda sent a pretty clear message with the "Series II" RENESIS that they were interested in improving reliability (and perhaps "driveability"), not performance.
Mazda could not have been, and indeed apparently were not, impressed or satisfied with the reliability of the RENESIS the first few years it was on the market. And I think they've taken substantial steps to address that with the "Series II". The only way they would have been able to get "competitive" power gains is through factory FI, which would have only caused more headaches in terms of reliability.
But why this strategy? I think they want the RX-8 to depart on a "good note", that is, they want the Series II to prove that the rotary can indeed be virtually trouble-free. Basically, try to undo the "damage" done to the rotary's reputation by the early RX-8s and generate some goodwill toward a possible new rotary-powered sports car. Is it too little too late? Maybe.
Finally, I don't know if the RX-8 will live through the 2013 model year worldwide (i.e. in the U.S. and Europe). But it'll probably live through its intended 10-year cycle in Japan at least, just like the FD. I don't believe there will be an immediate replacement for the RX-8, and certainly not before 2013.
It's obviously still a great car that's winning praise to this day against cars with much stronger spec sheets than the 370Z. No, it's not going to join the HP wars anytime soon, but it's never been about that.
Sorry to pee on your parade, but the RX-8 is still a fine piece of machinery, and we should be happy that Mazda still plans to have it around for a few more years.
01-03-2009, 04:32 PM
#113
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I think it's been pretty well-documented here that the RENESIS comes from the factory basically maxed-out. The only way people are getting any substantial power gains out of it is by going FI.
And it I think Mazda sent a pretty clear message with the "Series II" RENESIS that they were interested in improving reliability (and perhaps "driveability"), not performance.
Mazda could not have been, and indeed apparently were not, impressed or satisfied with the reliability of the RENESIS the first few years it was on the market. And I think they've taken substantial steps to address that with the "Series II". The only way they would have been able to get "competitive" power gains is through factory FI, which would have only caused more headaches in terms of reliability.
But why this strategy? I think they want the RX-8 to depart on a "good note", that is, they want the Series II to prove that the rotary can indeed be virtually trouble-free. Basically, try to undo the "damage" done to the rotary's reputation by the early RX-8s and generate some goodwill toward a possible new rotary-powered sports car. Is it too little too late? Maybe.
Finally, I don't know if the RX-8 will live through the 2013 model year worldwide (i.e. in the U.S. and Europe). But it'll probably live through its intended 10-year cycle in Japan at least, just like the FD. I don't believe there will be an immediate replacement for the RX-8, and certainly not before 2013.
It's obviously still a great car that's winning praise to this day against cars with much stronger spec sheets than the 370Z. No, it's not going to join the HP wars anytime soon, but it's never been about that.
Sorry to pee on your parade, but the RX-8 is still a fine piece of machinery, and we should be happy that Mazda still plans to have it around for a few more years.
And it I think Mazda sent a pretty clear message with the "Series II" RENESIS that they were interested in improving reliability (and perhaps "driveability"), not performance.
Mazda could not have been, and indeed apparently were not, impressed or satisfied with the reliability of the RENESIS the first few years it was on the market. And I think they've taken substantial steps to address that with the "Series II". The only way they would have been able to get "competitive" power gains is through factory FI, which would have only caused more headaches in terms of reliability.
But why this strategy? I think they want the RX-8 to depart on a "good note", that is, they want the Series II to prove that the rotary can indeed be virtually trouble-free. Basically, try to undo the "damage" done to the rotary's reputation by the early RX-8s and generate some goodwill toward a possible new rotary-powered sports car. Is it too little too late? Maybe.
Finally, I don't know if the RX-8 will live through the 2013 model year worldwide (i.e. in the U.S. and Europe). But it'll probably live through its intended 10-year cycle in Japan at least, just like the FD. I don't believe there will be an immediate replacement for the RX-8, and certainly not before 2013.
It's obviously still a great car that's winning praise to this day against cars with much stronger spec sheets than the 370Z. No, it's not going to join the HP wars anytime soon, but it's never been about that.
Sorry to pee on your parade, but the RX-8 is still a fine piece of machinery, and we should be happy that Mazda still plans to have it around for a few more years.
As I documented a few times above, they shouldve at least done something small to show that they are addressing the issue. Even if that means a couple of MS accessories on the R3, I think we can all agree, anything would help.
01-03-2009, 05:22 PM
#114
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actually, 100hp for 1 sec faster sounds about right in 0-60 times.
rx8---------------------230hp- 5.9
370z-------------------330hp- 5.2
2008 bmw m3--------414hp- 4.4
2008 corvette z06---512hp -3.7
bugatti veyron--------1000hp+ - 2.8
as you get faster and faster it takes a lot more power to get to 60 faster. i think the 370z time is very good for the power it has.... the only reason the evo and sti are so fast are because they are AWD
rx8---------------------230hp- 5.9
370z-------------------330hp- 5.2
2008 bmw m3--------414hp- 4.4
2008 corvette z06---512hp -3.7
bugatti veyron--------1000hp+ - 2.8
as you get faster and faster it takes a lot more power to get to 60 faster. i think the 370z time is very good for the power it has.... the only reason the evo and sti are so fast are because they are AWD
01-03-2009, 05:31 PM
#115
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You're not peeing on my parade, Im not making a parade. Regardless of whether the rotary is maxed out or not, mazda has shown little effort towards straightline performance enhancments for the rx8.
As I documented a few times above, they shouldve at least done something small to show that they are addressing the issue. Even if that means a couple of MS accessories on the R3, I think we can all agree, anything would help.
As I documented a few times above, they shouldve at least done something small to show that they are addressing the issue. Even if that means a couple of MS accessories on the R3, I think we can all agree, anything would help.
The RX-8 wasn't first-in-class in acceleration when it debuted, it isn't now, and it won't be for the rest of its cycle. Acceleration wasn't a key focus of the RX-8's development program. Overall balance and packaging was the goal. They achieved massive success in that regard, I think.
In my opinion, Mazda did a great job with the Series II, and it's a worthy progression of the RX lineage.
01-03-2009, 06:23 PM
#116
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Your concerns would be justified if Mazda had historically placed a premium on straightline performance. But that's not the case. Mazda has been about finesse and overall balance, not 1/4 mile times.
The RX-8 wasn't first-in-class in acceleration when it debuted, it isn't now, and it won't be for the rest of its cycle. Acceleration wasn't a key focus of the RX-8's development program. Overall balance and packaging was the goal. They achieved massive success in that regard, I think.
In my opinion, Mazda did a great job with the Series II, and it's a worthy progression of the RX lineage.
The RX-8 wasn't first-in-class in acceleration when it debuted, it isn't now, and it won't be for the rest of its cycle. Acceleration wasn't a key focus of the RX-8's development program. Overall balance and packaging was the goal. They achieved massive success in that regard, I think.
In my opinion, Mazda did a great job with the Series II, and it's a worthy progression of the RX lineage.
Thats my point.
01-03-2009, 06:50 PM
#117
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01-03-2009, 07:19 PM
#118
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IMO the rx8 is a great handling car and that it handles better than majority of the cars out there, but no matter how much mazda upgrades on the handling of the rx8 in the future, it will still not be able to compete with any of the new model sports cars. it can be fun to drive, but seriously anything can be fun to drive. a golf cart is fun to drive for me even if the max speed is only like 15 mph.
Last edited by SiLVeRE8; 01-03-2009 at 07:21 PM.
01-03-2009, 08:27 PM
#119
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I'm kinda a lurker on here. And I just read this whole thread.
I live in Iowa... and well handling doesnt mean anything around here. My car has stopped putting a smile on my face... but I drove a cobalt ss turbo with more power and had a grin on my face the whole time.
Sometimes looks dont matter when talking about how much enjoyment you get out of a car.
I live in Iowa... and well handling doesnt mean anything around here. My car has stopped putting a smile on my face... but I drove a cobalt ss turbo with more power and had a grin on my face the whole time.
Sometimes looks dont matter when talking about how much enjoyment you get out of a car.
01-03-2009, 08:44 PM
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01-03-2009, 08:51 PM
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The interior felt cheap. Seats looked stupid. But it was still fun.
But then again my rx8 has every rattle known to man and the center console flippy thingy drives me nuts.
I have had a lot of problems with my 8 and the 370z is starting to look like a fun option.
I do autocross my car though so Ill just have to see how well it drives before I go ahead and sign a contract haha.
But then again my rx8 has every rattle known to man and the center console flippy thingy drives me nuts.
I have had a lot of problems with my 8 and the 370z is starting to look like a fun option.
I do autocross my car though so Ill just have to see how well it drives before I go ahead and sign a contract haha.