dynamho

Did it come turbo'ed from the factory or was it aftermarket?

Red Devil

It was a factory TurboII, boosted to ~8psi. A few mods - downpipe, catback, intake, power pulleys, radiator, silicone vacuum lines. The turbo was rebuilt once, but the engine never required any service besides routine maintenance. It wasn't the fastest car on the road, but had enough power to be fun.

I don't think there is any reason to believe that a Renesis can't be boosted to about that same 8psi and be expected to have longevity. When I spoke to Cam at Pettit early last summer they were still on the original engine in his car at that 8psi mark. I'm also not claiming it can't be boosted higher than 8psi reliably...

AdRoCK3217

Tofuball's (of the RX7club) T2 is kicking some 180k miles, original engine + turbo, has 100+ compression on all faces, and that baby HAULS

Red Devil

That's not possible, these engine aren't reliable cause someone on the internet said so.

LionZoo

Yeah it must drink oil by the gallon load and get like 0.2 mpg!

Ike

I don't have to own a rotary to know they're sensitive to detonation and heat... Also, I have personal experience with the rotary, I've just never owned one. Lastly, you comparing your FFI car to an aftermarket RX-8 turboed to the tune of 350+ whp is a stretch. There is a reason why guys don't kust slap turbos on the N/A Supra, RX-7, and Lancers and make big power...

otakurx

The new M3 and GT-R will be more luxury based, they will be fast but if compared on a autoX course the 8 would eat them alive. If you are into drag racing and all that you will like them, but not if your into handling. An easy way to judge it is see how sanctioning bodies like the SCCA or NASA currently rate the M3 and Infiniti G compared to the 8. Now if you were talking about a Porsche or Vette or Farrari or something then ya they can be faster then the 8 all around. Just my .02

playdoh43

its funny how some people here think the M3 and GT-R cant handle.

toxin440

well ive never ridden or driven in an M3 (yet) but I know it can handle the one thing that I'm just unsure about is the fact that it weighs 1/4 of a ton more. Granted its going to have at LEAST twice the power, so I don't think anyone should really be worried.

Red Devil

How is me comparing my TII to the RX-8 a stretch? As long as your octane and boost and ignition are in sync with the engine's compression there shouldn't be an issue. My TII may have only run at 8psi, but that was because I chose to not spend the money to get a turbo system increase the pr. My decision had nothing to do with that engine's capabilities. Because of 10:1 compression, the Renesis will not run as much boost on pump gas as the 8.5:1 13B-T. But the Renesis also won't need more than what it can handle to attain the desired power numbers to match the new M3. Every aspect of the Renesis is stronger than that 13B-T engine, so if anything it's more suited to operating safely within its acceptable boost range.

What personal exprience do you have? AFR + ignition timing = combustion, same in a rotary, same in a piston engine. If the engine is tuned to the ragged edge, or a half assed job is performed on parts, like insufficient fuel injectors, then maybe you'll blow a seal. But for those that go with conservative ignition and fuel, it is no more an issue than with any other internal combustion engine. You're correct, rotaries do have issues with heat - that's why there are larger radiators, aftermarket water pumps, Evans coolant, and electric fan modifications.

Let's again take a hp/lbs comparison...between the RX-8 and M3...since we don't know the weight of the M3, how about we say it's 3500lbs.
3500/420 = 8.33
3100/375 = 8.26

That's ~10 psi on the Renesis. That's attainable on pump gas.

BlueRenesis82

so far this thread rules.

that is all

toxin440

we cant forget *** well - that mods to the M3 are going to be bountiful. Due to the history the M3 has and the fact that its a V8 with tons of potential.

An interesting thought is the fact that all of us are used to high dollar low gains for our RX8. The BMW M3 will no doubt be a VERY expensive to mod but I'm sure the gains from M3 mods will yeild a lot more then mods for the Renesis. (guess)

Red Devil

Agree 100%.

Getting within a hp/lbs ratio with the RX-8/Renesis is possible, I believe. And for within the 15K or so that you stated in your first post. But if it is a M3 with any mods, you're outgunned. I see a guy from time to time driving around in a M3 turbo and can only imagine how much power that car has. If you want to play with them, I think you are looking at a 20B swap.

I think unless someone is a diehard rotor head, the M3 makes sense over a 20B swap.

AdRoCK3217

Ok, I had to point out. Your S4 T2 has 8.4:1 compression, not 8.5:1. I'm picky about that..


But anywho. Ike was right in his post. Yes, the rotaries are very sensitive to detonation -- no so much heat. The two can fall hand-in-hand, but, yeah. A very, very, very, veryyyyy slight mis-fire, or pre-ignition, on a rotary engines, can be fatal. We're talking seals out the exhaust fatal. One single detonation can be the end of a motor, unlike piston engines, where the most damage you'll usually see is a blown head gasket - head gaskets are like a 45 minute job (or less) with most motors

AdRoCK3217

I don't think a 20B swap is necessary, just because said M3 has mods. Sure, they will probably get some good gains from doing mods..but if the Renesis ever lights it off like the 13BT and 13B-RE/REW, we're looking at upwards of 700rwhp while still keeping the "around the town" factor possible.

However, if race gas isn't available during that race, M3 winnnnsss!

Red Devil

Until the Renesis lights it off, it's kind of pie in the sky. I would love to see that happen, though.

The detonation issue, I agree about blowing seals, I mentioned it before. We're splitting hairs because I'm saying that a conservatively tuned rotary will run the risk of detonation no more than a piston engine. That was my main point. If either type of engine has a crappy tune, gets bad gas, etc...then you get what you get. And yeah, replacing a head gasked is slightly easier than rebuiding an engine.

playdoh43

wont happen, that engine is pretty much maxed out squeezing more than 100hp/liter
fact of the matter is, unless its a high displacement pushrod cam in block OHV V8 like the gm small block LS series or factory force inducted car like Evo or SVT cobra, power/dollar performance in the aftermarket is usually pretty bad.

AdRoCK3217

playdoh43, I wouldn't be so quick to say the M3 can't make more than 419hp with its 4.0L V8..

That's a pretty stout engine, I would except 400-450whp possibilities, NA..

NoTears316

Exactly what I was thinking... pie.

RX-7&8

To share my experience. For the last few years I had both a FD and E46 M3 Convertible at the same time.

I've invested over US45K in my FD which is a 400HP+ lightweight tight handling monster. Killed several many 911s, highly tuned GTRs and Evos in straights and bends...(okay no kill stories here ). The M3 was a complete stock expect for some 19 inch Harmanns and angle eyes.

When I had both cars, I would actually drive the M3 90% of the time because the FD was so damn hard to control on normal roads and way too loud. Having a highly tuned FI car is great for racing but when you have near 500hp in an engine designed for 300hp you will be expected to spend considerable $ for maintainence no matter how good the job is (I flew in a team of JGTC guys to Hong Kong to tune mine). These cars are not meant to be driven as a daily car.

The M3 however is a perfectly fast enough car (good enough to get my license suspended twice) and very well balanced for everyday comfortable driving. Also, you mentioned the bling factor and while both cars are head turners, girls definitely check you out more driving the M3 top down. Just think about rolling up to a nice hotel or resturant. Would you drive a BMW or a car that spits flames out of the exhaust and can be heard a mile away?

On another note, once you are in these performance categories 100hp really doesn't matter that much more unless all you know is driving straight. In that case, check out the Ford or Chevy collection. Invest the cash in a good driving school and it will serve you a life time of performance gain!

Now my daily driver is a stock RX8 in China and it is really a fast enough car for most purposes. It is fantastic in everyway, I just wished it didn't cost US50K here Unloaded the E46 M3 to wait for the V8 beast....storaged the FD in Hong Kong when I return every now and then for holiday driving