Mazsport Turbo vs Coming M3
03-23-2007, 01:49 PM
#26
Originally Posted by DailyDriver2k5
Has anybody ever thought when you mod the Gt-r or M3 it will still take out a modded 8?
So yes, you can turbo an 8 to be the level of those two cars, but what happens when the owners or yourself mods the Gt-R and the M3? Goodbye turbo RX-8...
Stock to Stock or modded to modded the Rx-8 is going to be seeing tailights.
The GT-R and the M3 are on a totally diffrent performance level than the 8. I love my 8, but i too realize that the 8 has its limits wether stock or modded when put up against cars outside its class.
So yes, you can turbo an 8 to be the level of those two cars, but what happens when the owners or yourself mods the Gt-R and the M3? Goodbye turbo RX-8...
Stock to Stock or modded to modded the Rx-8 is going to be seeing tailights.
The GT-R and the M3 are on a totally diffrent performance level than the 8. I love my 8, but i too realize that the 8 has its limits wether stock or modded when put up against cars outside its class.
I know it depends on the track. but its Rx8 is not that bad, its just that most nubs out there dont know how to drive. they want the car to drive for them, so HP/TQ is their answer.
GT-R and the new M3 going to be sweet. but remember, if you want a Dyno Queen, I would say go with 3 rotor or hell get a RB25 or 2z from Supra or even LS1. You'r done.
but on the track, it will be a completely different story. Im not saying the 8 can beat GT-R or new M3 on a track(I seriously doubt that would happen), but its not going to be as bad.
03-23-2007, 01:52 PM
#27
Originally Posted by cavemancan
I can only partialy agree here. Sure the Rx8's engine potential is not comparable to those cars but then again it was never intended to be. However, if you put a comparable engine inside the Rx8 engine bay (like a Turbo 20b) and we are in a whole new ball park here. Recalibrate the suspension, redistribute the weight to revive the 50/50 split, and address drivetrain issues (putting power down)...Simply scary fast.
The Rx8 chasis is simply incredible. All it needs is a good engine combo.
The Rx8 chasis is simply incredible. All it needs is a good engine combo.
It took Mazda a LONG *** while to get the power that we got today. Do you really expect people outside to be able to know everything about this engine in 3-4 years ?
There was a time, people thought that 13B-REW's max HP was 400.
03-23-2007, 02:30 PM
#29
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^ I hear what you guys are saying, but you guys are acting like those two cars can't handle curves. Both those cars have history and is known for there above the line handeling performance when a proper suspension setup is aquired on both cars, which has been proven in the past. Trust me, i am with you on the 8 as being a solid chassis out of the box. But i have a feeling that these two will be equally potent and entertaining in the corner department out of the box.
Second, most people who buy those cars probally aren't worrying about how much it will cost to mod the new GT-R and M3 because they have money to spend. Of course there will be a few out there who could only afford the car and not mod it, also eating P&J sandwhiches for the next 6 years of the loan term.
My friend makes 30 grand more than me, he bought a Z-06 , next week he is putting on a Basani exhaust for $1300 installed. $1300 bucks to him is like $130, where as $1300 to me , i will have to question such a purchase.
So i say that to say this, most people who are going to buy those cars, i am safely assuming , will have the money to spend on mods.
Second, most people who buy those cars probally aren't worrying about how much it will cost to mod the new GT-R and M3 because they have money to spend. Of course there will be a few out there who could only afford the car and not mod it, also eating P&J sandwhiches for the next 6 years of the loan term.
My friend makes 30 grand more than me, he bought a Z-06 , next week he is putting on a Basani exhaust for $1300 installed. $1300 bucks to him is like $130, where as $1300 to me , i will have to question such a purchase.
So i say that to say this, most people who are going to buy those cars, i am safely assuming , will have the money to spend on mods.
03-23-2007, 02:35 PM
#30
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I know lots of people who buys cars they cant afford. That is the world we live in. Most people who buy those cars will be happy with what they are in stock form, it is a few who mod them.
03-23-2007, 03:37 PM
#31
Interesting that no-one has mentioned the fact that the rest of the RX8 was not built to handle 400hp .
How long do you think the gearbox , diff , driveshaft , axles , brakes etc are going to last with double the factory hp ripping through them .
There is a certain hp level this car will be reasonably reliable at and it will be a lot less than 400 . So what fun will it be keeping up with a new v8 M3 for two laps only to have your gearbox explode on lap 3 ?
How long do you think the gearbox , diff , driveshaft , axles , brakes etc are going to last with double the factory hp ripping through them .
There is a certain hp level this car will be reasonably reliable at and it will be a lot less than 400 . So what fun will it be keeping up with a new v8 M3 for two laps only to have your gearbox explode on lap 3 ?
03-23-2007, 03:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Tigster
^^ If people think it is $$$ to mod an rx8, just try to mod an M3.
go check a price on a Porsche exhaust and report back.
03-23-2007, 03:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Brettus
Interesting that no-one has mentioned the fact that the rest of the RX8 was not built to handle 400hp .
How long do you think the gearbox , diff , driveshaft , axles , brakes etc are going to last with double the factory hp ripping through them .
There is a certain hp level this car will be reasonably reliable at and it will be a lot less than 400 . So what fun will it be keeping up with a new v8 M3 for two laps only to have your gearbox explode on lap 3 ?
How long do you think the gearbox , diff , driveshaft , axles , brakes etc are going to last with double the factory hp ripping through them .
There is a certain hp level this car will be reasonably reliable at and it will be a lot less than 400 . So what fun will it be keeping up with a new v8 M3 for two laps only to have your gearbox explode on lap 3 ?
03-23-2007, 03:50 PM
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Originally Posted by BlueRenesis82
yep, seems like people would rather just dump 60k in a new car than make a 8k investment in the car they already have
Partially true -- but its not as simple as 8Gs to mod. The reason I said $15,000 to mod is because If I was going to do this it has to be done RIGHT. Sure I could buy a turbo for 8000 dollars and do everything myself, but it would take me 3 months to install it and I would **** something up. Besides, to get the power out of the kit, I would have to buy a few other things as well to make the kit really shine (from what ive read)
What others have said is true, i realize I cant just drop a $10,000 turbo into the car and expect everything else to work 100% fine forever, pushing twice the power thru the tranny? Has me worried to say the least.
I agree that a modded M3 will toast even a Mazsport 8. And I always look at the price vs the gain of things (thats actually the whole point of my thread) I wouldnt have to eat PB&J's for 4 years but I know the value of a dollar and *IF* i were to buy an M3-V8 for as much as I paid for it I wouldnt even think about modding till its paid off and Ive enjoyed my initial purchase.
Thanks for all the input fellas - I'm glad I'm not the only one that is enticed by the M3 but still having thoughts about the RX8's potential.
03-23-2007, 03:54 PM
#36
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Originally Posted by nycgps
The engine is great, but its a completely new beast that ppl have yet to know its true potential.
It took Mazda a LONG *** while to get the power that we got today. Do you really expect people outside to be able to know everything about this engine in 3-4 years ?
There was a time, people thought that 13B-REW's max HP was 400.
It took Mazda a LONG *** while to get the power that we got today. Do you really expect people outside to be able to know everything about this engine in 3-4 years ?
There was a time, people thought that 13B-REW's max HP was 400.
03-23-2007, 03:59 PM
#37
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Originally Posted by Brettus
Interesting that no-one has mentioned the fact that the rest of the RX8 was not built to handle 400hp .
How long do you think the gearbox , diff , driveshaft , axles , brakes etc are going to last with double the factory hp ripping through them .
There is a certain hp level this car will be reasonably reliable at and it will be a lot less than 400 . So what fun will it be keeping up with a new v8 M3 for two laps only to have your gearbox explode on lap 3 ?
How long do you think the gearbox , diff , driveshaft , axles , brakes etc are going to last with double the factory hp ripping through them .
There is a certain hp level this car will be reasonably reliable at and it will be a lot less than 400 . So what fun will it be keeping up with a new v8 M3 for two laps only to have your gearbox explode on lap 3 ?
And the brakes in the RX-8 are more than ample, even by the standard of cars that weigh much more. A good track compound and fluid would probably be enough, but if not there are aftermarket brake kits. And anyone running 400bhp should be running wider, stickier tires which will also help in the braking/traction department.
03-23-2007, 03:59 PM
#38
This thread is hilarious. Can I mod my Rx-8 to take out these two cars which don't yet exist? Sure, why not? throw enough money at something and you can do anything.
I could make a geo metro take out these future cars too, and it will weigh less than the 8.
At the end of the day, it's still a 25k dollar Mazda. I'll take a heavier, slower, M3 over a 400 hp Rx-8 every day of the week. There is more to street cars than just performance. If you want a ***** to the wall performance car, stop playing in the kiddie pool and get a race car.
I could make a geo metro take out these future cars too, and it will weigh less than the 8.
At the end of the day, it's still a 25k dollar Mazda. I'll take a heavier, slower, M3 over a 400 hp Rx-8 every day of the week. There is more to street cars than just performance. If you want a ***** to the wall performance car, stop playing in the kiddie pool and get a race car.
03-23-2007, 04:04 PM
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Originally Posted by BlueEyes
This thread is hilarious. Can I mod my Rx-8 to take out these two cars which don't yet exist? Sure, why not? throw enough money at something and you can do anything.
I could make a geo metro take out these future cars too, and it will weigh less than the 8.
At the end of the day, it's still a 25k dollar Mazda. I'll take a heavier, slower, M3 over a 400 hp Rx-8 every day of the week. There is more to street cars than just performance. If you want a ***** to the wall performance car, stop playing in the kiddie pool and get a race car.
I could make a geo metro take out these future cars too, and it will weigh less than the 8.
At the end of the day, it's still a 25k dollar Mazda. I'll take a heavier, slower, M3 over a 400 hp Rx-8 every day of the week. There is more to street cars than just performance. If you want a ***** to the wall performance car, stop playing in the kiddie pool and get a race car.
03-23-2007, 04:04 PM
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hey toxin440, i say go with the mazsport turbo kits. Tune it to your needs, I dont think you'll need to max the turbos to match/beat the power to weight ratio of the M3 to have fun in the turbo-8. allocate some money to suspension setup, tune the turbo for the most average power, retain the flat torque curve, i am sure these will make you very very happy already. Afterall, the 8 isnt about straight line power.
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Last edited by Renesis_8; 09-11-2011 at 12:36 PM.
03-23-2007, 04:06 PM
#41
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Originally Posted by toxin440
Partially true -- but its not as simple as 8Gs to mod. The reason I said $15,000 to mod is because If I was going to do this it has to be done RIGHT. Sure I could buy a turbo for 8000 dollars and do everything myself, but it would take me 3 months to install it and I would **** something up. Besides, to get the power out of the kit, I would have to buy a few other things as well to make the kit really shine (from what ive read)
What others have said is true, i realize I cant just drop a $10,000 turbo into the car and expect everything else to work 100% fine forever, pushing twice the power thru the tranny? Has me worried to say the least.
I agree that a modded M3 will toast even a Mazsport 8. And I always look at the price vs the gain of things (thats actually the whole point of my thread) I wouldnt have to eat PB&J's for 4 years but I know the value of a dollar and *IF* i were to buy an M3-V8 for as much as I paid for it I wouldnt even think about modding till its paid off and Ive enjoyed my initial purchase.
Thanks for all the input fellas - I'm glad I'm not the only one that is enticed by the M3 but still having thoughts about the RX8's potential.
What others have said is true, i realize I cant just drop a $10,000 turbo into the car and expect everything else to work 100% fine forever, pushing twice the power thru the tranny? Has me worried to say the least.
I agree that a modded M3 will toast even a Mazsport 8. And I always look at the price vs the gain of things (thats actually the whole point of my thread) I wouldnt have to eat PB&J's for 4 years but I know the value of a dollar and *IF* i were to buy an M3-V8 for as much as I paid for it I wouldnt even think about modding till its paid off and Ive enjoyed my initial purchase.
Thanks for all the input fellas - I'm glad I'm not the only one that is enticed by the M3 but still having thoughts about the RX8's potential.
RX8=t3h win
just look at replacement parts, and insurance costs too......but hey, if you want to drop another 30k for a car, hope you have considered the fiscal implications too
03-23-2007, 04:10 PM
#42
Originally Posted by BlueRenesis82
there sure is. I like my 8, you like your ITR.
03-23-2007, 04:14 PM
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Originally Posted by BlueEyes
This thread is hilarious. Can I mod my Rx-8 to take out these two cars which don't yet exist? Sure, why not? throw enough money at something and you can do anything.
I could make a geo metro take out these future cars too, and it will weigh less than the 8.
At the end of the day, it's still a 25k dollar Mazda. I'll take a heavier, slower, M3 over a 400 hp Rx-8 every day of the week. There is more to street cars than just performance. If you want a ***** to the wall performance car, stop playing in the kiddie pool and get a race car.
I could make a geo metro take out these future cars too, and it will weigh less than the 8.
At the end of the day, it's still a 25k dollar Mazda. I'll take a heavier, slower, M3 over a 400 hp Rx-8 every day of the week. There is more to street cars than just performance. If you want a ***** to the wall performance car, stop playing in the kiddie pool and get a race car.
And of course you can mod most cars to compete with near anything. Would you like a gold star next to your name for that revelation?
03-23-2007, 04:23 PM
#45
I have to ask this question :
If you could have a reliable 400hp RX8 vs a V8 M3 .
Which car would you own ?
Taking resale value out of it I would go for the 8 every time .
Why ? because the 8 is a sexy car - the M3 while being a true performance car just does not look nearly as sexy .
So with the 8 you get the looks & you get the chassis - getting the 400 hp to be reliable is the hard part .
If you could have a reliable 400hp RX8 vs a V8 M3 .
Which car would you own ?
Taking resale value out of it I would go for the 8 every time .
Why ? because the 8 is a sexy car - the M3 while being a true performance car just does not look nearly as sexy .
So with the 8 you get the looks & you get the chassis - getting the 400 hp to be reliable is the hard part .
03-23-2007, 06:59 PM
#46
This is a great thread.
Well Toxin. I don't think that we can say anymore.
It sounds to me like the M3 would be more than enough for you and what you want. I know i would love to have one but i would have to keep my RX8 if I bought one. Just two different cars and it all depends on what your priorities are.
GOOD LUCK! Let us know your decision...i'll be interested to know how the car of choice performs seeing as none of them have been made yet.
::whispers:: Porsche
Well Toxin. I don't think that we can say anymore.
It sounds to me like the M3 would be more than enough for you and what you want. I know i would love to have one but i would have to keep my RX8 if I bought one. Just two different cars and it all depends on what your priorities are.
GOOD LUCK! Let us know your decision...i'll be interested to know how the car of choice performs seeing as none of them have been made yet.
::whispers:: Porsche
03-23-2007, 07:13 PM
#47
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Originally Posted by Brettus
I have to ask this question :
If you could have a reliable 400hp RX8 vs a V8 M3 .
Which car would you own ?
Taking resale value out of it I would go for the 8 every time .
Why ? because the 8 is a sexy car - the M3 while being a true performance car just does not look nearly as sexy .
So with the 8 you get the looks & you get the chassis - getting the 400 hp to be reliable is the hard part .
If you could have a reliable 400hp RX8 vs a V8 M3 .
Which car would you own ?
Taking resale value out of it I would go for the 8 every time .
Why ? because the 8 is a sexy car - the M3 while being a true performance car just does not look nearly as sexy .
So with the 8 you get the looks & you get the chassis - getting the 400 hp to be reliable is the hard part .
Exactly ...getting to 400HP is one thing, having it run at 400HP reliably "consistanly" takes effort , money, maitnance, etc.
Someone mentioned about the speed source RX-8... sure there running close or maybe shy tad off of 400 hp....but do you think they just race there Rx-8's and then put them up after a race, then bring them out for another race? I don't think so, Speedsource does alot of overhauling on those components, changing fluids, parts etc.
I had the fine oppurtunity to watch those cars live at this year Rolex 24 in Daytona, and let me tell you , as hard as those SpeedSource drivers drove those 8's , i barely think they skip out on the maitnance of those cars.
So if a race team has to keep up the maitnace to keep there cars running in optimum spec and they have way more spendabe income than the commomn joe....keeping up an 8 with 400+/- woud be a task.
My other buddy has a 200-2006 gen eclipse with the 4 banger , he slapped a turbo, engine management, bottom end , etc.... at 20 psi he is pushing close to 330 WHP. But let me tell you his car is a P.O.S...totaly unreliable, constanly breaking down ,constantly breaking components, always tinkering with it .... He estimated along with his car , mods,he probaly spent cose to 55k bucks....
To drive a car that works half of the time. 55k he coud have had plenty of cars that would have given him the same speed experience and woud have peace of mind wondering would his car start or not start in the morning.
I had a 300ZX TTZ stage IV upgrade in the past , and for the N/A guys we would always tell them , its alot cheaper to sell there N/A Z , then buy yourself a TTZ and go mod happy with it. Turboing any N/A car is a hassle and it takes alot of time , grief , and not to mention alot of money to get where most N/A owners want to be.
If i were you i would go and buy the Gt-R twin turbo ,450HP at your disposable and the sky wil be the limit for mods, not to mention ungodly HP gains. Thats if your craving warp speed.... if not and you want a happy medium then opt for the M3.
03-23-2007, 09:57 PM
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Originally Posted by DailyDriver2k5
Exactly ...getting to 400HP is one thing, having it run at 400HP reliably "consistanly" takes effort , money, maitnance, etc.
Someone mentioned about the speed source RX-8... sure there running close or maybe shy tad off of 400 hp....but do you think they just race there Rx-8's and then put them up after a race, then bring them out for another race? I don't think so, Speedsource does alot of overhauling on those components, changing fluids, parts etc.
I had the fine oppurtunity to watch those cars live at this year Rolex 24 in Daytona, and let me tell you , as hard as those SpeedSource drivers drove those 8's , i barely think they skip out on the maitnance of those cars.
So if a race team has to keep up the maitnace to keep there cars running in optimum spec and they have way more spendabe income than the commomn joe....keeping up an 8 with 400+/- woud be a task.
My other buddy has a 200-2006 gen eclipse with the 4 banger , he slapped a turbo, engine management, bottom end , etc.... at 20 psi he is pushing close to 330 WHP. But let me tell you his car is a P.O.S...totaly unreliable, constanly breaking down ,constantly breaking components, always tinkering with it .... He estimated along with his car , mods,he probaly spent cose to 55k bucks....
To drive a car that works half of the time. 55k he coud have had plenty of cars that would have given him the same speed experience and woud have peace of mind wondering would his car start or not start in the morning.
I had a 300ZX TTZ stage IV upgrade in the past , and for the N/A guys we would always tell them , its alot cheaper to sell there N/A Z , then buy yourself a TTZ and go mod happy with it. Turboing any N/A car is a hassle and it takes alot of time , grief , and not to mention alot of money to get where most N/A owners want to be.
If i were you i would go and buy the Gt-R twin turbo ,450HP at your disposable and the sky wil be the limit for mods, not to mention ungodly HP gains. Thats if your craving warp speed.... if not and you want a happy medium then opt for the M3.
Someone mentioned about the speed source RX-8... sure there running close or maybe shy tad off of 400 hp....but do you think they just race there Rx-8's and then put them up after a race, then bring them out for another race? I don't think so, Speedsource does alot of overhauling on those components, changing fluids, parts etc.
I had the fine oppurtunity to watch those cars live at this year Rolex 24 in Daytona, and let me tell you , as hard as those SpeedSource drivers drove those 8's , i barely think they skip out on the maitnance of those cars.
So if a race team has to keep up the maitnace to keep there cars running in optimum spec and they have way more spendabe income than the commomn joe....keeping up an 8 with 400+/- woud be a task.
My other buddy has a 200-2006 gen eclipse with the 4 banger , he slapped a turbo, engine management, bottom end , etc.... at 20 psi he is pushing close to 330 WHP. But let me tell you his car is a P.O.S...totaly unreliable, constanly breaking down ,constantly breaking components, always tinkering with it .... He estimated along with his car , mods,he probaly spent cose to 55k bucks....
To drive a car that works half of the time. 55k he coud have had plenty of cars that would have given him the same speed experience and woud have peace of mind wondering would his car start or not start in the morning.
I had a 300ZX TTZ stage IV upgrade in the past , and for the N/A guys we would always tell them , its alot cheaper to sell there N/A Z , then buy yourself a TTZ and go mod happy with it. Turboing any N/A car is a hassle and it takes alot of time , grief , and not to mention alot of money to get where most N/A owners want to be.
If i were you i would go and buy the Gt-R twin turbo ,450HP at your disposable and the sky wil be the limit for mods, not to mention ungodly HP gains. Thats if your craving warp speed.... if not and you want a happy medium then opt for the M3.
03-23-2007, 10:04 PM
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Originally Posted by BlueEyes
That doesn't make much sense. I like your Rx8 too, I just didn't feel like spending the money on one.
03-23-2007, 10:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Red Devil
That's interesting, I thought we were talking about "the kiddie pool" since we're specifically discussing street cars. What does a race car have to do with this topic?
And of course you can mod most cars to compete with near anything. Would you like a gold star next to your name for that revelation?
And of course you can mod most cars to compete with near anything. Would you like a gold star next to your name for that revelation?