Running hot after Pettit street ported engine instal
02-19-2016, 07:07 AM
#51
02-19-2016, 02:43 PM
#52
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Originally Posted by Love_Hounds
Only 04 and 05 autos and other low power models had one oil cooler, once Mazda switched all models to the 6 port, they all got 2.
02-19-2016, 06:03 PM
#54
02-19-2016, 09:50 PM
#55
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No VFAD on the port autos either. As for the oil coolers, well oil temps don't really climb until you get in the high revs and Autos don't so the second cooler is not needed. They do need a trans cooler though and I installed one on a 2007 Auto that is heavily tracked by a local stig who is disabled.
02-19-2016, 10:11 PM
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Originally Posted by 9krpmrx8
No VFAD on the port autos either. As for the oil coolers, well oil temps don't really climb until you get in the high revs and Autos don't so the second cooler is not needed. They do need a trans cooler though and I installed one on a 2007 Auto that is heavily tracked by a local stig who is disabled.
Well weirdly my car has that too! For quite a while I thought all autos have only one oil cooler. I thought the other one of them was a transmission cooler. A few months back I found out that the transmission cooler lives inside the radiator
So automatic cars have a smaller capacity radiator?
02-20-2016, 08:54 AM
#57
Cooler in the radiator is just a piece of tubing. Does not take up much space.
I think the non VAFD cars have a box in front of air box, it just turns right and pulls air out of the ******* that runs across the front of the radiator. VAFD is a door on the box. you have it if there is a vacuum actuator on the air box.
I think the non VAFD cars have a box in front of air box, it just turns right and pulls air out of the ******* that runs across the front of the radiator. VAFD is a door on the box. you have it if there is a vacuum actuator on the air box.
02-20-2016, 09:53 AM
#58
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VFAD is the little rectangular intake duct at the beginning of the air intake hose yeah? Opens up at high RPM? That didn't come on the autos? Well weirdly my car has that too!
For quite a while I thought all autos have only one oil cooler. I thought the other one of them was a transmission cooler. A few months back I found out that the transmission cooler lives inside the radiator So automatic cars have a smaller capacity radiator?
Well weirdly my car has that too! For quite a while I thought all autos have only one oil cooler. I thought the other one of them was a transmission cooler. A few months back I found out that the transmission cooler lives inside the radiator
So automatic cars have a smaller capacity radiator?2010 Auto air box inlet on top and 2009 R3 inlet.
Last edited by 9krpmrx8; 02-20-2016 at 09:58 AM.
02-20-2016, 11:22 AM
#59
I didn't read anyone talking about the possibility of failed oil injectors causing the oil consumption? OP did you check your oil injectors while the engine was out or before you installed the new motor? If they're not working properly they could be injecting too much oil and not properly atomizing the oil being injected.
..........Oh hell, just realized this thread is 3 pages long so possibly someone DID mention it already and I haven't read it all, if they did then I guess I just repeated it.
..........Oh hell, just realized this thread is 3 pages long so possibly someone DID mention it already and I haven't read it all, if they did then I guess I just repeated it.
Last edited by FunRun8; 02-20-2016 at 11:24 AM.
02-21-2016, 12:42 AM
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Originally Posted by 9krpmrx8
2010 Auto air box inlet on top and 2009 R3 inlet.
02-24-2016, 10:12 PM
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I didn't read anyone talking about the possibility of failed oil injectors causing the oil consumption? OP did you check your oil injectors while the engine was out or before you installed the new motor? If they're not working properly they could be injecting too much oil and not properly atomizing the oil being injected.
..........Oh hell, just realized this thread is 3 pages long so possibly someone DID mention it already and I haven't read it all, if they did then I guess I just repeated it.
..........Oh hell, just realized this thread is 3 pages long so possibly someone DID mention it already and I haven't read it all, if they did then I guess I just repeated it.
Anywho the update is that I recently changed the Trans as my second gear synchro was causing issues. Surprisingly the car is running cooler now. But still at a 100.
02-24-2016, 11:17 PM
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First things first bro, next time you're posting, convert the temps to Fahrenheit and the distance to miles. It's a lot easier for us because everyone here uses Fahrenheit and miles. They would understand you more.
Onto your issue.
These cars do smell like coolant. Specially near the radiator/coolant reservoir area. If it's obnoxiously bad, then you probably have a leak. But if it's a mild coolant smell every time you get close to the reservoir, I wouldn't worry about it.
Regarding the cooling issue, try doing the following
1) About the leak, maybe it's leaking from where you cut the hose to put the water temp sensor? Start the car, let it warm up and check that area for leaks. But Don't burn yourself :P report back.
2) Mark the coolant level on the coolant tank. Check after a drive and see if it has dropped. If it hasn't, check again the next day after a drive. Watch it for a week to be extra sure. Don't be alarmed if the coolant level has dropped an inch after the car has cooled down. Coolant expands as the car warms up. So, if you're checking the level, check when it's cold. Every morning would be perfect.
3) Pressure testing a cooling system is easy. Take it to any ghetto radiator shop beside the road and tell them to pressure test it. Wouldn't take 5 mins. Though you'll have to let your car cool down first. Report back.
4) Idling in hot wether does make the temps hit 105C, or 220F. Sad but true. BUT, and this is a big but, at 23-26C (73-79F) ambient temps, it shouldn't be that hot. For my car to hit 220F, it has to be at least 35C (95F) outside.
Do this test. Drive over 70km/h in 6th gear for about a minute continuously. The highway would be perfect for this. Check the temps. Does it drop to around 200F? If it does, then the problem is your fans. Your fans might be spinning, they might be loud, but they might not be spinning fast enough. The stock fans are known to slow down with age. Since you said this only happens at idle, I'm ready to bet it's the fans. But do this test first to know for sure.
Regarding the oil leak, I have no clue. Other members will help you with that
Good luck!
Onto your issue.
These cars do smell like coolant. Specially near the radiator/coolant reservoir area. If it's obnoxiously bad, then you probably have a leak. But if it's a mild coolant smell every time you get close to the reservoir, I wouldn't worry about it.
Regarding the cooling issue, try doing the following
1) About the leak, maybe it's leaking from where you cut the hose to put the water temp sensor? Start the car, let it warm up and check that area for leaks. But Don't burn yourself :P report back.
2) Mark the coolant level on the coolant tank. Check after a drive and see if it has dropped. If it hasn't, check again the next day after a drive. Watch it for a week to be extra sure. Don't be alarmed if the coolant level has dropped an inch after the car has cooled down. Coolant expands as the car warms up. So, if you're checking the level, check when it's cold. Every morning would be perfect.
3) Pressure testing a cooling system is easy. Take it to any ghetto radiator shop beside the road and tell them to pressure test it. Wouldn't take 5 mins. Though you'll have to let your car cool down first. Report back.
4) Idling in hot wether does make the temps hit 105C, or 220F. Sad but true. BUT, and this is a big but, at 23-26C (73-79F) ambient temps, it shouldn't be that hot. For my car to hit 220F, it has to be at least 35C (95F) outside.
Do this test. Drive over 70km/h in 6th gear for about a minute continuously. The highway would be perfect for this. Check the temps. Does it drop to around 200F? If it does, then the problem is your fans. Your fans might be spinning, they might be loud, but they might not be spinning fast enough. The stock fans are known to slow down with age. Since you said this only happens at idle, I'm ready to bet it's the fans. But do this test first to know for sure.
Regarding the oil leak, I have no clue. Other members will help you with that
Good luck!
So I did the fan test at 70km/hr on 6th gear and the temps went down to 91C or 196 Fahrenheit. Should I get the fans changed or check for carbon
02-24-2016, 11:18 PM
#63
Well if an injector or injectors are failing and the thin membrane inside which separates the vacuum from the oil sides of the injector is too weak or damaged then they do not have the proper resistance to the engine vacuum that comes from the counter vacuum from the intake and they will use too much oil. They are precisely metered for opposing vacuum forces at a given vacuum rate and if they are able to get oil more easily then they should because of a failed membrane then you will use more oil. I'm not surprised you over looked it, they are all too often not given the consideration they deserve and require. It's certain failing injectors cause more engine failures then are being considered since they are so difficult to get at to check and so misunderstood. You can also get oil returning back through the injector through the intake into the manifold as well, while that's a lesser symptom, it contributes to the gumming up of the intake valves, etc.
In order to check them you have to take off the intake and remove them and vacuum test them or at a minimum if you don't have a vacuum testing tool, you can gently suck through one side and you should not be able to suck through, if you can they need replacing. The other side obviously should not allow you to blow through while gently blowing, it is very low vacuum needed to open and close them.
The engine vacuum eventually over rides the intake vacuum and that introduces an air bubble multiple times per second into the oil, this causes a "burp" in the injector and the air introduced both interrupts the oil flow during the cycle each time as well as aiding in atomizing the oil in a light spray for it to be injected into the combustion chamber, instead of just dripping in in one place. The OMP is only to keep oil flowing into the injector to be pulled into the chamber it is low pressure. In fact if you look into the oil port in the chamber inside the engine if you get a chance to, the injector sits quite a bit recessed in from the opening and the oil would merely drip very slowly without the way it's designed and would not be very effective at all.
If you do this and the car is higher mileage you must consider possibly replacing them and the OMP lines too, it's really silly not to, given cost and time, not doing so is gambling with your engine. At the same time must also consider cleaning all intake valves and the like, I'd also clean the fuel injectors too, most of this is just labor saved and well invested preventative and performance maintenance, not that much cost.
In order to check them you have to take off the intake and remove them and vacuum test them or at a minimum if you don't have a vacuum testing tool, you can gently suck through one side and you should not be able to suck through, if you can they need replacing. The other side obviously should not allow you to blow through while gently blowing, it is very low vacuum needed to open and close them.
The engine vacuum eventually over rides the intake vacuum and that introduces an air bubble multiple times per second into the oil, this causes a "burp" in the injector and the air introduced both interrupts the oil flow during the cycle each time as well as aiding in atomizing the oil in a light spray for it to be injected into the combustion chamber, instead of just dripping in in one place. The OMP is only to keep oil flowing into the injector to be pulled into the chamber it is low pressure. In fact if you look into the oil port in the chamber inside the engine if you get a chance to, the injector sits quite a bit recessed in from the opening and the oil would merely drip very slowly without the way it's designed and would not be very effective at all.
If you do this and the car is higher mileage you must consider possibly replacing them and the OMP lines too, it's really silly not to, given cost and time, not doing so is gambling with your engine. At the same time must also consider cleaning all intake valves and the like, I'd also clean the fuel injectors too, most of this is just labor saved and well invested preventative and performance maintenance, not that much cost.
Last edited by FunRun8; 02-24-2016 at 11:21 PM.
02-25-2016, 12:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Third8
So I did the fan test at 70km/hr on 6th gear and the temps went down to 91C or 196 Fahrenheit. Should I get the fans changed or check for carbon
My guess is, your fans are blowing hot air back to the front of the radiator through the sides.
Seal around the radiator. I did it and now I can idle in 35C (95F) weather and the coolant temp would not go over 102C (215F).
Easiest way to do this is to take the front bumper off. You can take off the under tray too, if you have a lift. If not, you can do it from the radiator air intake (below the bumper). It's gonna suck but hey! It's free
1) Get a big sponge roll, cut it to thin stripes and stuff it around the sides of the radiator. It has to cover the gap between the radiator and it's surrounding panels so that no hot air can blow through. Those are the gaps between the radiator and the under tray, plastic sides and the top. Make sure it fits snugly. It has to hold when you're doing 100km/h plus :P
2) Start the car and wait till the fans go on full speed. Turning on the AC on full speed should make the fans go on high. Get in front of the car and CAREFULLY put your hand in through the radiator air intake (below the bumper). CAREFULLY feel around the radiator for hot air.
3) If you're feeling hot air, stop the engine and seal it with more sponge.
Note - there's an open area towards the side of the radiator air intake. It's right where the sides of the under tray and the front bumper meets. Big opening. Lots of hot air coming through. Seal it.
Repeat steps 2 and 3 until you feel very little hot air coming through.
4) Hot weather test it. Take it for a test drive and idle in the hot sun. If you did everything right, you should notice a big drop in temps.
Let us know the temps!
02-25-2016, 09:52 AM
#66
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You do not want to completely seal around the radiator. You need to allow for air to escape around the radiator. But this is why you troubleshoot problems instead of doing random things and guessing.
02-25-2016, 09:24 PM
#69
IMHO, radiator is one big freaking air leak. But, you are right. Too big a seal will blow out someplace else. Ideally the air will just go through the radiator. I do know the pipe foam is good to at least 130, tested on a nice safe race track.
My first guess though is a bad fan. This will take out the low turn on point AND create a massive air leak.
My first guess though is a bad fan. This will take out the low turn on point AND create a massive air leak.
02-25-2016, 09:56 PM
#70
IMHO, radiator is one big freaking air leak. But, you are right. Too big a seal will blow out someplace else. Ideally the air will just go through the radiator. I do know the pipe foam is good to at least 130, tested on a nice safe race track.
My first guess though is a bad fan. This will take out the low turn on point AND create a massive air leak.
My first guess though is a bad fan. This will take out the low turn on point AND create a massive air leak.
02-25-2016, 11:41 PM
#71
Definitely not, they are there to create an air flow vacuum from the air passing underneath the car to extract heat from the engine bay as the air flows over them and relieve lift pressure that gets caught in the engine bay and makes the car light at higher speeds.
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