Finally a plug and play ECU!!!
08-04-2005, 12:11 PM
#51
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Originally Posted by brillo
I just got off the phone with Scott at Mazsport, who was kind enough to spend 30 minutes explaining the theory, features, design and testing that make this little wonder box possible.
To start with, Scott has tested the box for over 3K miles, with several different drivers including his wife in mostly urban driving to really get the daily drivability of the car down. To day the only codes thrown have been LT fuel trim is rich (due to the turbo on the car) and no CEL. The software and cable will run about $125 extra but may be offered at a discount if purchased with the unit. Scott is running factory spark plugs, wires and coils.
The box sits on top of the stock ECU and plugs in much the same way as the Canzoomer box did. As stated earlier, it basically tricks the stock ECU into a virtual car mode, where it thinks everything is just peachy in its own happy world.
The major feature highlights include:
-16x16 maps for full fuel and spark tables
-Adjustable leading and trailing split
-Idle enrichment and ignition control (but not RPM control)
-Full use of ABS, DSC Radio, A/C (cruise control was an issue, this bug is being worked on)
-Ignition split does not switch between negative and positive at idle (you have to choose one or the other)
-CEL’s / error codes still work for all equipment (the car can complain, but can’t do anything about it)
- The unit will come with pre tuned maps for certain turbo kits, but can be customized with the software if the user desires
- Will work for NA cars, although he doesn't have a NA map yet as he has been working to get the turbo folks setup (he is planning to dyno a stock car with it soon)
Hope this answers both questions and prayers
To start with, Scott has tested the box for over 3K miles, with several different drivers including his wife in mostly urban driving to really get the daily drivability of the car down. To day the only codes thrown have been LT fuel trim is rich (due to the turbo on the car) and no CEL. The software and cable will run about $125 extra but may be offered at a discount if purchased with the unit. Scott is running factory spark plugs, wires and coils.
The box sits on top of the stock ECU and plugs in much the same way as the Canzoomer box did. As stated earlier, it basically tricks the stock ECU into a virtual car mode, where it thinks everything is just peachy in its own happy world.
The major feature highlights include:
-16x16 maps for full fuel and spark tables
-Adjustable leading and trailing split
-Idle enrichment and ignition control (but not RPM control)
-Full use of ABS, DSC Radio, A/C (cruise control was an issue, this bug is being worked on)
-Ignition split does not switch between negative and positive at idle (you have to choose one or the other)
-CEL’s / error codes still work for all equipment (the car can complain, but can’t do anything about it)
- The unit will come with pre tuned maps for certain turbo kits, but can be customized with the software if the user desires
- Will work for NA cars, although he doesn't have a NA map yet as he has been working to get the turbo folks setup (he is planning to dyno a stock car with it soon)
Hope this answers both questions and prayers
Does this mean :
- it can only control fuel in open loop?
- knock control is disabled?
Fabrice
08-04-2005, 12:31 PM
#54
Go Texas Longhorns!
Originally Posted by Rasputin
-16x16 maps for full fuel and spark tables
Does this mean :
- it can only control fuel in open loop?
- knock control is disabled?
Fabrice
Does this mean :
- it can only control fuel in open loop?
- knock control is disabled?
Fabrice
08-04-2005, 12:35 PM
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Open and closed? Damn that sounds like a powerful system... I would love to see the dyno results on a N/A engine.
This might be worth considering for those people with a non-turbo setup if the potential is there. It would be great if they could tune a car with this setup to prove it's worth for a N/A car.
Is there that much to gain in closed though?
This might be worth considering for those people with a non-turbo setup if the potential is there. It would be great if they could tune a car with this setup to prove it's worth for a N/A car.
Is there that much to gain in closed though?
Last edited by davefzr; 08-04-2005 at 12:37 PM.
08-04-2005, 12:40 PM
#56
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Open and closed-loop conditions are meaningless with this. It has full control over both fuel and timing. If the stock ECU thinks its in closed loop, it won't matter because its grubby little hands aren't in control of things anymore anyway!
08-04-2005, 12:43 PM
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Would it function similar to an EManage Gold ? In talking with Jon over at PTP, here is what he lists the main advantage of the "gold" vs. the "blue" EManage.
"The new emanage allows you to eliminate the MAF sensor. It also allows you to control the injectors trim instead of just being able to add fuel pulse. This is the most important feature I believe mainly because before to take away fuel you had to modify the Airflow Map which in turn modifies timing. This is not something you want to happen everytime you try to pull fuel away. The new ecu now taps into the crank trigger which enables the user to see ACTUAL ignition timing and datalog it. This is also very helpful in the tuning process. They also added cool features like TPS accel maps for timing and fuel. Coolant temp and Air temp fuel enrichment maps. Target Air/Fuel map for those willing to purchase a Wideband o2 Sensor and it will datalog Air/Fuel ratio to assist in tuning. And a few other options but I have a few orders to ship I gotta go... If you want more info just call me."
"The new emanage allows you to eliminate the MAF sensor. It also allows you to control the injectors trim instead of just being able to add fuel pulse. This is the most important feature I believe mainly because before to take away fuel you had to modify the Airflow Map which in turn modifies timing. This is not something you want to happen everytime you try to pull fuel away. The new ecu now taps into the crank trigger which enables the user to see ACTUAL ignition timing and datalog it. This is also very helpful in the tuning process. They also added cool features like TPS accel maps for timing and fuel. Coolant temp and Air temp fuel enrichment maps. Target Air/Fuel map for those willing to purchase a Wideband o2 Sensor and it will datalog Air/Fuel ratio to assist in tuning. And a few other options but I have a few orders to ship I gotta go... If you want more info just call me."
08-04-2005, 02:09 PM
#62
Originally Posted by smrx8
holy crap this guy hit the jack pot
they were very sneaky to spring this on us though :D
08-04-2005, 02:27 PM
#63
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LOL
i'm going to try and get in on the first batch of these, but with all this demand, i'm not sure i'll have the money in time!
i also talked at length about this unit with Scott a few weeks ago. this pretty much does everything you would ever need to do with the car's computer. quite a feat considering our PCM's are pratically marvels of artificial intelligence (the car even shows it name on startup!). the interceptor is a far cry from some resistor box with some memory on it (cough, emanage). Mazsport put a great amount of R&D into this unit and brought in the best resources possible...honestly the $1650 is a deal if you're truely serious about your car.
i'm going to try and get in on the first batch of these, but with all this demand, i'm not sure i'll have the money in time!
i also talked at length about this unit with Scott a few weeks ago. this pretty much does everything you would ever need to do with the car's computer. quite a feat considering our PCM's are pratically marvels of artificial intelligence (the car even shows it name on startup!). the interceptor is a far cry from some resistor box with some memory on it (cough, emanage). Mazsport put a great amount of R&D into this unit and brought in the best resources possible...honestly the $1650 is a deal if you're truely serious about your car.
08-04-2005, 02:35 PM
#65
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When you adjust a map based system, you don't necessarily need closed loop. On my Megasquirt I do have closed loop but I have the cruising parts of the map set really lean anyways so it really doesn't matter. closed loop will just try to hold 14.7:1. I can set my maps up at cruise to hold 15+:1 and run leaner. You get the idea. It probably has closed loop but you don't necessarily need it if you've tuned the map to do everything. You definitely don't need 2 different maps for 2 different uses.
08-04-2005, 02:36 PM
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The most useful thing for gas milage is to keep your foot out of it :D.
Meh, I don't know much about this stuff though...I'd guess it must have a TPS sensor to be able to allow it to be adjusted for various part-throttle operation?
Anyway, I'm curious about the video...I see that they pretty much stopped it before 9k most of the time. Did it just stop making power and therefore continuing to push it was pointless, or has the 9k range become dangerous?
Meh, I don't know much about this stuff though...I'd guess it must have a TPS sensor to be able to allow it to be adjusted for various part-throttle operation?
Anyway, I'm curious about the video...I see that they pretty much stopped it before 9k most of the time. Did it just stop making power and therefore continuing to push it was pointless, or has the 9k range become dangerous?
08-04-2005, 02:59 PM
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Originally Posted by rotarygod
When you adjust a map based system, you don't necessarily need closed loop. On my Megasquirt I do have closed loop but I have the cruising parts of the map set really lean anyways so it really doesn't matter. closed loop will just try to hold 14.7:1. I can set my maps up at cruise to hold 15+:1 and run leaner. You get the idea. It probably has closed loop but you don't necessarily need it if you've tuned the map to do everything. You definitely don't need 2 different maps for 2 different uses.
08-04-2005, 03:24 PM
#68
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I'm sure this sytem is no different in practice than my or most other ecu's. What mine does if I set it up to do so is to stay in closed loop below a certain throttle level say 20% or so. Above this it goes into open loop. This is perfect for steady cruise speeds. Mine has the ability however to stay in closed loop everywhere and be controlled by a wideband 02 sensor. I can program whatever a/f ratio I want at whatever load and rpm I want and the ecu will automatically correct for it. That takes alot of work out of tuning. It isn't necessary to do it this way though.
DreamWarrior: Yes you tap into the stock tps signal and feed it into the new ecu. You need tps voltage (% of throttle open), rpm, and map (manifold air pressure). When you have all of these, you can tell on a fuel/ignition map where the car is within the map at all times and adjust timing/fuel according to the needs of that load and rpm. It actually doesn't take that much processor speed to do it. Most of the stock ecu's power is consumed by the fact that it controls damn near everything else in the car at the same time.
DreamWarrior: Yes you tap into the stock tps signal and feed it into the new ecu. You need tps voltage (% of throttle open), rpm, and map (manifold air pressure). When you have all of these, you can tell on a fuel/ignition map where the car is within the map at all times and adjust timing/fuel according to the needs of that load and rpm. It actually doesn't take that much processor speed to do it. Most of the stock ecu's power is consumed by the fact that it controls damn near everything else in the car at the same time.
08-04-2005, 03:31 PM
#69
Go Texas Longhorns!
Originally Posted by rotarygod
I'm sure this sytem is no different in practice than my or most other ecu's. What mine does if I set it up to do so is to stay in closed loop below a certain throttle level say 20% or so. Above this it goes into open loop. This is perfect for steady cruise speeds. Mine has the ability however to stay in closed loop everywhere and be controlled by a wideband 02 sensor. I can program whatever a/f ratio I want at whatever load and rpm I want and the ecu will automatically correct for it. That takes alot of work out of tuning. It isn't necessary to do it this way though.
DreamWarrior: Yes you tap into the stock tps signal and feed it into the new ecu. You need tps voltage (% of throttle open), rpm, and map (manifold air pressure). When you have all of these, you can tell on a fuel/ignition map where the car is within the map at all times and adjust timing/fuel according to the needs of that load and rpm. It actually doesn't take that much processor speed to do it. Most of the stock ecu's power is consumed by the fact that it controls damn near everything else in the car at the same time.
DreamWarrior: Yes you tap into the stock tps signal and feed it into the new ecu. You need tps voltage (% of throttle open), rpm, and map (manifold air pressure). When you have all of these, you can tell on a fuel/ignition map where the car is within the map at all times and adjust timing/fuel according to the needs of that load and rpm. It actually doesn't take that much processor speed to do it. Most of the stock ecu's power is consumed by the fact that it controls damn near everything else in the car at the same time.
08-04-2005, 03:43 PM
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Wasnt Maurice ( canzoomer ) working with an unnamed company on A different ECU than the E-MANAGE for both TURBO and NA RX8'S , could this new Mazport system have something to do with him .???
B...free
michael
B...free
michael
08-04-2005, 03:57 PM
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Originally Posted by rotarygod
Mine has the ability however to stay in closed loop everywhere and be controlled by a wideband 02 sensor. I can program whatever a/f ratio I want at whatever load and rpm I want and the ecu will automatically correct for it. That takes alot of work out of tuning.
Something really cool to think about: if you could get a ECU that has individual 'cylinder' trim and multiple wideband o2 inputs, you can trim the AFR per rotor (or more likely, per injector). Put one sensor in each pipe of the header, before the collector. The factory injectors only have a tolerance of 1-2%, which can result in 5% or more variations in AFR between rotors. The power gain seen in 4 cylinder motors with individual cylinder tuning is more substantial than one might think.
Another thing: cat's only really work at stochiometric AFR's, so if you want to pass emissions, your low-load, partial-throttle map areas should aim for 14.7.
08-04-2005, 04:04 PM
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Well, being my typical early adopter self -- I just ordered one.
Scott said that the first batch should be shipped by the end of the month. Spent 30 minutes on the phone with Mazsport -- seems like they really have their act together (cough -- unlike SSR - cough cough). He mentioned there will be a number of planned stages for upgrades to the turbo kit. After this ECU the next will be a custom machining of the GReddy turbo to add about 20% capacity so that greater boost can be taken to the higher RPM range -- Scott said this should take us well over 300whp with the stock injectors, etc. :D He also talked about an upgrade for the intake to get lower intake temps.
Scott said that the first batch should be shipped by the end of the month. Spent 30 minutes on the phone with Mazsport -- seems like they really have their act together (cough -- unlike SSR - cough cough). He mentioned there will be a number of planned stages for upgrades to the turbo kit. After this ECU the next will be a custom machining of the GReddy turbo to add about 20% capacity so that greater boost can be taken to the higher RPM range -- Scott said this should take us well over 300whp with the stock injectors, etc. :D He also talked about an upgrade for the intake to get lower intake temps.