'06 STI vs. Evo IX MR Round 1
11-13-2005, 12:34 AM
#76
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Originally Posted by DARKMAZ8
What suspension did this 8 have? I just find this statement very hard to believe unless this is a stock 8 suspension we're talking about.
11-13-2005, 12:43 AM
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Originally Posted by IkeWRX
So now we're talking about modded cars? Give me a freaking break man
11-13-2005, 12:45 AM
#78
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Originally Posted by IkeWRX
Care to explain to me how it gets bigger and bigger? The scoop got smaller for the '06 model, in fact it's the STI scoop is the same size at the WRX scoop, which is the same size scoop is has been for years. It is not there as a trademark, it is there to feed air to an intercooler. But like they say, ignorance is bliss.
11-13-2005, 12:52 AM
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Originally Posted by DARKMAZ8
Care to explain why the impreza rs has a hood scoop when it doesn't have an intercooler?
11-13-2005, 12:53 AM
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Originally Posted by DARKMAZ8
Well, we both know that the 8 has a soft factory suspension. Why would someone seriously into tracking the 8 keep the stock susp. It's obvious that the evo/sti will carry a faster speed because its stock susp. is ment to. Way to really compare rwd vs. awd handling
11-13-2005, 01:04 AM
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Originally Posted by IkeWRX
You're a waste of my time, next thing you'll say is that it's not fair because the STI has FI so the RX-8 should have FI for it to be a fair comparison.
are you a retard?
You and polak were debating about rwd vs. awd entry speed. NOT rx8 vs. WRX/STI/EVO.
you're a waste of wisconsin intelligence.......
11-13-2005, 01:11 AM
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Originally Posted by DARKMAZ8
are you a retard?
You and polak were debating about rwd vs. awd entry speed. NOT rx8 vs. WRX/STI/EVO.
you're a waste of wisconsin intelligence.......
You and polak were debating about rwd vs. awd entry speed. NOT rx8 vs. WRX/STI/EVO.
you're a waste of wisconsin intelligence.......
11-13-2005, 01:23 AM
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Originally Posted by IkeWRX
Read the thread title smartguy, this thread is about the STI and Evo. What we were debating is everybit about the Evo and STI vs. various RWD cars.
This is just a waste of time to debate the same subjects over and over and over and over........
I read the tread title. It says sti vs. evo. why don't we just stick to the topic at hand?
11-13-2005, 01:26 AM
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Originally Posted by PoLaK
...2 equal weight/equal HP cars one AWD and one RWD, driving the AWD car around a track Fast does not take as much driver skill as it takes to drive that RWD car around the same track Fast...
11-13-2005, 01:42 AM
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Originally Posted by DARKMAZ8
It's not in that example.
It's not in many examples, the whole argument is flawed just like your argument that the STI is "more rice".
11-13-2005, 01:55 AM
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Originally Posted by IkeWRX
It's not in many examples, the whole argument is flawed just like your argument that the STI is "more rice".
The rwd/awd argument is a good one. Just compare cars that have similar setups. Comparing a stock 8 with an sti/evo is not a good awd/rwd comparison.
11-13-2005, 02:08 AM
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Speaking of the TMIC...doesn't the WRC Impreza have a TMIC to prevent it from being succeptable to damage from rocks, dirt, etc. The STi is the streetable incarnation of the WRC Impreza. To that end it makes sense to give it a TMIC.
11-13-2005, 02:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Steiner
Speaking of the TMIC...doesn't the WRC Impreza have a TMIC to prevent it from being succeptable to damage from rocks, dirt, etc. The STi is the streetable incarnation of the WRC Impreza. To that end it makes sense to give it a TMIC.
11-13-2005, 02:35 AM
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Originally Posted by DARKMAZ8
The rwd/awd argument is a good one. Just compare cars that have similar setups. Comparing a stock 8 with an sti/evo is not a good awd/rwd comparison.
11-13-2005, 08:17 AM
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There is ALL this talk of looks, which makes me SO sick of people as a car enthusiast sometimes.... sure it may not be drop dead gorgeous like an RX-8 which I also love, but please people, when you step into the car and turn the key, you really could give a rats *** about what it looks like. The DRIVING experience is what counts. Sure, Ill give you if the Aztec handled on rails and had an LS2 in it, I wouldnt drive it, but the STI is NOT that bad. If the STI had a 166hp 2.5i engine in it, maybe it could be criticized, but after you see one of these puppies in real life or get a ride in it, youre opinion may change.
/rant
/rant
11-13-2005, 09:13 AM
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Originally Posted by IkeWRX
Why is it a bad comparison, because the RX-8 doesn't win? The 350Z is about the same weight, has more WHP, and is every bit as stiff if not stiffer than the Evo or STI. The STi and Evo will have little problems with a 350Z on a track. Is that a good enough comparison for you?
Exiting the corner is a different story. AWD will almost always win. I don't think the sti/evo can catch an 8 in a corner if the 8 has a track tuned suspension. It sure as hell will catch it exiting the corner as both have more power and awd with a rear torque bias allows an awd car to demonstrate oversteer and traction is a whole lot better.
I have no doubt that a well set up awd car is superior on a track but lets compare cars with track suspensions not soft daily driver suspensions. I would say that the s2000 will pose problems for an sti/evo on a track. The 350z handles like a tank and the 8 just doesn't have the right suspension for this task. The s2000 does and of course I could mention other rwd cars that are mid engined but most if not all are more expensive. Take the cayman for example. I would put money that it would easily beat the sti/evo on the track. but it's almost twice the money.
If it makes you happy you are correct in most cases regarding awd vs. rwd. But only the awd with rear torque bias will worth talking about. In any case I do feel that you forgot about the driver abstract of it all. It's hard to compare cars on a track when driven by different drivers. Same driver, same track, different cars would best compare them. Not Best motoring races.
The sti has so much rwd bias that its pretty much rwd. The fronts are very lightly loaded but a long way out in front to give some control.
Last edited by DARKMAZ8; 11-13-2005 at 09:19 AM.
11-13-2005, 12:04 PM
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Originally Posted by DARKMAZ8
First off, plain wrx's understeer like crazy and it has nothing to do with the sways. The problem is its 50/50 torque split. The sti on the other hand does not have this problem because the torque bias is greater at the rear wheels. This is a very big advantage of AWD. The main disadvantage is weight. I would even be as bold to say that an integra type r will handle corners better then an sti. In the corners, The lighter car wins.
Exiting the corner is a different story. AWD will almost always win. I don't think the sti/evo can catch an 8 in a corner if the 8 has a track tuned suspension. It sure as hell will catch it exiting the corner as both have more power and awd with a rear torque bias allows an awd car to demonstrate oversteer and traction is a whole lot better.
I have no doubt that a well set up awd car is superior on a track but lets compare cars with track suspensions not soft daily driver suspensions. I would say that the s2000 will pose problems for an sti/evo on a track. The 350z handles like a tank and the 8 just doesn't have the right suspension for this task. The s2000 does and of course I could mention other rwd cars that are mid engined but most if not all are more expensive. Take the cayman for example. I would put money that it would easily beat the sti/evo on the track. but it's almost twice the money.
If it makes you happy you are correct in most cases regarding awd vs. rwd. But only the awd with rear torque bias will worth talking about. In any case I do feel that you forgot about the driver abstract of it all. It's hard to compare cars on a track when driven by different drivers. Same driver, same track, different cars would best compare them. Not Best motoring races.
The sti has so much rwd bias that its pretty much rwd. The fronts are very lightly loaded but a long way out in front to give some control.
Exiting the corner is a different story. AWD will almost always win. I don't think the sti/evo can catch an 8 in a corner if the 8 has a track tuned suspension. It sure as hell will catch it exiting the corner as both have more power and awd with a rear torque bias allows an awd car to demonstrate oversteer and traction is a whole lot better.
I have no doubt that a well set up awd car is superior on a track but lets compare cars with track suspensions not soft daily driver suspensions. I would say that the s2000 will pose problems for an sti/evo on a track. The 350z handles like a tank and the 8 just doesn't have the right suspension for this task. The s2000 does and of course I could mention other rwd cars that are mid engined but most if not all are more expensive. Take the cayman for example. I would put money that it would easily beat the sti/evo on the track. but it's almost twice the money.
If it makes you happy you are correct in most cases regarding awd vs. rwd. But only the awd with rear torque bias will worth talking about. In any case I do feel that you forgot about the driver abstract of it all. It's hard to compare cars on a track when driven by different drivers. Same driver, same track, different cars would best compare them. Not Best motoring races.
The sti has so much rwd bias that its pretty much rwd. The fronts are very lightly loaded but a long way out in front to give some control.
I'm going to try to make my responses short since it's pretty pointless debating with you. I own a WRX and have seen the difference things like a rear sway, tires, alignment, and stiffer suspension make on the WRX. You're wrong.
Be bold all you like about the Type R, you're wrong.
An STI and Evo don't really have dedicated track suspension either, in fact the STI doesn't even have the pink springs that are supposed to be for track diriving. The STI suspension is a rather simple inverted strut, nothing fancy or expensive and it's even less sophisticated than the RX-8 suspension on papaer. If the RX-8 gets aftermarket or stiffer suspension so should the STI. Again, you're wrong.
The 350Z handles nearly as well as the RX-8.
The magazine that compared corner speeds had the RX-8 10mph slower at the peak through a corner, you had better have one hell of a track tuned suspension to make that difference up. It also had a peak G of .15 difference, you're not making that up without silly amounts of money in suspension work.
The Cayman turned a 8:11 on Nurburgring, the '05 STI spec C did it in 7:59 (3 seconds short of the 996 Turbo and 360 Stradale). But I guess since those are not on the same day with the same driver that doesn't mean anything to you...
You saying "The sti has so much rwd bias that its pretty much rwd" is the stupidest thing I've heard all day, somehow I feel you're going to top it later though.