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you most likely flooded the engine from trying to start it with a weak/dead battery. did you get a rotary specific compression test before you bought it? read the new owners threads
there are several ways to deflood it if thats the issue. does it sound like its spinning faster than normal when you crank it? if so its flooded
New rx8 owner-runs lean under 4k..runs fine above that
Hello All,
I've been lurking on this forum for awhile as I usually do before buying a vehicle said forum reps. That being said, I've wanted to walk on the rotary side for quite sometime and two months ago, I had the opportunity to buy an rx8 (2003 jdm type S, 44k kms). It had sat for about seven years.....the uncle of the owner and the owner couldn't remember why it had been parked.
Things done to it are as follows: new plugs, gutted cat, air pump delete, new fuel pump( suspected inadequate fuel delivery), cleaned low speed injectors. Since I'm located in Guyana, I don't have access to a rotary compression tester( on my short list of things to buy).
Long story short....I get it to run hot or cold only after doping it with carb spray or starter fluid. It doesn't idle, and the short term trims show 25% under 4k rpms and 0% from 4k all the way to redline. It previously showed 25% throughout the rev range, but after the new pump and injector cleaning, the 25% only shows up under 4k as previously stated.
I've gone through the 'starting issues' and the 'symptoms and causes' threads and am still at a loss. I've installed a new battery, cleaned the maf, cleaned the ESS( and did the reset), replaced the brake booster vacuum line, was leaking, checked the coils( 1800 to 1600 ohms- but new ones and leads on order). The starter spins up to 250 rpms on start, and I've seen 300 when boosted from a 2nd vehicle. I'd let the car initially sit for about 2 days with kerosene (didn't have atf on hand at the time) in the engine to soften any hardened carbon before attempting to start.
So....I'm kinda out of ideas....can anyone lend some pointers, advice or insight?
If your trims are that positive, you definitely have an air fuel ratio issue. It's also possible the wideband o2 (upstream) is reading incorrectly and calling for the wrong mixture. I'd be looking also for stuck injectors or a crossed wiring harness on the injectors. (It's very easy to mix them up, they reach each other and use a piece of coloured tape to indicate which one goes where which usually fades or falls off)
Verify fuel pressure as well. If you can get your hands on a smoke machine (sometimes even a vape or cigar can work) smoke the inlet, the brake booster hose is a pretty good entry point) and look for vacuum leaks. I had a HUGE vacuum leak once and couldn't get my car running right whatsoever, then I noticed I put my exhaust manifold gasket upside down and it was under the intake manifold gasket creating a huge leak. Sometimes things like that can happen too, unfortunately you can't know what previous work has been attempted if it's been parked for that long
Thanks for the write-up it gives me a place to start.
Picked up an 06 Rx8 67k mi that had been sitting for a while after owner had issues keeping the engine running.
I put in a new battery and got it to crank, it tries to start but doesn't really. Once or twice it putted a few times but ended up dying.
Pulled codes:
P2070 x2 Current and pending (Intake Manifold Valve Stuck Open Bank 1)
P0301 (Cylinder 1 Misfire)
Cleared codes and tried to start again. It gave a much more Valant effort but ultimately could not get going.
Checked codes again Only got P2070.
I will try new coils, plugs and wires for the P0301. Even though it did not re-appear these items are probably wore out.
Read the write up on cleaning the SSV, the videos for testing the SSV were not working so not sure how to trouble shoot that further.
Might have a bad ground somewhere too, the door locks go crazy when i try lock it from the inside, the remote lights up but does not work, button for the dash does not work.
Check all the ground connections, battery terminals (cause they stretch), and sounds as though it’s flooded from all the starting attempts. Might want to clean the SSV since they can stick due to carbon buildup.
Check all the ground connections, battery terminals (cause they stretch), and sounds as though it’s flooded from all the starting attempts. Might want to clean the SSV since they can stick due to carbon buildup.
Thanks for the support.
I will actually need a new 4-port engine. I have 85/85/95 compression in LR and 0/0/0 compression in the LF.
Surprised it was starting up as much as it was.
Looks like Phoenix, AZ used to be a mecca for RX8 specialty shops but it has seemed to dwindle down to just 1 now lol.
I've been lurking on this forum for awhile as I usually do before buying a vehicle said forum reps. That being said, I've wanted to walk on the rotary side for quite sometime and two months ago, I had the opportunity to buy an rx8 (2003 jdm type S, 44k kms). It had sat for about seven years.....the uncle of the owner and the owner couldn't remember why it had been parked.
Things done to it are as follows: new plugs, gutted cat, air pump delete, new fuel pump( suspected inadequate fuel delivery), cleaned low speed injectors. Since I'm located in Guyana, I don't have access to a rotary compression tester( on my short list of things to buy).
Long story short....I get it to run hot or cold only after doping it with carb spray or starter fluid. It doesn't idle, and the short term trims show 25% under 4k rpms and 0% from 4k all the way to redline. It previously showed 25% throughout the rev range, but after the new pump and injector cleaning, the 25% only shows up under 4k as previously stated.
I've gone through the 'starting issues' and the 'symptoms and causes' threads and am still at a loss. I've installed a new battery, cleaned the maf, cleaned the ESS( and did the reset), replaced the brake booster vacuum line, was leaking, checked the coils( 1800 to 1600 ohms- but new ones and leads on order). The starter spins up to 250 rpms on start, and I've seen 300 when boosted from a 2nd vehicle. I'd let the car initially sit for about 2 days with kerosene (didn't have atf on hand at the time) in the engine to soften any hardened carbon before attempting to start.
So....I'm kinda out of ideas....can anyone lend some pointers, advice or insight?
Next time you want to start, try what I've been doing:
1. Press the accelerator peddle all the way to the floor, and now start cranking. Crank for 5 seconds. Now release the peddle to start location. Now start to depress the accelerator peddle to locate "Goldilox" location (The sweet spot where fuel/air trim changes). All the while still cranking. (Yes your starter will hate you as it's getting hot) At the sweet spot, pulse the accelerator gently about 2 - 4 inches of travel. Keep doing this, and you'll entice the engine alive. - If that works I'll explain in more detail what's happening inside the engine, in order for this to actually work. It's take about 12 seconds to start your car. One of the problems is the ECU... so doing two tries at 6 seconds = fail. Must crank for more than 12 seconds. Fuel trim seems to change after 5 to 10 seconds.
2. Option #2: The best option. Park on hills. On a slope or slight grade. Roll start your car. Reverse works too. That works 100% of the time for me.
I have an 07 GT MT. 73,000 km (45,000 miles). Car is all original and never a problem. I've always checked oil level, always fed her 94 octane, and always redlined her each drive. I had the SSV valve replaced at 68,000, and Mazda checked the whole car over. Compression, cat converter, all good.
Had a collision where left fender went under the back bumper of an SUV that turned in front of me. Expensive repair, but cosmetic only. No airbag deployed. New fender and bumper cover. Door and hood panels fixed, inner fender repaired.
But now I suddenly have the 'hot restart' issue. She still drives beautifully, but needs 15 minutes of cooling before restarting. She just cranks but won't turn over.
I've taken her on a couple of 'hard' runs, because shop would start, warm up, and move the car, but not drive it. Problem remains.
90% of the time hot start issues are going to be compression related. If you plan on sticking with the car, it will be worth it to buy a rotary compression tester. (they do sales time to time on holidays). Either that or find someone local with a rotary compression tester.
Otherwise go down the list of your systems
-Battery
-Starter (upgraded one is 80$ on amazon)
-Ignition Coils (replace around 30k miles) OR go to one of the LS coil kits $$ or IGN1A kits $$$$
-Sparkplugs
-Fuel pump assembly (usual failure is when your engine cant go above 6-7k rpm)
None of the above will hurt to replace, but your symptoms sound compression related. Unless you have any other symptoms not mentioned.
It started fine with no problems for a whole year. Then one day it was -20° outside in the morning at 6am coming out of work. I started it and it started right after I let go of the key. I let it warm up like usual and drove. It drove really slow at first and it's understandable since all other cars were having trouble keeping their cars on too. Seen one driving around the lot saying it his electronics would dim and kept turning off on him. Anyway got to Walmart and got me a shovel. Turned it on and tuned on right quick. Then got to the Gas station not far about a mile away and turn it off and put gas to full so it wouldn't freeze or anything. Turned it on again and it turned on again quick. Well got home about 3 miles from there at 8am and parked then turned it off and got in. Didn't have to use the car until really late around 9pm. Tried turning it on and just wouldn't start. Tried deflooding it. The first time with Jumper cables it kinda wanted to a lil bit at some point. But just wouldn't catch. Tried this morning which is about a week later and it doesn't do anything beyond crank. No sputtering or anything. Just crank.
It started fine with no problems for a whole year. Then one day it was -20° outside in the morning at 6am coming out of work. I started it and it started right after I let go of the key. I let it warm up like usual and drove. It drove really slow at first and it's understandable since all other cars were having trouble keeping their cars on too. Seen one driving around the lot saying it his electronics would dim and kept turning off on him. Anyway got to Walmart and got me a shovel. Turned it on and tuned on right quick. Then got to the Gas station not far about a mile away and turn it off and put gas to full so it wouldn't freeze or anything. Turned it on again and it turned on again quick. Well got home about 3 miles from there at 8am and parked then turned it off and got in. Didn't have to use the car until really late around 9pm. Tried turning it on and just wouldn't start. Tried deflooding it. The first time with Jumper cables it kinda wanted to a lil bit at some point. But just wouldn't catch. Tried this morning which is about a week later and it doesn't do anything beyond crank. No sputtering or anything. Just crank.
Does it sound like it's cranking slow?
Does it slow down as it turns over?
If your battery is more than a couple of years old, I would start there.
I've found even a 'good' battery only lasts about 3 years, and they won't start unless you have a good, strong battery.
I bought a Lokithor lithium battery pack.
It works much better than jumping another car battery.
Does it sound like it's cranking slow?
Does it slow down as it turns over?
If your battery is more than a couple of years old, I would start there.
I've found even a 'good' battery only lasts about 3 years, and they won't start unless you have a good, strong battery.
I bought a Lokithor lithium battery pack.
It works much better than jumping another car battery.
Got a new 800 CCA battery. Should've done that before the cold weather started. It cranked slower than my old Rx8 so could've been the starter as well. Anyway I got a New battery and it just cranks. Don't know if I can post a video here to show what it sounds like. I tried the deflooding technique. The first time was with the old battery and with a jump starter connected to my friends car. After a few attempts it sounded like it wanted to start but had to stop trying because they had to park Facing the wrong way in the street because of the position of my battery and theirs made it not reach parked same direction parallel. Eventually we got tired of people passing by mad. Tried it today with new battery and just cranks at normal speed
but does nothing else at all. Wanna take it to a shop to see if they can clean the spark plugs or take a look at it but I feel like they aren't gonna know what's wrong with it
If you got close to starting it, like catching but not running, you were close, but it's probably still flooded.
I used to pull the fuse, but now I rely on the throttle cut off like the owner's manual said.
If you can, buy an electric charger with the boost feature.
It's tricky, but if you're patient, it might work.
Just don't burn up the starter, hold the pedal down, 10-15 second crank, 30 second break.
Try a few times with the pedal down, then let up and try.
If you get it to try to start, you have to play with the cutoff to figure out if it's getting enough fuel or too much.
If you smell gas, start over.
I got pretty good at it after DDing an 8 with a failing engine for 2 years and multiple flooding episodes.
If you got close to starting it, like catching but not running, you were close, but it's probably still flooded.
I used to pull the fuse, but now I rely on the throttle cut off like the owner's manual said.
If you can, buy an electric charger with the boost feature.
It's tricky, but if you're patient, it might work.
Just don't burn up the starter, hold the pedal down, 10-15 second crank, 30 second break.
Try a few times with the pedal down, then let up and try.
If you get it to try to start, you have to play with the cutoff to figure out if it's getting enough fuel or too much.
If you smell gas, start over.
I got pretty good at it after DDing an 8 with a failing engine for 2 years and multiple flooding episodes.
If you get it started, you have to figure out why it flooded.
If you get it started, you have to figure out why it flooded.
Probably Either the battery wasn't up to the job at those 20 Below 0 temperatures or the starter. Because it started great everyday up until that. Now can't get it to start so like u said most likely flooded. Just can't get it to de flood. Maybe I'll take it to the shop I always take it to and have them try and start it since they can probably jump start it with another car more freely and can probably take out the spark pugs to see how flooded it is. Just really wanted to do so myself not only because mechanics don't know much about the car but to lower the cost
Probably Either the battery wasn't up to the job at those 20 Below 0 temperatures or the starter. Because it started great everyday up until that. Now can't get it to start so like u said most likely flooded. Just can't get it to de flood. Maybe I'll take it to the shop I always take it to and have them try and start it since they can probably jump start it with another car more freely and can probably take out the spark pugs to see how flooded it is. Just really wanted to do so myself not only because mechanics don't know much about the car but to lower the cost
The money you're going to spend will buy a battery pack that is a good idea to have anyway.
Mine has an air compressor, emergency light & USB port for charging phones.
The money you're going to spend will buy a battery pack that is a good idea to have anyway.
Mine has an air compressor, emergency light & USB port for charging phones.
Probably gonna have to try that. I took it to a shop and they couldn't get it started. Said supposedly it has no compression. Thing is it started fine when hot. Was only due to below freezing temps that it didn't start so I'm guessing they just don't know how to get it deflooded since I heard low compression has problems when hot which I never had problems when hot. Now I have to figure this out without a mechanic since they all seem to not know about this car
If you got close to starting it, like catching but not running, you were close, but it's probably still flooded.
I used to pull the fuse, but now I rely on the throttle cut off like the owner's manual said.
If you can, buy an electric charger with the boost feature.
It's tricky, but if you're patient, it might work.
Just don't burn up the starter, hold the pedal down, 10-15 second crank, 30 second break.
Try a few times with the pedal down, then let up and try.
If you get it to try to start, you have to play with the cutoff to figure out if it's getting enough fuel or too much.
If you smell gas, start over.
I got pretty good at it after DDing an 8 with a failing engine for 2 years and multiple flooding episodes.
^This.
It takes patience.
Once you figure it out, you'll get it started easier next time.
I have an old charger with a booster, but that powerpack works even better. (On a dead battery)
*EDIT I never tried it on flooded engine, just a dead battery.
Be sure to get a charger or tender if you still have it during cold weather.
^This.
It takes patience.
Once you figure it out, you'll get it started easier next time.
I have an old charger with a booster, but that powerpack works even better. (On a dead battery)
*EDIT I never tried it on flooded engine, just a dead battery.
Be sure to get a charger or tender if you still have it during cold weather.
I have a 2000A Jump starter pack. Don't know if that will be enough. If not I'll try and see if I friend can help again with and idle car cuz it almost started that way. Heard if it's too flooded that cleaning the plugs and Even starter fluid works but don't know here the intake is and if it's better to just spray the Fluid into the spark plugs hole idk
I have a 2000A Jump starter pack. Don't know if that will be enough. If not I'll try and see if I friend can help again with and idle car cuz it almost started that way. Heard if it's too flooded that cleaning the plugs and Even starter fluid works but don't know here the intake is and if it's better to just spray the Fluid into the spark plugs hole idk
Just try to get it started for now and see what happens.
Like I said, if it sounds like it's stumbling starting, you're close.
Hold the pedal down the first few times to cut off the fuel.
Let up and try.
If it stumbles, try again with the pedal up...
Better to starve it at first with the pedal down to wash out any excess fuel.
12-30-2022, 11:04 AM
New rx8 owner-runs lean under 4k..runs fine above that
