msrecant

I would take it back to your regular dealer and check on the issue about taking longer to start up. Most reports (and my personal experience) is that after the new battery/starter the engine both cranks much faster and starts quicker. I have an MT so I can't speak first hand about an automatic, but I can't believe it would be different.

GhostRidr

chr1s: I already had the latest PCM updates from a previous recall service. As for the multiple revs upon startup, I'm clueless on that one myself. But I didn't witness it's occurence. I have no idea how/if i should include this in my own habits to ward off potential flooding.

mcrecant: It does turn over now faster, and sounds different, but it's taking about 2-3 seconds to start. Obviously that's not a time impact on my life, but it does seem long for an engine to start.

I have to go out of town again this weekend on a 250 mile trip. Let's hope this crap doesn't happen again.

chr1s

If it's actually 2 or 3 seconds thats definately a long time. Like I said in my previous post it starts right away for me.

It's probably nothing, but are you letting the fuel pump spool up? I do this every time before I turn the car over.

msrecant

Mine also does what CHR1S describes. Not sure what the salesman was talking about.Also, IMHO, in general I would not touch the gas pedal until the engine has started and the car has stabilized at idle.

GhostRidr

It just happened again, though I was able to get it started after doing the deflooding procedure twice. This was after a 15min drive, engine was plenty warm. Now I have a check-engine light. Car is going into a local dealership tomorrow morning. This is not fun.

RedSheDevil

Hopefully they will get it all taken care of and they had just forgotten to do something. Since I had the new plugs and starter I have had zero problems and a super fast crank.

Dugma

Hi All-
New to this forum. I have a 04 RX8, and have experienced flooding problems. The first time, my wife was backing the car out or the garage and stalled it. Wouldn't start, even after the de-choking procedure. Flatbed to the dealer, replaced plugs and re-flashed.

Haven't really been driving the car a lot, winter in CT and all. Did have a triclke charger on the battery. The car's been sitting for about a month. Tried to start it this morning, and nothing. Cranked over fine, but just wouldn't start. I'm afraid I'm going to have to get it towed again to the dealer.

I've noticed a couple people here have had a new battery and starter installed. Is this something that the dealer will do under warranty? Do I have to request this?

thanks!

RX8_GT

Before you have it towed - fully charge battery then foot to floor and crank it like crazy - perhaps 20 to 30 seconds at a time with 10 second pauses. Leave it floored between cranking periods. If it starts - off gas pedal and try to maintain 2000 to 3000 rpms. LOTS OF SMOKE !!! Then a good run after warming up - then off to dealer for "Cold Start Repair" - new plugs / battery (May be pro-rated) / starter / latest flash.

Just my 2 cents

Dugma

Thanks GT. I did the foot to floor thing, but not for as long as you mentioned. Anyway, it's on it's way to the dealership on a flatbed as I write!

I spoke with a tech a the dealership who said that it depends on the VIN number as to whether they'll cover the new starter/bigger battery.

Does anyone know how they decide whether it's covered or not??

It's never cranked over with much authority. i'm hoping I'll get it taken care of under warranty.....

SoFL_RX8

I am really interested as to

Does anybody that lives in a more tropical climate (i.e. Miami, LA, South Texas, Puerto Rico) experince this issue?

It sounds like everyone that has had this problem is in cold weather, and it is February. Im picking up my 8 tomorrow, Ill be sure to not shut it off cold, and to rev to 4K before shut off... but Im still wondering if possibly living in a place where it NEVER gets below 60 would help.
Has anyone flooded their engine in the summer heat? Would an already warm engine (say 85 degreese outside) flood?
God, now Im gunna even more nerotic about my new car...
Also, I have a suggestion... why not install a turbo timer on your car, regardless of if u have FI or not... if you engine is always running for 2 or 3 mins after shutdown, wouldnt that pretty much kill any chances of u flooding it, unless u stall and restart?

RX8_GT

here's the link to the TSB

http://www.finishlineperformance.com...4-05-1448e.pdf

It has all the VIn and build dates etc.

Good Luck

chr1s

The latest TSB states ANY 2004 / 2005 VIN.

Here's a link to the TSB / Recall list

Here's the PDF link to the specific "no start" TSB

RX8_GT

SoFL_RX8:

In general stall and restart is not the problem. It's moving it a short distance cold then shutting off and leaving for a while - perhaps overnight. The flood occurs when the re-start injects more fuel into the engine which still has leftover fuel in it from the previous short cold move. Rotary engines unlike piston engines do not clear fuel out when simply standing. Waiting for the flood to clear does not work with rotary engines.

Mazda has the ECU inject no fuel at start if the pedal is floored - thus the de-flooding procedure which first clears the extra fuel by cranking with the pedal floored then re-starts the second time with the pedal free.

When my car flooded (twice), I was able to clear the major flooding by repeated cranking periods with the pedal floored. Then LOTS OF SMOKE as the gas was cleared from the exhaust system.

Care during short moves - along with the new plugs / starter / battery / flash should help greatly. That along with a basic understanding of the issue should minimize this issue. In the early RX-7s - you pull the fuse to the fuel pump then crank it clear before re-starting a flooded car. Did that recently when my 1988 RX-7 convertible flooded. That's two floods for the RX-8 and two floods in RX-7s in more than a decade of ownership. All cleared at home - luckily.

IMHO a little understanding of the basics of the issue helps a lot. Perhaps Mazda should detail it a little more in their deflooding instructions.

Dugma

chr1s and GT-

Thanks for the information. It's exactly what I needed!

ultradave

Well, all was well for a while after the second flooding and dead battery that came with it. Mazda replaced the battery with a higher capacity one under the bulletin. Of course, I was without the car for the day. Why does it always happen on the morning of an important meeting?

Anyway, the new battery is noticeably stronger and the car has been cranking nicely, until last Thursday (of course I had to be in Rhode Island for a meeting that morning). Cranked the car and could tell by the sound it was flooded. For no reason. The last time I drove was 20 minutes home from work. The difference was that this time, the battery had enough capacity to use the flooded start procedure. I went through it probably 25 times - first crank with the pedal on the floor, then pedal released. After about 45 minutes it started to have sounds of sputtering - like it was trying to start. About 8 more rounds did the trick.

I was late and not happy but at least the car didn't' have to be towed.

Dave

CERAMICSEAL

Dave,
As I've asked many others here, what about a computer re-flash, sparkplugs and starter? What year is your car and is it auto or manual? If the dealer has offered less than they are authorized to do to prevent future floods that would be a real shame.

alcimedes

You know you can just rev the engine to 4-5k, then shut the car off and not have it flood, even when the engine is still cold, right?

olddragger

iTrader: (3)

be careful about how high an rpm you have on this engine before you switch it off. 3 K probably no problem but 5K and you are starting to run the risk of blowing oil back into your airway- just get the new starter ,plugs, battery and the latest flash
olddragger

CERAMICSEAL

Plus 5 grand on cold oil isn't very smart either (Bearings just don't seem to like that).

GhostRidr

An update on my recent flooding experience and subsequent hard-starts thereafter... the dealer found a loose crank sensor, and corrected that. Ever since then, it's been starting right up. This may have been what led to my original flooding to begin with. Either way, it appears that I'm back to normal now, let's hope it stays that way.

msrecant

That sounds reasonable. You floods weren't the typical "shut the engine off cold", which is what the TSB is designed to address. Glad to hear it is fixed.

ultradave

M flash, new battery, starter and plugs at the last towed-in flood repair. It's a 2004 - build date was March of 04 if I remember right.... manual, touring package (Nordic Green, not that it matters :-) ) I think they've done what they are supposed to. At least this time the battery was strong enough to get it started.

Dave

DeeDeej

Call me stupid in all this but I am really lost, I read everywhere about the washer fluid trick for the flooded engine...... now this is where im stupid i guess, after you inject the washer fluid, do you unplug anything before you try to crank it? i.e. spark plugs, sensors, etc....
Now to be curious, I am really new as a rx8 owner!!!!!! what is N flash, M flash and all thoses expressions?????

Next question is......... should i just get rid of this car before i get attached??
(btw.. i have automatic)

thank you
DEEdee

msrecant

No, not because of reliability. The flooding issue appears to be taken car of by the following:

- Updated Engine Control Unit firmware often referred to as an ECU or PCM flash. The exact level (M, N, etc) doesn't matter, you just want them to update you car to the latest level. If you have had all the RX-8 recalls done then this has been done.

- 640 CCA battery. Comes standard on all RX-8s built after 6/1/2004.

- Upgraded starter. Comes standard on all RX-8s built after 12/1/2004.

- Improved leading spark plugs. Comes standard on all RX-8s built after 3/22/2005.

If you have any starting problem at all, ask your dealer for any/all applicable updates. This is a much better solution that rigging your engine so you can pump windshield washer fluid into the combustion chamber. If you flood, rather than fixing it yourself, have it towed to the dealer (at Mazda expense) and have the above improvements installed (at Mazda expense).

Even with the updates, it is still a good practice to avoid short trips.

However, if your car is out of warranty (> 50K miles) and the above is not done then it will cost you. That may be a reason to get another car. Also, the AT does have less power than the manual or the new 2006/2007 ATs, so if power is your thing than you may want to move to another vehicle.

MEGAREDS

DEEdeej, your AT does have more torque than the other cars msrecant mentioned, and all the cool people know that torque is the most important thing. Also, you can talk on the cell phone in your AT, shift gears and wink at passer's by, all at the same time, something the manual owner's can't do, at least not gracefully. Also, you've got those awesome paddle shifters... ahhh, paddle shifters...

My advice is to go ahead and get attached to your AT; I've had none of the upgrades, flooded once, and love my car each and every time I drive it.

(BTW, msrecant, another nice post...)