200.mph

iTrader: (9)

fuel injectors are on the pass. side under the black plastic part where the upper and lower intake manidolds meet. is it a stick? it could be flooded. does it sound like its cranking faster than normal?

harrisgear

Thank you!! It is a manual and I have performed the de-flooding thing many times with the relay removed. I believe the cranking speed is normal.

200.mph

iTrader: (9)

its pretty different sound if its flooded vs not flooded. if you have fuel and spark you can try pull starting it in 2nd gear. i had to do it once years ago

harrisgear

Cool, thanks...We'll give that a shot!

MANIACman

It comes down to spark, fuel and air. Try pulling one of the plugs and see if they are black and crusted over. You might have too much fuel. You can also check to see if there is any spark. Have you replaced the wires? Second hand I heard these can go bad (I'm not sure how but...) Check that the wires are fully connected onto the plugs and coils. Pull the coils and look on the bottom for scorch or brown marks. The coils have a habit of shorting out to the plate they are bolted down on.

Dan Ansello

200.mph

iTrader: (9)

marks on the bottom of the coils mean nothing

BwapTron

bummer in the summer

Leo78

Shaozhou Zhang

P0336, something wrong with the ESS (Eccentric Shaft sensor ). The function of ES (Eccentric Shaft) is almost identical to a Crankshaft in a piston engine. If the PCM does not know where the position of the Eccentric Shaft is, it cannot fire the coil then the plug. Clean it first and do the 20-time brake thing to see if that's gonna work.

Leo78

I put a new ESS and still nothing, I gotta say it was from Ebay tho.. I bought a more reputable brand and it should be here in couple days.. thank you for the reply! I will post back with the results.

Leo78

Okay so I got the new ess and still no spark, luckily I decided to buy the little condenser that shows in the wiring diagram for coils, figured what the hell, is not expensive, I put the new condenser and voila! Got spark on all 4 coils!
Now to start the car tomorrow, work 12hr today and then the car, figure is quit time lol.

I added a picture of the condenser for those that doesn't know what it looks like and having the same problem and want to try it out.

fantamaso

Hi all,

I have been working on the procedure to diagnose a CNS issue. Here is a raw version of it along with the link to my github wiki page (https://github.com/alex-aleyan/wenke...Crank-No-Start). Your feedback is greatly appreciated! Do it at your own risk and I bear no responsibility for damages or risk.

Diagnostic Flow:

1. Starter Issue - if the starter cranks too slowly even with the fully charged battery jumper:
   1. remove spark plugs, disconnect the battery, and crank the engine manually with a breaker bar to make sure that the seizing engine is not the issue here.
   2. with a good battery jumper, crank the engine while measuring voltage drops between the battery terminals and the starter leads to make sure failing battery to starter cables/wires are not the issue.
   3. If voltage drops are under 1.2 volts (FIXME: need to double check the numbers for Rx8), it means the starter gets all the juice it needs and cranks slowly simply because it's a dying starter - replace the starter and make sure it's the updated version (N3R3-18-400 should fit 04 despite being an 07 starter) since earlier Rx8 models were built with weak starters from the factory.
2. Intake Issues:
   • Vacuum Leaks -
     smoke test
     smoke test
     the intake (also cranking the engine with slightly depressed gas pedal should help assuming the vacuum leak is negligible with respect to amount of air coming thru the slightly opened throttle).
   • Throttle Valve may not be responding to the gas pedal:
     1. Get visual access to the throttle body.
     2. Depress the gas pedal and watch it open.
3. Flooded Engine -
   De-flood the engine
4. Ignition issues
   :
   • Check that spark is fired (Spark Plugs, Wires, Coils, Condenser N3A1-66-991). FIXME: not sure if all spark plugs are fired during cranking.
   • It's good practice to just replace the old Coils (around $40 for all 4), Wires(around $80 for all 4), Spark plugs (around $120 for all 4), and the Condenser ($15 only 1 needed).
5. Bad Eccentric Shaft Sensor.
   1. If the Fuel Injectors are triggered and the Spark Plugs are fired then the sensor does not need to be replaced - just clean it and reset NVRAM!
   2. Clean the sensor (located at the front of the engine right next to the Eccentric Shaft) using aerosol meant for cleaning the electronic components.
   3. Reset NVRAM after cleaning or replacing the sensor.
6. Fuel System issues:
   • Fuel Pressure (spraying starting fluid into intake past the throttle body to see if engine starts briefly is a common trick to see if fuel is the issue):
     1. check if you can hear Fuel Pump operating by turning the key to the ON position (but not cranking the engine).
     2. check fuel pump relay voltages (2 relays).
     3. check fuel pressure (if you can do this test first, then you don't need to do the other checks in this Fuel Pressure subsection).
     4. check voltage at the pump.
   • Fuel Injectors:
     1. Check that the fuel injectors are triggered
     2. If injectors are triggered, they might still be clogged/faulty (very unlikely but happens) - pull out the injectors with the fuel rail and crank the car while watching the injectors spraying (I would use glass bottles to collect fuel to see if they spray somewhat equal amounts).
7. Exhaust System Issues:
   • Clogged catalytic converter may be the cause - gut the cat and replace it once the "no crank" issue is resolved (I would just buy a cat from a car that's being parted out and gut that cat to use it as my temp cat for diagnostic purposes).
   • Don't worry about O2 sensors since the system does not utilize their readings until the engine runs, warms up, and enters closed loop.
8. Compression Issue - perform compression test.

rodshane

hey, my car will crank but will not catch what could be wrong with my car please help me out oh yea and it misfired too

gwilliams6

Engine Power Loss

• chokes as revs increase
  • O2 sensor failure (too rich)
  • MAF failure
  • MAF disconnected
  • e-shaft sensor fouled
  • accessory belt fraying
• high end power loss (hard fuel cut)
  • Rev limit reached
• high end power loss (jerky and stumbling)
  • Ignition failure
  • fuel pressure loss
  • e-shaft sensor fouled
• high end power loss (smooth)
  • Catalytic converter clog
  • air filter clog
• low end power loss (smooth)
  • Engine compression loss
• low end power loss (stumbles)
  • Ignition failure
  • front O2 sensor failure
• revs slowly but smoothly
  • O2 sensor failure (too lean)
  • catalytic converter clog
  • air filter clog
• sudden power drop at a specific rpm
  • Intake valving actuation problem
• trouble getting to redline
  • Ignition failure
  • front O2 sensor failure
  • catalytic converter clog
  • air filter clog
  • e-shaft sensor fouled
  • fuel pressure loss
  • MAF failure

gwilliams6

RX8 Club’s recommended maintenance schedule, more comprehensive and proactive than Mazda’s schedule.

30,000 miles:
- Replace Ignition coils
- Replace Plug wires
- Replace Spark plugs
- Clean MAF (mass air flow sensor)
- Clean ESS (e-shaft sensor)
- Reset ESS profile
- Clean power steering connections
- Clean battery terminals and clamps
- Replace transmission fluid
- Replace coolant (Mazda FL-22 is highly recommended)
- Replace air filter
- Replace brake fluid (fluid in the brake lines AND the clutch line)
~$300 USD in parts if you shop smartly.


every 60,000:
...all 30,000, plus...
- Clean all chassis electrical grounding points
- Replace accessory belts
- Clean OMP lines
- Replace rear differential fluid
- Replace thermostat
- Clean / Straighten AC condenser fins
- Clean / Straighten oil cooler fins
- Inspect catalytic converter
- Clean / Inspect intake valving
- Consider / inspect all points in 90,000+ as well, many items fail early
~$130 USD in parts if you shop smartly.

90,000:
...all 30,000, plus any 60,000 not yet done, plus...
- Replace coolant bottle
- Replace radiator hoses
- Replace radiator
- Replace front O2 sensor
- Replace motor mounts
- Inspect clutch pedal assembly for flex / weld breaks
~$900 USD in parts if you shop smartly.

At 100k, anything original in the cooling system is really suspect and failure prone. It represents the biggest threat to your engine.

gwilliams6

To start you need good spark, good fuel flow, proper air flow, and an engine that still has good compression. So start with each of those areas.

Cheers

rebel6d

this is the full history of what I have done to it because I want it to be as accurate as possible. I bought a 2004 RX-8 AT with 140k KM in late June this year and have had some codes pop up which I have fixed by putting in new spark plugs, and ignition coils, and I have had to replace some vacuum solenoids as well. In September the car wouldn't turn over. I had a friend who worked at ford take a look and he said my starter was finished. As I could tell the cat was melted by how it would rattle I replaced the starter and exhaust at the same time with a 2 kW starter and a turboXs cat-back exhaust. It started right away on the first start-up, however, the second start-up took about 8 seconds. Battery was on its way out so I got a new one. I hooked the car up to an OBDII reader and determined the throttle body sensor wasn't doing what it should. I swapped it out and it was fixed. Better acceleration but still a long start-up. I had a friend who had been working in the mechanic business for over 35 years look at it and he said it might not be getting enough fuel pressure. I put a new fuel pump in because I figured if it was a leak I would smell and see gas somewhere under the car. It then started right away when cold but once it got warm it would not start. got an error code for the crankshaft position sensor. changed it and thought it would fix the hot start. It did not. it starts right away when cold and runs perfectly, but idles rough (but we think it's the engine mounts because the engine bounces (not shake) while starting. feels like it has full power and runs smoothly while moving. good compression. It is throwing a couple of codes (U2516, U1900, U0073, U0100) I want to know how to fix these as well as what could be causing the no start when a hot issue (it starts with starter fluid) as well as how to fix the codes as I can't find anything. I love the car but would like to be able to start it when it's hot.

Loki

iTrader: (1)

Classic compression. What did you test it with to confirm it was good? U codes are generally connectivity between different systems. They're weird and you can google individual ones, but you might also want to clear them to make sure they come back and are still valid. But they won't make your warm startup longer.

Rotativor

Hello everyone. I write this post because I have been using the search engine for a few days and I have not found a similar case. A few weeks ago after changing the oil and the starter improved. I was doing a route, when suddenly the engine collapsed and stopped on its own. The only strange thing I saw was that I hadn't tightened the oil filler cap properly and it had come out, it was next to it, I put it in, there were no splashes and the level was correct. The car no longer started, I called the tow truck and I took it home. At home I checked the main fuses, that the fuel pump was primed with the contact, all of that was OK. Prepare the car to inspect the spark plugs, try to start it several times, then check that the spark plugs came out totally dry. Then I checked that they had a spark, all ok. It seems that the problem is that there is no fuel getting to the engine. Then I took out the gasoline return connector, I started it and no gasoline came out (blue connector in the photo). Then I disconnected the red and with the ignition of the key a very powerful jet of gasoline came out. The car has not given any fault code. the gas pump Lina has 10,000 km, as well as spark plugs, wires and coils. Any advice on where to go next?