MMO-Caution as a premix
03-12-2010, 02:04 AM
#77
On a sidenote, no disrespect to you Mazdamaniac. I've read many of your posts, and I respect what you have to say. I may be looking for AP tuning from you one day.
03-12-2010, 02:42 AM
#78
There is actually a lot of useful data over there, but it is old and buried in the noise.
This forum is mostly a "users group". The vast majority of the members here are not really "enthusiasts", just regular people with regular concerns.
Much of what gets pushed out here as knowledge is largely parroted from the 7Club. Whenever anything useful happens here, it is upheld to the metric of 7Club and if it diverges from the "convention wisdom" over there, it gets slammed.
03-12-2010, 09:57 AM
#79
SARX Legend
iTrader: (46)
hornbm,
I recently read a thread on rx7club.com that was started by and commented on by some of the most respected members on that site and they were bashing MMO so I'm not sure where you get that it is so widely coveted
I recently read a thread on rx7club.com that was started by and commented on by some of the most respected members on that site and they were bashing MMO so I'm not sure where you get that it is so widely coveted
03-12-2010, 11:33 AM
#80
Registered
The one thing to remember about the 7 forum is that it suffers from the same issues that every forum does. There are smart people giving out good information and there are dumb people giving out bad information. That happens everywhere. Even here. Fortunately may of the dumbest people there have left. That doesn't mean it is all good now though. It is just better. One of the biggest issues on forums is that often times some of the dumbest information comes from the loudest people who in turn sometimes get perceived as the experts. This is what sometimes makes it hard to weed through the crap to find the truth. There is definitely good info on the 7 forum and in many ways it is info that even some of the most respected 8 forum people should try to learn as the Renesis is a 13B and has the exact same issues like it or not. Again, the hard part can sometimes be finding that info.
03-12-2010, 07:05 PM
#82
'06 copper red shinka #66
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: maryland
Posts: 60
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
spoolin i have a couple of questions if you dont mind...
did you use 87 octane?
did you redline frequently? or rather what were your common rpm ranges?
no carbon means an extremely lean mixture. i wonder if your apv wasnt functionioning.
did you use 87 octane?
did you redline frequently? or rather what were your common rpm ranges?
no carbon means an extremely lean mixture. i wonder if your apv wasnt functionioning.
Last edited by redcopper06; 03-12-2010 at 07:07 PM.
03-12-2010, 09:52 PM
#84
Registered
Ask for more information about this. Is he saying there's a new flash that their service department is allowed to test on some cars? Or is he just confused? The former has occurred, but I'm skeptical.
03-12-2010, 11:47 PM
#86
'06 copper red shinka #66
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: maryland
Posts: 60
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
well, i have only a little bit of experience with rotaries, but a lot with piston engines.
but that explains the lack of carbon.
and if your APV was malfunctioning from 6k or 7k & up your engine would be totally starving for fuel, and that type of lean condition will blow an engine.
basically you have a situation with high stress on the engine components, and a lean mixture creates much more heat than a rich mixture. so you start getting "softer" components from the hot spots, as well as detonations... and at a high rpm thing will go boom.
there is a bench test they can do at a mazda shop to test the APV to see if it's functioning.
and even if it is functioning, and your mixture is not quite so lean, running at redline constantly/frequently will blow any engine before it's time.
an average top fuel dragster team rebuilds their engines 184 times per year
but that explains the lack of carbon.
and if your APV was malfunctioning from 6k or 7k & up your engine would be totally starving for fuel, and that type of lean condition will blow an engine.
basically you have a situation with high stress on the engine components, and a lean mixture creates much more heat than a rich mixture. so you start getting "softer" components from the hot spots, as well as detonations... and at a high rpm thing will go boom.
there is a bench test they can do at a mazda shop to test the APV to see if it's functioning.
and even if it is functioning, and your mixture is not quite so lean, running at redline constantly/frequently will blow any engine before it's time.
an average top fuel dragster team rebuilds their engines 184 times per year
03-12-2010, 11:55 PM
#87
well, i have only a little bit of experience with rotaries, but a lot with piston engines.
but that explains the lack of carbon.
and if your APV was malfunctioning from 6k or 7k & up your engine would be totally starving for fuel, and that type of lean condition will blow an engine.
basically you have a situation with high stress on the engine components, and a lean mixture creates much more heat than a rich mixture. so you start getting "softer" components from the hot spots, as well as detonations... and at a high rpm thing will go boom.
there is a bench test they can do at a mazda shop to test the APV to see if it's functioning.
and even if it is functioning, and your mixture is not quite so lean, running at redline constantly/frequently will blow any engine before it's time.
an average top fuel dragster team rebuilds their engines 184 times per year
but that explains the lack of carbon.
and if your APV was malfunctioning from 6k or 7k & up your engine would be totally starving for fuel, and that type of lean condition will blow an engine.
basically you have a situation with high stress on the engine components, and a lean mixture creates much more heat than a rich mixture. so you start getting "softer" components from the hot spots, as well as detonations... and at a high rpm thing will go boom.
there is a bench test they can do at a mazda shop to test the APV to see if it's functioning.
and even if it is functioning, and your mixture is not quite so lean, running at redline constantly/frequently will blow any engine before it's time.
an average top fuel dragster team rebuilds their engines 184 times per year
03-13-2010, 12:13 AM
#89
wow,
and i am silly crazy with my running 87 all the time / not so much on track days! i would love to comment again about premix, but why..
jeff you have all my last parts of premix..
might have a part in my mix that might be fun.. but have not opened that box yet.
beers
and i am silly crazy with my running 87 all the time / not so much on track days! i would love to comment again about premix, but why..
jeff you have all my last parts of premix..
might have a part in my mix that might be fun.. but have not opened that box yet.
beers
03-13-2010, 12:19 AM
#90
'06 copper red shinka #66
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: maryland
Posts: 60
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
so you guys would disagree with the idea that continually redlining an engine is bad for the engine?
well maybe i'm living in a fantasy world then, thinking that dirty thought.
well maybe i'm living in a fantasy world then, thinking that dirty thought.
03-13-2010, 12:37 AM
#92
/\lol~!
I think this shows that continuous use of mmo is like bleach to your whites. Good here and there, put too much too many times and your **** is messed up/
I don't have any faith in mmo/my own opinion
Premix with quality 2cycle, not cleaner.
_mazdamaniac_unlike me you have the best avatars! Cheers to boobies!
I think this shows that continuous use of mmo is like bleach to your whites. Good here and there, put too much too many times and your **** is messed up/
I don't have any faith in mmo/my own opinion
Premix with quality 2cycle, not cleaner.
_mazdamaniac_unlike me you have the best avatars! Cheers to boobies!
03-13-2010, 12:50 AM
#93
One Shot One Kill
well, i have only a little bit of experience with rotaries, but a lot with piston engines.
but that explains the lack of carbon.
and if your APV was malfunctioning from 6k or 7k & up your engine would be totally starving for fuel, and that type of lean condition will blow an engine.
basically you have a situation with high stress on the engine components, and a lean mixture creates much more heat than a rich mixture. so you start getting "softer" components from the hot spots, as well as detonations... and at a high rpm thing will go boom.
there is a bench test they can do at a mazda shop to test the APV to see if it's functioning.
and even if it is functioning, and your mixture is not quite so lean, running at redline constantly/frequently will blow any engine before it's time.
an average top fuel dragster team rebuilds their engines 184 times per year
but that explains the lack of carbon.
and if your APV was malfunctioning from 6k or 7k & up your engine would be totally starving for fuel, and that type of lean condition will blow an engine.
basically you have a situation with high stress on the engine components, and a lean mixture creates much more heat than a rich mixture. so you start getting "softer" components from the hot spots, as well as detonations... and at a high rpm thing will go boom.
there is a bench test they can do at a mazda shop to test the APV to see if it's functioning.
and even if it is functioning, and your mixture is not quite so lean, running at redline constantly/frequently will blow any engine before it's time.
an average top fuel dragster team rebuilds their engines 184 times per year
thanks for playing.
i will say the concept is proper. but other wise..
03-13-2010, 01:34 AM
#95
LOL. At least he admitted most of his beliefs are derived from experience with a piston engine. Remember, the tensile stress in a connecting rod is proportional to the square of the rpm of a motor, so he can be forgiven (to an extent) if he has been conditioned to stay out of the nether regions of the rpm range.
Rotaties are different. Time to re-learn.
Rotaties are different. Time to re-learn.
Last edited by GeorgeH; 03-13-2010 at 01:36 AM.
03-13-2010, 02:04 AM
#96
Lubricious
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: SF Bay Area, California
Posts: 3,425
Likes: 0
Received 4 Likes
on
4 Posts
Nothing has been "shown" yet; we have a second-hand report of a mechanic's opinion on the cleanliness of a blown engine that did not die from lubrication failure. A Mazda mechanic, apparently flashing cars at a Mazda service department with non-factory firmware? A Mazda mechanic at a Mazda service department who is apparently free to crack open failed renesis instead crating them up? And we haven't seen the pictures that were promised two days ago.
03-13-2010, 03:00 AM
#97
Power!!
I've premixed with Idemitsu for 10K miles on my rebuild and recently replaced my fuel pump due to the standard failure of starvation on left turns. The fuel filter sock was fine and not clogged at all. There was no evidence of any buildup or clogging of any kind due to the Idemitsu.
03-13-2010, 08:07 AM
#98
'06 copper red shinka #66
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: maryland
Posts: 60
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
sure. life is all about learning and re-learning :D
all i'm saying is high revving engines (of any type) create more heat and friction. that means even rotaries. forumula 1 engines (short stroke v10 and v8 naturally aspirated piston engines) run 12k to 19k all day long. but they 1) have rock solid ignition 2) have high volume / extra lubrication and 3) awesome cooling.
giving people with stock engines that lack the extra lubrication and cooling and perfectly tuned ignition the advice that they must run around at 9k just seems odd to me. i'll try to get past that and re-learn my evil ways :D
in the mean time i'll do what i can to make sure that my personal rx8 has the best of those three items that i can provide her with
the guy on this site has rebuild hundreds of rotaries and only ever saw one that died from carbon buildup... only one. http://www.rotaryresurrection.com/2n...nt_damage.html
all i'm saying is high revving engines (of any type) create more heat and friction. that means even rotaries. forumula 1 engines (short stroke v10 and v8 naturally aspirated piston engines) run 12k to 19k all day long. but they 1) have rock solid ignition 2) have high volume / extra lubrication and 3) awesome cooling.
giving people with stock engines that lack the extra lubrication and cooling and perfectly tuned ignition the advice that they must run around at 9k just seems odd to me. i'll try to get past that and re-learn my evil ways :D
in the mean time i'll do what i can to make sure that my personal rx8 has the best of those three items that i can provide her with
the guy on this site has rebuild hundreds of rotaries and only ever saw one that died from carbon buildup... only one. http://www.rotaryresurrection.com/2n...nt_damage.html
03-13-2010, 12:45 PM
#99
the guy on this site has rebuild hundreds of rotaries and only ever saw one that died from carbon buildup... only one. http://www.rotaryresurrection.com/2n...nt_damage.html
I believe most renesis engines that get replaced under warranty die from carbon buildup which eventually causes stuck seals and low compression .
Read this post from a guy that was working in the mazda Re-man plant :
https://www.rx8club.com/showpost.php...8&postcount=44
Last edited by Brettus; 03-13-2010 at 01:00 PM.
03-13-2010, 02:42 PM
#100
One Shot One Kill
you are right concerning heat with high rpm causing increase stress to the tip of the rotors/seals that comes in contact with the housing.
however, we are not recommending you leaving the engine at 9,000 rpm, just ease that baby up there once or twice a day, to keep her happy. not much power increase beyond 8,000 rpm anyway.
however, we are not recommending you leaving the engine at 9,000 rpm, just ease that baby up there once or twice a day, to keep her happy. not much power increase beyond 8,000 rpm anyway.