built renesis with greddy turbo problems please help!!
07-17-2010, 09:11 AM
#51
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ya'll arent gonna be able to jump right into troubleshooting here... the OP made it clear that he doesnt know what his AFRs are, just that his mazda mechanic said it was throwing CEL for rich. This tells us 1) he doesnt have gauges 2) he doesnt have any idea what his tune looks like 3) he is not going to be doing anything here on his own if he needs someone else to read a CEL for him. And also clearly stated his belief that this is an indestructable motor, because his builder told him so.... dont expect to walk him through hands on troubleshooting etc with any ease when the owner doesnt know what he is doing and doesnt have the proper equipment.
07-17-2010, 09:15 AM
#52
i was obviously reluctant to buy a AP right from the get go when i had a brand new e-manage ultimate ready to go in. the car is a 2008 model, one year ran NA then the next year i went FI with no problems. sorry if i have disrespected the rx8 gods by not buying an AP right away because everyones talking about it like its blasphemy. and if a rotor spins through the hood right now its not a big deal because my builder has called this motor "indestructable" even without tune.
And to the other members that are trying to be helpful unlike someee paul ha, its new coils and the 4ths set of plugs on a hard break in.
i'm not looking to start feud or be **** on, im looking for help!
And to the other members that are trying to be helpful unlike someee paul ha, its new coils and the 4ths set of plugs on a hard break in.
i'm not looking to start feud or be **** on, im looking for help!
ok now I understand this whole thing.
Dude I mean Look at ur original post, you said u're running EMU with STOCKKKKKK MAPPPPPP and NO BOOOOOST CONTROLLLLLEEER ????? WOW !
You really deserves what you got ---- shitty builder giving you shitty tune + its shitty lies
Last edited by nycgps; 07-17-2010 at 09:17 AM.
07-18-2010, 12:52 PM
#53
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[QUOTE=IronTanuki;3637842]Aside from the fact that there is no such thing as an "indestructible engine" especially of the rotary variety earlier in your posts you stated that the engine was built by someone local and no one in your area knows anything about rotaries much less boosted ones. So what exactly makes your builder an authority on the sturdiness of the engine?
the engine was built out of province by a guy who was recommended by someone i know in mazda canada who has been helping me out with the build. apparently he's pretty good and thats really the extent i know.
the engine was built out of province by a guy who was recommended by someone i know in mazda canada who has been helping me out with the build. apparently he's pretty good and thats really the extent i know.
07-18-2010, 01:12 PM
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the cel light is new and comming up still, along with a misfire. the car has been in the shop probably a dozen times over the 5000k breakin so far with the codes cleared every time.
and no i dont know afr , but do have a boost gauge. have tried two different maps from greddy.
and from what i have been told this engine should be able to handle what ever comes at it. and i'm not really worried about the engine blowing but i should i should say i dont really care if it blow. so far this build has not been worth the trouble. if i cant get this car worked out to wear i want it ill buy a new stock engine in, sell the car and every aftermarket part on ebay and buy a new 5.0L mustang.
everyone on this entire forum can tell me im stupid and dont know what im doing with my car and guess what your all right! im not a mechanic , im not a tuner, and i have **** options for this build. i probably would have been just as easy to turbocharger this car on the moon. i bring this car into a shop with a master tech of like 20 years to look at it and there all like holy **** ive never seen anything like this in my entire life and dont have a clue about it at all.
compression test is going to be done tomorrow or the day after, im gonna put some more info up then so if any of your rx8 gurus can give some indication on what a the next best plan of action is with out trying to prove what everyone already knows ( that i dont know what im at with the car) that would be very appreciated. and for the love of god please dont tell me to get an access port , I AM GOING TO GET THE ACCESS PORT.
im gonna try and post a much info and i can get but is there anything specific i should find out and post ?
and no i dont know afr , but do have a boost gauge. have tried two different maps from greddy.
and from what i have been told this engine should be able to handle what ever comes at it. and i'm not really worried about the engine blowing but i should i should say i dont really care if it blow. so far this build has not been worth the trouble. if i cant get this car worked out to wear i want it ill buy a new stock engine in, sell the car and every aftermarket part on ebay and buy a new 5.0L mustang.
everyone on this entire forum can tell me im stupid and dont know what im doing with my car and guess what your all right! im not a mechanic , im not a tuner, and i have **** options for this build. i probably would have been just as easy to turbocharger this car on the moon. i bring this car into a shop with a master tech of like 20 years to look at it and there all like holy **** ive never seen anything like this in my entire life and dont have a clue about it at all.
compression test is going to be done tomorrow or the day after, im gonna put some more info up then so if any of your rx8 gurus can give some indication on what a the next best plan of action is with out trying to prove what everyone already knows ( that i dont know what im at with the car) that would be very appreciated. and for the love of god please dont tell me to get an access port , I AM GOING TO GET THE ACCESS PORT.
im gonna try and post a much info and i can get but is there anything specific i should find out and post ?
07-18-2010, 01:18 PM
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dont even know, mazda canada rep helped me out and basically got me the best built renesis he could i was told it got 3mm seals, a streetport and custom eccentric shaft. and regarding the shaft i dont know it thats lighter or a different profile.
07-18-2010, 01:22 PM
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HAHA nice.
I still say we break this thing up into two issues like it should be, mechanical and tuning.
You are worried about both, and have symptoms of both (maybe) - so start with the mechanical and walk through your system. How is the turbo plumbed, BC set up - Wastegate operating, fuel, air, spark, (and how do you KNOW the status = gauges), injectors tested, pump tested, fuel pressure, vacuum leak....yada yada.
Log trims, look at your MAF housing..... etc - then when you do your homework and decide you are good mechanically, then work on the tune.
I still say we break this thing up into two issues like it should be, mechanical and tuning.
You are worried about both, and have symptoms of both (maybe) - so start with the mechanical and walk through your system. How is the turbo plumbed, BC set up - Wastegate operating, fuel, air, spark, (and how do you KNOW the status = gauges), injectors tested, pump tested, fuel pressure, vacuum leak....yada yada.
Log trims, look at your MAF housing..... etc - then when you do your homework and decide you are good mechanically, then work on the tune.
all piping is good, the manifold has been checked and blocking plate re sealed, sate gate works, rich, good spark , new plugs and coils, running rich on fuel right now from a code seen a t a mazda dealer say 800k ago.
07-18-2010, 01:24 PM
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I wonder if the mechanic/builder/whatever said "You are running rich." as in Braden has lots of cash to throw around on a third engine and not that the engine had a low AFR. 
Anywho...joking aside...that rich CEL could have been old...real old...like from when you had a bad O2 sensor who knows...clear it and see if it returns. Your misfire code is probably also related to the same root cause if you are rich and being thrown because of your custom shaft which will require a custom tune to fix. It could also be related to like 50 other things...but your tune is going to be the most in question with a custom engine and custom turbo setup.
As for your constant question about if your compression is good based on your seal change...you aren't providing enough data as MM said in another thread. You need to know what the compression ratio is on each face of the rotor. My understanding is also that your car needs to be running to get this measurement accurately. It's not like you can crank the car and expect proper compression, you need combustion to occur. Your engine builder should have a compression tester for rotary engines...if he doesn't...run away...far far FAR away.
Anywho...joking aside...that rich CEL could have been old...real old...like from when you had a bad O2 sensor who knows...clear it and see if it returns. Your misfire code is probably also related to the same root cause if you are rich and being thrown because of your custom shaft which will require a custom tune to fix. It could also be related to like 50 other things...but your tune is going to be the most in question with a custom engine and custom turbo setup.
As for your constant question about if your compression is good based on your seal change...you aren't providing enough data as MM said in another thread. You need to know what the compression ratio is on each face of the rotor. My understanding is also that your car needs to be running to get this measurement accurately. It's not like you can crank the car and expect proper compression, you need combustion to occur. Your engine builder should have a compression tester for rotary engines...if he doesn't...run away...far far FAR away.
New o2 sensor about 1500 k ago
07-18-2010, 01:26 PM
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07-18-2010, 02:10 PM
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so you blew up the first engine.....prolly because of poor tuning. then built another one. didnt change your tuning setup and youre still having problems. you should park the car. take your turbo setup apart, do the homework you should have done first. if you do enough HW youll be able to put it back together yourself and get it to run properly. Cobb will definately help but its not a miracle solution. we just had a dyno day here in the GTA with MM and the 07 greddy BNR made LESS power the an 05 NA(nice car scott!) just another example of someone mucking around where the had no business doing so and ended up with an expensive headache. to all newbs out there....drive hard and enjoy!
07-18-2010, 02:12 PM
#61
Apparently we have to add the mechanic himself over the mechanical and electrical problems.
I'd seriously start from scratch. The amount of money spent for this fancy rebuild was probably more than the cost of taking the car to a better shop to get a quality install done.
07-18-2010, 02:26 PM
#62
Not unless you change the turbo. With the base greddy such modifications are useless. No fancy e-shaft, no bigger seals will be of any use unless you remove the bottle neck first since the stock renny can handle that turbine well with a good tune alone.
Apparently we have to add the mechanic himself over the mechanical and electrical problems.
I'd seriously start from scratch. The amount of money spent for this fancy rebuild was probably more than the cost of taking the car to a better shop to get a quality install done.
Apparently we have to add the mechanic himself over the mechanical and electrical problems.
I'd seriously start from scratch. The amount of money spent for this fancy rebuild was probably more than the cost of taking the car to a better shop to get a quality install done.
Like I said, he deserves a shitty running car.
Last edited by nycgps; 07-18-2010 at 02:28 PM.
07-18-2010, 02:28 PM
#63
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A compression test is meaningless if your car has the mods described. One piece seals have weak compression at low rpm. Porting and a custom E-shaft(still dont believe this) again will have an effect on low rpm compression readings.
07-18-2010, 03:32 PM
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while the ******* in me agrees, afterall there is a *** ton of information availible freely on the interwebs, now that he is here theres no reason to not offer help as long as his attitude deserves it. As long as he understands that he may have to conceed certain ideals about indestructability, his builders knowledge, etc... 
I've got money on nothing more than the oil pellet that makes this a custom e-shaft...
I've got money on nothing more than the oil pellet that makes this a custom e-shaft...
07-18-2010, 03:56 PM
#65
while the ******* in me agrees, afterall there is a *** ton of information availible freely on the interwebs, now that he is here theres no reason to not offer help as long as his attitude deserves it. As long as he understands that he may have to conceed certain ideals about indestructability, his builders knowledge, etc...
people here did gave him ideas, but he insist that his builder is "very knowledgeable" + he believes his bs about "its indestructible".
obviously he is not listening, so what is the point of giving him more ideas ?
I've got money on nothing more than the oil pellet that makes this a custom e-shaft...
that custom e-shaft part really crackin' me up. my god.
07-18-2010, 06:09 PM
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so you blew up the first engine.....prolly because of poor tuning. then built another one. didnt change your tuning setup and youre still having problems. you should park the car. take your turbo setup apart, do the homework you should have done first. if you do enough HW youll be able to put it back together yourself and get it to run properly. Cobb will definately help but its not a miracle solution. we just had a dyno day here in the GTA with MM and the 07 greddy BNR made LESS power the an 05 NA(nice car scott!) just another example of someone mucking around where the had no business doing so and ended up with an expensive headache. to all newbs out there....drive hard and enjoy!
no tune just map from greddy e-manage ultimate. i love the car but its not my life , dont got time to lean every single aspect of FI for my car, and in a perfect world i wouldnt learn anything about it just buy the parts pay for it to be put together and work like it should
07-18-2010, 06:11 PM
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Not unless you change the turbo. With the base greddy such modifications are useless. No fancy e-shaft, no bigger seals will be of any use unless you remove the bottle neck first since the stock renny can handle that turbine well with a good tune alone.
Apparently we have to add the mechanic himself over the mechanical and electrical problems.
I'd seriously start from scratch. The amount of money spent for this fancy rebuild was probably more than the cost of taking the car to a better shop to get a quality install done.
Apparently we have to add the mechanic himself over the mechanical and electrical problems.
I'd seriously start from scratch. The amount of money spent for this fancy rebuild was probably more than the cost of taking the car to a better shop to get a quality install done.
meh from what ive hear the stock turbo is good for around 10 psi , doubt id go any higher than say 7.5-8.5 lbs on the car anyways. hard enough to keep the car running.
and if you havnt read the thread takin the car to another shop = flat bed truck and go across Canada so no
07-18-2010, 06:15 PM
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he knows nothing about the engine in general.
people here did gave him ideas, but he insist that his builder is "very knowledgeable" + he believes his bs about "its indestructible".
obviously he is not listening, so what is the point of giving him more ideas ?
LOL !!!
that custom e-shaft part really crackin' me up. my god.
people here did gave him ideas, but he insist that his builder is "very knowledgeable" + he believes his bs about "its indestructible".
obviously he is not listening, so what is the point of giving him more ideas ?
LOL !!!
that custom e-shaft part really crackin' me up. my god.
the hard part is gonna be the fact that he cant rely on his builder/mechanic to know whats going on and he doesnt sound like he'd be jumping into this hands on himself. he's either gonna have to get his feet wet in a hurry, or try conveying what he learns here to his builder/mechanic and ensure everything goes properly. which unfortunately is another disaster waiting to happen.
yeah that is humorous, and i'll keep my bet on the thermal pellet
07-18-2010, 06:17 PM
#69
no tune just map from greddy e-manage ultimate. i love the car but its not my life , dont got time to lean every single aspect of FI for my car, and in a perfect world i wouldnt learn anything about it just buy the parts pay for it to be put together and work like it should
First of all you have to have a clue about what you're doing, then pick the right tools for the right jobs and see what happens. If you don't have time to learn then simply don't take a car with 10:1 compression ratio and turbo it without even understanding that you will need a tune.
I'm sorry to say that with this mentality you just showed us that we wasted some time replying to you.
You don't have time to learn yet you want to school us on how your engine is bullet proof without a tune, indirectly admitting that we don't know what we're saying.
Pick a side. You either know what you're doing and can try to teach us something we may not know, or you're ignorant and you'd better listen to what some guys politely told you.
If you trust your tuner so much let him sort your problems out. Don't annoy us parroting some theories of somebody you're blaming for not making your car run right yet you trust enough to willingly ignore and bash the advices you're getting here.
I've also wasted my time reading this whole thread and if you have to take the car across Canada it's just your fault. Since you also stated that you know nothing about cars and FI don't throw pressure numbers around. 10psi means NOTHING. Flow and pressure are not the same. How much does the stock greddy flow at 10psi?
Please don't even say that it's hard to keep this car running with a turbo. The correct answer would be "If you're an idiot and run your turbo car without tune and without a boost controller then it won't last long".
Last edited by bse50; 07-18-2010 at 06:21 PM.
07-18-2010, 06:23 PM
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no tune just map from greddy e-manage ultimate. i love the car but its not my life , dont got time to lean every single aspect of FI for my car, and in a perfect world i wouldnt learn anything about it just buy the parts pay for it to be put together and work like it should
meh from what ive hear the stock turbo is good for around 10 psi , doubt id go any higher than say 7.5-8.5 lbs on the car anyways. hard enough to keep the car running.
and if you havnt read the thread takin the car to another shop = flat bed truck and go across Canada so no
and if you havnt read the thread takin the car to another shop = flat bed truck and go across Canada so no
IMO, the greddy kit as it is sold should not EVER be making more than 5-6psi. thats what it was desgned for, and it is barely adequate for that. if you wanna turn it up any, you will absolutely need someone who can work on the car and know what they are doing
Last edited by paulmasoner; 07-18-2010 at 06:25 PM.
07-18-2010, 06:30 PM
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i was IMing with one of these guys and he had a fantastic idea... if the funding is not an issue, doesnt seem to be from your posts.... a very good move you could make would be to see if Charles R Hill would be interested in coming up to get you sorted out, do your troubleshooting and whatnot. He has some sort of moto like "have tools, will travel" He's a great vendor here with his company Black Halo Racing, and has a great reputation.
07-18-2010, 06:36 PM
#73
i was iming with one of these guys and he had a fantastic idea... If the funding is not an issue, doesnt seem to be from your posts.... A very good move you could make would be to see if charles r hill would be interested in coming up to get you sorted out, do your troubleshooting and whatnot. He has some sort of moto like "have tools, will travel" he's a great vendor here with his company black halo racing, and has a great reputation.
07-18-2010, 08:29 PM
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thank you, i had mazda tech's telling me that under 100lbs is a failed motor and i wasnt aware that rotor to rotor is where it counts if you have big seals. this thread is getting me somewhere even if i have to deal with a lot of negativity to get there ha