OD's engine build
03-30-2011, 09:41 AM
#51
I have the innovate lc1--and the efi dude, so datalogging---yes to some degree. My a/f's at that load and rpm is 11.1--11.2. Turblown-- i think the gas has changed a lot up this way and my timing may not be the best for this gas. I know I want more cushion for variables like that. The tune will be gone through with a fine tooth comb.
What blew my engine I think was the ssv vacuum line popped off at the one way valve (engine side). That shut the ssv while a load of about 180-190 was going on, I didnt notice my boost gauge at the time, I was a little busy lol, but i probably had a boost spike that caused all this. Probably blew a side seal too and that is what caused all that oil to come out the breather cap.
Lines where zip tied.
This has caused a discussion about keeping the ssv open at all times, or using a boost signal to open the ssv and not the oem parameters? That will be ineresting. I have have never liked valves in the intake opening and closing while boost is going on.
I have already posed a question about the Goops. I like what info I have been able to find on them. Havent decided yet.
Aluminum rotors? They should run cooler, but I am not interested in high rpm output (over 8K) the guys that use them i think are draggers that turn 11-12K? They sure sound good!
Now dammit Team-- there you go making me think again. I never realized that the PP housings could be used with our irons. Maybe join the overlap club? I dont have emissions to worry about. Dang---here goes my mind again. You may be on to something there? Seriously I am joing to speak with Cam about this hopefully this week. Thanks again for the info. Wonder if you fill in the side exhaust ports?
been a little busy building cribbing to place the car on---have a friend that had a so called good jack stand to break while he was under the car. He wasnt hurt --he had a back up--but he will never be the same
If it had been me i probably would have killed myself getting out from under the car.
What blew my engine I think was the ssv vacuum line popped off at the one way valve (engine side). That shut the ssv while a load of about 180-190 was going on, I didnt notice my boost gauge at the time, I was a little busy lol, but i probably had a boost spike that caused all this. Probably blew a side seal too and that is what caused all that oil to come out the breather cap.
Lines where zip tied.
This has caused a discussion about keeping the ssv open at all times, or using a boost signal to open the ssv and not the oem parameters? That will be ineresting. I have have never liked valves in the intake opening and closing while boost is going on.
I have already posed a question about the Goops. I like what info I have been able to find on them. Havent decided yet.
Aluminum rotors? They should run cooler, but I am not interested in high rpm output (over 8K) the guys that use them i think are draggers that turn 11-12K? They sure sound good!
Now dammit Team-- there you go making me think again. I never realized that the PP housings could be used with our irons. Maybe join the overlap club? I dont have emissions to worry about. Dang---here goes my mind again. You may be on to something there? Seriously I am joing to speak with Cam about this hopefully this week. Thanks again for the info. Wonder if you fill in the side exhaust ports?
been a little busy building cribbing to place the car on---have a friend that had a so called good jack stand to break while he was under the car. He wasnt hurt --he had a back up--but he will never be the same
If it had been me i probably would have killed myself getting out from under the car.
Last edited by olddragger; 03-30-2011 at 09:46 AM.
03-30-2011, 02:42 PM
#52
You've mentioned this a couple of times OD. In the airplane world, nylon zip ties in the engine compartment are a big no, no. Standard practice in cars may be different, but I've had the nylon ties crack off quite easily after exposure to underhood heat. If there's no way other than zip ties, I'd recommend the stainless steel aircraft version. Example: http://www.flyboyaccessories.com/sto...roducts_id=265
03-30-2011, 09:38 PM
#55
same ties they use for cat heat shields etc? Never thought about using them for vacuum lines , but it may be a good idea in some locations.
Thanks for the idea--summit racing has them also.
I have decided not to go with the 13B PP housings--although tempting--it is still in the beta stage and I am not sure what will happen to those empty exhaust ports that are only capped.
Does bear close watching.
I am still going with the low compression rotors--leaning toward the goopy seals but havent committed yet.
There also will be some clean up porting going on also.
I am wondering if I should do the oil bypass line---is it worth it? I think it really may not be needed?
OD
Thanks for the idea--summit racing has them also.
I have decided not to go with the 13B PP housings--although tempting--it is still in the beta stage and I am not sure what will happen to those empty exhaust ports that are only capped.
Does bear close watching.
I am still going with the low compression rotors--leaning toward the goopy seals but havent committed yet.
There also will be some clean up porting going on also.
I am wondering if I should do the oil bypass line---is it worth it? I think it really may not be needed?
OD
03-31-2011, 12:33 AM
#56
not at your HP level at least
https://www.rx8club.com/series-i-aftermarket-performance-modifications-23/rx7-rotor-housings-renesis-engine-176251/
https://www.rx8club.com/showthread.p...76#post3064676
.
https://www.rx8club.com/series-i-aftermarket-performance-modifications-23/rx7-rotor-housings-renesis-engine-176251/
https://www.rx8club.com/showthread.p...76#post3064676
.
Last edited by TeamRX8; 03-31-2011 at 01:00 AM.
03-31-2011, 12:01 PM
#59
The ones for cat and header shields are likely too heavy-duty for use with relatively small diameter hoses. The shorter ss lengths should also be of a somewhat thinner gauge to work with small radii. Consider also that removing them isn't as trivial as with nylon: it takes a pretty good bite with dykes. If the guage is too heavy, destroying the hose is a possibilty.
03-31-2011, 12:38 PM
#60
Yeah the cat ones could bee to stiff and not provide an even clamping force
There are several metal fasteners out there anyway, so many it's hard to list. I generally use clamp style (like the ones on the throttle body's heater lines) or screw fasteners.
Anyway Denny since this is a "reliability" project why are you still thinking about so many variables? K.I.S.S.!
Goopy seals may or may not work, i'd lean towards something proven with our platform. Iannetti, NRS or stock will surely work fine (thus removing 1 possible failure variable).
Welding the side ports shut if going with peripheral exhaust ports is not a huge issue. You could even build some deeper sleeves and weld them, then add material on the side plate's face and have it lapped again to bee smooth. This process is sometimes done in older yet precious engines when a cylinder sleeve is pierced. Small weld and lots of lapping\polishing. It's going to be expensive though so i'd forget that.
For your goal, as i have stated many times, a stock renny with proper tuning and reliable ancillaries would be enough so you have to be extremely careful on what you add since it may possibly be overkill and screw the whole nice project up!
I would personally take a paper sheet and make a shopping list, then cancel everything that's an unknown variable and start from there
There are several metal fasteners out there anyway, so many it's hard to list. I generally use clamp style (like the ones on the throttle body's heater lines) or screw fasteners.
Anyway Denny since this is a "reliability" project why are you still thinking about so many variables? K.I.S.S.!
Goopy seals may or may not work, i'd lean towards something proven with our platform. Iannetti, NRS or stock will surely work fine (thus removing 1 possible failure variable).
Welding the side ports shut if going with peripheral exhaust ports is not a huge issue. You could even build some deeper sleeves and weld them, then add material on the side plate's face and have it lapped again to bee smooth. This process is sometimes done in older yet precious engines when a cylinder sleeve is pierced. Small weld and lots of lapping\polishing. It's going to be expensive though so i'd forget that.
For your goal, as i have stated many times, a stock renny with proper tuning and reliable ancillaries would be enough so you have to be extremely careful on what you add since it may possibly be overkill and screw the whole nice project up!
I would personally take a paper sheet and make a shopping list, then cancel everything that's an unknown variable and start from there
03-31-2011, 03:12 PM
#61
Kiss rule--agreed.
The only thing really i know i will be doing on a major basis is the rx7 rotors. The rest of it will be Cams usual FI build.
The goopy apex seals I havent decided on, I will ask Cam for advice concerning those. If it would be better then I will do it. I dont think I want ceramics. But I am open to anything that will build me the most reliabile engine with about 300rwhp.
Love to get 40K miles out of it.
But you are right, friend--i do have a tendency to run with things.
The only thing really i know i will be doing on a major basis is the rx7 rotors. The rest of it will be Cams usual FI build.
The goopy apex seals I havent decided on, I will ask Cam for advice concerning those. If it would be better then I will do it. I dont think I want ceramics. But I am open to anything that will build me the most reliabile engine with about 300rwhp.
Love to get 40K miles out of it.
But you are right, friend--i do have a tendency to run with things.
03-31-2011, 03:46 PM
#63
Playing with things is the funniest part of driving if you're not a race driver. We all try to improve ourselves and our cars as to never get bored. We can't help that... i took the engine out of my 2stroke bike out around 16 times in 11000kms...
You know my opinion on the reliable 300 horses so i won't delve any further on that. Nice rebuild and solid tune with the help of a serious boost controller is all one should need. What you're trying to achieve goes beyond that, you want the peace of mind of an OE product.. That's why you're always puzzled!
You know my opinion on the reliable 300 horses so i won't delve any further on that. Nice rebuild and solid tune with the help of a serious boost controller is all one should need. What you're trying to achieve goes beyond that, you want the peace of mind of an OE product.. That's why you're always puzzled!
04-02-2011, 08:19 AM
#64
Or I am just perpetually curious and always look to make things better? Either way-- it is an adventure and at times very frustrating.
Engine should be at Pettit racing next week. List is as follows for now:
1- low compression rotors
2-balanced and blueprinted
3-clean up ports
4- Cams secret stuff--he does "things" with the exhaust ports, the cooling around the plugs and the oil passage channels
5-custom LIM with jet air delete and vdi sealed, de-burring of the internal castings, cleaning up the apv barrels
6-on the fence about Goopy apex seals
7- 2009 or later side seal springs
8- this time I will get it painted
9- oil pressure relief valve mod
10- i am going to try and source an series 2 oil pan.
11--mazmart water pump and thermostat
That is all--stay tuned.
pun intended
OD
Engine should be at Pettit racing next week. List is as follows for now:
1- low compression rotors
2-balanced and blueprinted
3-clean up ports
4- Cams secret stuff--he does "things" with the exhaust ports, the cooling around the plugs and the oil passage channels
5-custom LIM with jet air delete and vdi sealed, de-burring of the internal castings, cleaning up the apv barrels
6-on the fence about Goopy apex seals
7- 2009 or later side seal springs
8- this time I will get it painted
9- oil pressure relief valve mod
10- i am going to try and source an series 2 oil pan.
11--mazmart water pump and thermostat
That is all--stay tuned.
pun intended
OD
04-05-2011, 01:28 PM
#66
SS, Stainless Steel, zip tie source
http://autolumination.com/connectors.htm about 3/4 down the page.
I'm sure there are other sizes available elsewhere, but you get the idea. I bought a few for my in-car repair kit; the big ones should serve as a good temporary fix for a broken exhaust hanger for example.
I'm sure there are other sizes available elsewhere, but you get the idea. I bought a few for my in-car repair kit; the big ones should serve as a good temporary fix for a broken exhaust hanger for example.
04-07-2011, 08:28 AM
#68
same here and at local auto part stores.
I have also sourced a better and larger one way valve, so the small green/white oem one will be retired.
To tell the true some Pettit guys are now playing with the idea of locking the ssv open. SO far so good--tune will have to readjusted--maybe? Beta testing in progress.
OD
I have also sourced a better and larger one way valve, so the small green/white oem one will be retired.
To tell the true some Pettit guys are now playing with the idea of locking the ssv open. SO far so good--tune will have to readjusted--maybe? Beta testing in progress.
OD
04-07-2011, 08:43 AM
#69
I'm thinking that #4 in your list should get you around the hot spots in the exhaust port area (which is why I had mentioned Evans coolant earlier, as a way around the same issue).
I'm sorry if I missed it; but is there a reason you don't care for Ianetti apex seals?
Also, in your teardown, is there any indication that the apex seals you were running were twisted out of their slots? I'm thinking about another thread on the site that mentioned that Mazda found they had to use L shaped seals in very high compression rotaries, and I was wondering if you might be seeing enough peak pressure as a result of supercharging, as to be running into that circumstance.
I'm sorry if I missed it; but is there a reason you don't care for Ianetti apex seals?
Also, in your teardown, is there any indication that the apex seals you were running were twisted out of their slots? I'm thinking about another thread on the site that mentioned that Mazda found they had to use L shaped seals in very high compression rotaries, and I was wondering if you might be seeing enough peak pressure as a result of supercharging, as to be running into that circumstance.
Last edited by longpath; 04-07-2011 at 08:48 AM.
04-07-2011, 09:17 AM
#70
no sir--no evidence of twisting. Like most,mine are breaking the corners.
My housings dont have any chatter marks or cracks around the plugs. The edges are ok (i redline at 7.5-8K)
The ianetti's are great ceramic seals--but too expensive for my blood and at my power level and rpm band, i dont really think they would offer any significant advantage over the rx7 tall ones? Whether they end up being OEM or the Goops.
I did consider EVANS-- and may reconsider it for this engine--but also I am on the fence about it. Will the coolant seals take the increased heat?
My housings dont have any chatter marks or cracks around the plugs. The edges are ok (i redline at 7.5-8K)
The ianetti's are great ceramic seals--but too expensive for my blood and at my power level and rpm band, i dont really think they would offer any significant advantage over the rx7 tall ones? Whether they end up being OEM or the Goops.
I did consider EVANS-- and may reconsider it for this engine--but also I am on the fence about it. Will the coolant seals take the increased heat?
04-11-2011, 11:26 AM
#71
Anticipating the engine will be at Pettit's sometime this week.
Cam has already said "No aftermarket seals" for this build. He know one hell of a lot more than I do so I am following his lead--so no Goopy's.
I will have the taller seals that come with the low compression rotors.
It will receive Cam's street porting, and all of his usual mods for this type of build.
Stay tuned.
Cam has already said "No aftermarket seals" for this build. He know one hell of a lot more than I do so I am following his lead--so no Goopy's.
I will have the taller seals that come with the low compression rotors.
It will receive Cam's street porting, and all of his usual mods for this type of build.
Stay tuned.
04-11-2011, 12:14 PM
#72
no sir--no evidence of twisting. Like most,mine are breaking the corners.
My housings dont have any chatter marks or cracks around the plugs. The edges are ok (i redline at 7.5-8K)
The ianetti's are great ceramic seals--but too expensive for my blood and at my power level and rpm band, i dont really think they would offer any significant advantage over the rx7 tall ones? Whether they end up being OEM or the Goops.
I did consider EVANS-- and may reconsider it for this engine--but also I am on the fence about it. Will the coolant seals take the increased heat?
My housings dont have any chatter marks or cracks around the plugs. The edges are ok (i redline at 7.5-8K)
The ianetti's are great ceramic seals--but too expensive for my blood and at my power level and rpm band, i dont really think they would offer any significant advantage over the rx7 tall ones? Whether they end up being OEM or the Goops.
I did consider EVANS-- and may reconsider it for this engine--but also I am on the fence about it. Will the coolant seals take the increased heat?
