Nemesis8

iTrader: (3)

Come on Richard, join the crowd

Lennart

You are right Brettus, Lennart is still adament, whp = 327 at 10 psi. Nm = 279,5

therm8

The Int-X should then be an option for the Pettit. You could probably get by on an EMU with some dyno time. You're not going to get those Greddy power levels without some dyno time either I'd imagine, so dyno cost can be thrown out.

mysql101

if pettit sells their SC in kit form ready to bolt on with the emu and base maps, i will list it at that price. I am not playing favorites, right now I've only seen it sold with int-x. You guys can't expect me to know everything, post updated info as you see it.

dyno time isn't included, because you can't sell dyno in a box along with the kit...

maxxdamigz

iTrader: (1)

I would steer clear of trying to nail down prices on kits. I would list guestimates and call it a day. If I bought a Greddy kit, it would still be a 5k min project because I'd like to cover all the bases. Someone else could scrape it together under 4k. Really, if you decide to do something to your car that you aren't entirely happy with and you chose that root to save a grand or two over what was what you really wanted (while still spending a X thousand dollar), you probably lack the mental capacity to even understand what you really want. So, if the Greddy is a 3k kit or a 4k kit isn't really the focus of this thread. It should suffice to say it's in that lower area with Pettit a step up in price and some of the other kits a step above that.

What would be nice to see is if someone running an Int-X on a Greddy or other kit/management can do some datalogging pulls to show things like EGTs, IATs, boost threshold, AFR, ETC. This would give some info on how well and safe that particular installation is running when it produces X power.

mysql101

Which is exactly why I said the basic kit as it comes new - with only what it needs to be functional on your car. What you plan to buy extra is your business and has nothing to do with the base price of the kit. Fuel management is a requirement, without it your kit is useless. So it must be factored in. We're just getting a baseline cost, it doesn't have to be exactly right based on market or dollar fluctuations.

One of the most important factors is what you get for the dollar, which is why this is important.

shaunv74

this is probably a reasonable graph to start with for the Mazsport kit. What do you think mysql? you able to add this one in? It sounds like you can't do much more without the ignition upgrade anyway so that kinda fits with your "out of the box" criteria.

mysql101

yeah, I can add it. also need to add tq number for the DNA sc... busy tonight, hot date

PoLaK

iTrader: (1)

Nice job Pettit, you've developed a FI kit that in daily driving will be the best kit IMHO for the rx-8, now just make it cost less :-p

And RG depending on how tight a track is your all underestimating how close the Pettit vs. Greddy race would be.

therm8

You don't have to buy Pettit's kit with the Int-x, that's simply the only one they offer themselves, at $0 discount I might add. If I'm not mistaken, your numbers are using the EMU? I'm not sure you could attain them with the blue. But then I don't know much about the Greddy kit. The Pettit is definately more expensive, but the install ease alone is worth that to me.

Maybe price should just be left out of it all together. The kit price isn't the only factor anyway (eg Pettit's should be significantly less to install for the average buyer).

mysql101

Okay, let's rephrase this - how are you going to make use of any FI kit without fuel management? You can't, therefor fuel management must be included. The lowest cost that you can buy a kit for, fully functional, from the company (or reseller) and able to make boost. That is the number I'm listing. Listing a price tag for a kit that you cannot use is idiotic. Which is what we'd be doing by omitting fuel management costs.


Price ranks in the top 2 items for just about everyone. The other is performance. Now the graphs reflect both. Should we be hiding what a kit costs? Is it unfair to list what a kit costs? What's the problem?

Install costs can change depending on location, and who does the work. That's for you to decide - or to install on your own. This is a small graph, it can't store total cost of ownership, or what kind of mpg you'll get on a summer day driving through south africa on a tuesday.

Feel free to waste your time tracing dyno graphs and post your own I have no monopoly on it.

therm8

Ok, buy an EMU, tune it and go. But I'll give you the $1500 for the Int-X.


I've no problem with listing prices. The price for the Greddy seems unrealistic to achieve those power levels. There are many, hard to calculate costs involved that tell the true cost to get up and running. The Greddy kit, and any turbo kit really, has more of these costs than any supercharger kit. The prices are misleading.

It's your graph, so do what you want. I'll complain about it no further.

mysql101

Is it offered with EMU?

mysql101

i need to know:

- cost of sfr turbo
- what psi the pettit sc made the 261 whp

I'm going to assume the lowest cost mazsport kit, since they all contain the same turbocharger, and thus the power levels should be basically the same between them.

Brettus

iTrader: (2)

me neither ........

You did a lot better job than i did and i'm happy someone took the idea and ran with it .....

SmokeyTheBalrog

Mysql101 damn nice thread.

Therm8 Price is very important. There is no one stop shop for info on FI. If a person is going FI and only using one thread to make thier choice then they are being foolish. This thread provides a rough comparison with rough price estimates.

If/when I go FI I will be using this thread. but I will also be reading like crazy, pricing stuff out myself, and looking up all the dynos I can.


EMU = Engine Management Unit
Int-x, e-manage, Cobb, are all EMUs


It is my understanding that the Greddy kit includes either an e-manage blue or e-manage ultimate. The blue is supposedly crap while the ultimate is passable.


If you get a newer kit it ought to still be ~$3k - ~$4K. Aside from $100 - $200 for new hoses and $7 for an oil restrictor what other costs are there? I would like to know.

mysql101 The greddy kit doesn't come with motor mounts? Roughly how much did it cost you to have them made? Is there anything else missing from the Greddy kit?


As for other costs: gauges, install, and tuning on a Dyno:
1. No matter which kit you choose you will have these same costs.

2. The actual cost varies so greatly that it is beyond the scope of any one thread to cover it.

Thus, it is necessary too set aside these costs for people to figure out for themselves.

EDIT: Doh! Just saw the new thread! Swee-tuh!

mysql101

the greddy kit doesn't come with any of the extras the mazsport kit comes with - it doesn't need to. it's meant for 6-7 psi, and makes about 60 whp from it. With a boost controller, we can turn up the boost to 12 psi and it still runs great. Under 300 whp, there's no need for new motor mounts - check out my dyno video, smooth as silk, no engine movement or anything. The fuel injectors are also not maxed out, so not needed.

therm8

Price is very important. And it should be represented accurately.

EMU = E-manage ultimate in Rx8club slang.

SmokeyTheBalrog

Oh I thought people used it when talking about other units too. My mistake.

I agree price is important. But aside from the basic kit, it's impossible to figure out what things cost. Because there will be such a wide variation from person to person, location to location.

And no matter which kit you get the cost will be roughly equal.

If you want to include the cost for everything. Then find out the cost for install for every kit in every performance shop in the world. Now add all the possible gauge options and their install costs. No you can toss that in a spread sheet, up load it then we can all use it.

Now if your argument is just the install time is different, then can someone post rough estimate of install time /cost for each kit? That would be useful.

mysql101: Sorry I thought therm8 meant that it didn't come with mounts for the turbo.

mysql101

install time and cost will vary based on shop, that's why I am not going to bother trying to list it. also you can always do the install yourself, so the cost could be zero. the cost of a kit isn't going to vary from $0 to N, there is a minimum price the company will sell the kit for. That's the only number we can realistic list.

chickenwafer

iTrader: (9)

The SFR basic kit with no EMS or injectors is $5500
Ready-to-Run is $7500 (With pre-tuned EMS, injectors, etc)

The cheapest Mazsport kit is $8000 (Type-1) with Int-X and injectors, etc. You could get the SFR basic kit and then an Int-X for $7000 all said and done.

mysql101

the lowest cost mazsport kit comes with bov, 4 new fuel injectors, motor mounts, new fuel pump, and battery relocation kit. so unless the sfr comes with those items, the mazsport is actually the better deal for the money.

maxxdamigz

iTrader: (1)

I would stick with the Engine Management the company most associates with it's product. That's Int-X for Pettit/Masport, V-con for PTP, EMU for Greddy, and whatever SFR is using for thier kit. If you really wanted to mix and match to get the lowest price possible, we'd all be running off megasquirts we built for $150. These are just going to be token points of comparison anyway.