Question? If the Heat of when the car over heated killed the water seal. How much time over heating would it take to bust the seal?

 

Yeah Rob at Pineapple said that it is fairly common to screw up the coolant seals during the build and he even said he has seen brand new seals that were warped.

 

Pineapple told me the factory coolant seals cannot take much heat and that one good overheating can kill them. As for when they would break, I'm not sure but I would guess I put about 15,000 miles on it after it overheated when the water pump belt broke.

 

not for long, talking about minutes if not seconds.

That's why most famous builder recommends hylomar, depends on which kind of hylomar you use one of them are tackly but hold slightly longer the other kind will remain "watery" for the rest of it's life. it helps sealing and keep the seal in place during install.

I used the Tackly one, damn that **** is a mess, but just thin it down a bit with Acetone and u will be fine.

 

Definitely interesting to see how that engine turned out. It seems like some of those issues are rather common... I know it would be expensive to redesign certain aspects of an engine, but I wonder if that would have been a better investment than having to replace so many engines. I suspect there will be a lot more reliability complains on the RX-8 as we approach a point when the extended warranty no longer applies to a lot of people.

There's still a couple of these hanging on the wall in my grandparent's house. Definitely more useful than a heater (in texas).

 

This is not just a "RX-8/Renesis/13B-MSP" thing, it has been like this for 43 years.

One of the "solutions" people came up with is they cut a few extra "fin" thing around the spark plug internal cooling passage. it helps to take the heat away much better than just "flat" surface. reducing the chance of "local heat spot/cracking around the spark plug hole"

Racing Beat can do it at extra charge, Brian @ BDC does it too(I think)

will only do it to new housings. (what's the point of doing it on a used housing, really)

The problem with 9K's engine (I think) is that it was using "used" housings ... which is always a no no if Engine Longevity is ur concern. well, I guess that's not Mazda's concern so there you go.

I was thinking when I'm ready to go FI, I will just buy a Mazda Reman, then take it apart and rebuild it "PROPERLY", I just don't trust people working in the Reman plant ...

but after seeing 9k's pic ... I dunno if I should take the chance. I know they "might" use Brand new Rotor housings but ... it's a 2000 bux bet that I'm not willing to make

 

wonder how many years it would take to burn through the 15gals I have at my house

I have a wick heater from the 70's works great but I am sure it causes cancer in California.

 

I don't particularly agree the Orange Seal was installed or pinched at factory, there would have been a much sooner issue with coolant use, not saying it can't happen as it can...I just think in this case would a pinched Seal go 30K??

Don't know if it helps any comparing the inside of a FC, two different era's fuel/air mixture and emissions by 20 years...and a Renny is not peripherally exhaust ported like FC.

This engine does live in Texas...heat is/was an issue.

 

yea the FC is peripherally ported but the spark plug area is still the hottest spot (if I remember correctly) so it's still pretty much the same "issue"

My 8 has a Mazda Rebuild and I think it's holding up nicely, I got Mazda's compression tester couple weeks ago and want to test my engine with it, but I have yet to test it, cuz car is in bodyshop and the shop's employees are having a strike ... damn I hate my life LOL

 

lol...you poor bugga...

Yeah, it can SUCK!!..

You got the Mazda C Tester...finally..

And the Roof Rail/Join Leak? yes....I wish I could see some pics of that.

 

just cause I am a weirdo....15gals would last for 6.1 months burning 18.75" of wick….not as long as I thought

 

mazda dont stock compression tester, understandable cuz its so expensive ... Their manager has to special order it for me. I want to try it so bad but car is in body shop and their workers are on strike ... Lol

 

If I remember reading correctly the remans do not use new housings or completely new parts, they reuse housing from other failed motors that are still "in spec".

 

Yep..Apparently they were replacing Rotors and E-shafts, if they clean up to Spec why would they not reuse them?

I think re-pressing in of Rotor Bearings (if needed) may have been 'an issue'..seems a waste.

 

I think Rob had said that they used alot of new parts (in most cases) they were just carelessly put together, thus negating any value going with new.

 

Pettit also does the extra work around the sparkplug areas to increase coolant flow.
I actually have a capped hole between my leading and trailing sparkplugs where the surgery was done. We have even casually spoken with some friends about doing the small block chevy head thing and run two extra coolant lines to those areas! lol.
But truely one of the main things you have to think seriously about about is cooling. I am really beginning to believe that Evans coolant may be a very good thing for the rotary engine--nucleate boiling is real. I mean theoretically, just a sorta bad radiator cap can cause a lot of damaging hotspots in this engine.

I am also in the preliminary stage of collecting some data that may indicate our water pumps need to be overdriven --more to come on that--if it amounts to anything.

Scot I dont want to hijack your thread with all this stuff so I will PM you about some things we are seeing.

Well--from the pics it kinda does indicate that carbon buildup on the rotary face comes from the gas you use--not from the engine oil that is injected. I think yours is the first I have seen that was on the Sohn from day one.
I wonder if that much carbon would bump up your static CR?
Really good info you are sharing man--thanks!

 

Bit of water inj and the rotor faces would be perfectly clean

I think living in the Pacific NW we get less carbon because of the continual rain steam cleaning the motor

 

yeah, and people biatch about the AEM intake sucking up water, they never considered that it was a preferable feature ...

 

Damn this sucks...

 

If you mix the "tacky" hylomar with a bit of acetone you get a semi watery substance which will stay watery for a bit until you brush it on and lay your seals down then it gets tacky.

This works quite well for future reference.

 

a while ago someone (was it sleepy?) said they actually use Brand new housings in most of the rebuild. E-shaft is what they usually re-use cuz most of the time they're good. (which is true)

That's why buying a Mazda reman it's a hit or miss. if you're lucky you "might" be able to get a +90% engine or even 100% new parts if they're out of stock at the time. but again it's a 2 thousand something bux bet that Im not sure if anybody wanna bet ...

and that's why some engine comes with "zero" compression. sloppy rebuild = not good.

 

the tacky Hylomar "comes" with Acetone in it, but it dries really fast (it should)

what I did was I hylomar the whole seal first, put it on, then put some hylomar at a few spot "just to make sure it stays there"

 

Maybe I was not so crazy thinking water injection on a NA engine is such a bad thing..... lol

 

Hey Denny,

Have not seen you around, I hope all is well, what happened to your 09 S2 start issue?, was it the PCM in the end???

Rotor Housings...I am trying to find the Tech Info, but I am certain (99%) that Mazda did some work with the Water Jacket area around the Spark Plugs on the S2 Rotor Housing (along with the Extra Oil Nozzle Hole), and I think they carried this Coolant mod onto the latest and last of S1 Rotor Housings..

Can't find the document about this...I have it somewhere!...Grrr..

 

Don't laugh I have been doing this regularly for a few years..