I believe it's called "weight transfer". By braking, you load your front tires to grip harder and let off on the rears to slip them. My understanding is that this is the reason FWD cars may need to take an earlier apex than RWD cars.

 

ps: take a ride with Mark Chiles in a Mini, it may just alter your FWD/RWD perception, totally blew me away ...

 

When I was in an FWD, I had to take a much earlier apex than I do in the 8. Once you get used to FWD, you can be surprisingly fast. I was faster than more than a few RWD's. It is kind of weird if you are not used to it. You apex early and it will sort of push the frount a bit. You can adjust your line (a little) with the throttle. You actualy lift a bit to tighten the line. I kept going off the inside or simply taking a totaly wrong line when I went back to RWD. It does not take long to adjust.

That is my personal experiance anyway.

 

To drive a FWD car fast you need to have a late apex and trail brake.

 

No matter what people are doing to them, I've seen several things that would indicate that the Cobalt SS outhandles just about every FWD car on the market.

 

The only sport where talent do not matter is in Racing..
money will let you race and not the talent..so difference between
car are not realy justify...
It's not like in football, Hockey, Baseball where they is draft and right on player....Ussaly owner are the driver! it's like if I could buy a NFL and play in it! with my 160 pound! and you would think it is because of my NIKE shoes that I'm bad!
I hope one day all race league will go into 1 league and driver will be Draft by team and not the opposite..!!!
I Think Nascar have better driver because they are not all there because of money...they did their way true a long process..
That's it s why they is not a big difference between first and 10 position. Maybe in another country RX-8 are faster than the RSX because of the different talent...
www.racingpurposeonly.com

Dont think the cobalt win alot of race in Japan!!
And never forget about people that cheat on those event...
On the race trac in quebec, I Lap, cobalt SS and RSX...with my Mazda3 Automatic!..I don't that was because my mazda3 was faster then those car!..if you check my website with my old mazda3 I'm following a Supra Turbo!! with still my automatic!

My other thing is that you are not suppose to brake when turning guys! whatever FWD or RWD!..you are suppose to aply brake before you turn and keep a space before turning the sterring into the curve to let the weight of the car go back in neutral..same thing when it s a 'S' curve..you have to brake between those to ''S'' to put backl the balance in neutral.. you will be able to get into the curve faster...

 

English not your primary language?

 

You should study up on racing a bit more. There are lots of feeder series and I am not aware of a single owner racing his own car in the top racing series.

Talent does matter since most all racing series also do a lot equalising of the playing field through various restrictions.

Also read up on trail braking since you still believe brakes are not used while turning.

 

You obviously have no idea what you're talking about -- either you've never raced, or you raced unsuccessfully and are trying to blame your lack of success on something other than lack of talent.

 

us defeated car owners know this only too well

 

exactly

 

I had both a 97 Type R and the RX-8 for about a year, and got to drive them back-to-back a lot. The Type R was the most neutral car I'd ever driven, but I'd still say the RX-8 outhandles it. You could rotate the Type R with the throttle but it took a LOT of throttle. Being able to just blip the throttle in the 8 can very predictably kick the tail out when you need oversteer.

For the Type R to even be able to induce on-throttle oversteer was a huge accomplishment for a FWD car ten years ago. It took tremendous balance in a very light car, a really good front LSD, and a suspension that was among the stiffest showroom-stock suspensions ever.

 

FWD cars are usually nose heavy so they are harder on front tires and front brakes and have a higher inertia to overcome in order to change direction. All things being equal the better balance of the '8 and its lower polar inertia should win the day given a real world race.

As for oversteer on FWD my '84 Jetta GLI responded well to lift throttle oversteer.

 

An early apex always seemed to be the fastest line for me. Maybe my driving style, setup, or maybe I was over driving the car. Duno. I am no pro. That is for sure.

 

Good point - I should have said on-throttle oversteer.

 

just think, fwd lift throttle to turn, rwd apply throttle to turn.
which car will take the coner faster??

 

There are alot of nice FWD cars out there but I don't believe any of them come close to RWD or AWD cars.

How many exotic / supercars are FWD? That would be ZERO!!!!!
How many F1 cars are FWD? 0
CART Series? 0
GT1? 0
WRC? 0
Fastest (Top Fuel) Drag cars? 0
God forgive me for this one but.... how many NASCAR's are FWD? 0

Seems simple to me...

 

^ Uhhh... no.

 

Talent DOES matter! I think you over simplified here. Given two identical car setups, talent will make the difference. Just because the difference between 1 and 10 is not that great does not mean talent doesn't matter. If everything else is equal, talent will carry the day. In fact with a smaller budget and less of a car, talent can make up for it. This is true at virtually every level of racing.

 

This Mini doesn't seem to handle too bad.

If I had a choice between the new and this one it would be a tough decision.

I'd venture to say that this car would out handle an 8.

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/97893/..._the_new_mini/

 

That mini was just crazy. I loved the stoppie. First time seeing a car do that.

 

yea right...... i had an 06 rsx type s a-spec and owned many of 8's with and without mods... 6speed and auto's when i had stock and a intake after that

 

Wow really? I am still shopping around for a good track car. What track did you race on? What lap time are you getting? How long does your brake holds up? How much camber are you running in front? Do you have any in car video to show? Did you race with NASA or SCCA? Showroom Stock class?

 

Anyways, 'Handles better'. 'What kind of measurement should we look at?' as one of the previous post have already raised the question. Look at the following statement:

Car#1's average cornering speed is 10mph faster than Car#2's average cornering speed.

Does it mean Car#1 'outhandles' Car#2? Or it simply means Car#1 is a 'faster' car? Does it mean Car#2's handling is bad? The above statement is true when comparing cars like Z06 to a Miata for example. Z06 have a higher cornering speed due to its width and tire size, but does it mean Miata's 'handling' is not as good as Z06's?

So what exactly is 'outhandle'?

To me, the handling of a car merely means: 'Does the car alter from the intended path chosen by the driver, and when it does, how easy is it to correct?'

Just my .02