What a Concept: Solstice gives Pontiac—and GM—a much needed shot in the arm
08-29-2005, 04:17 PM
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What a Concept: Solstice gives Pontiac—and GM—a much needed shot in the arm
What a Concept: Solstice gives Pontiac—and GM—a much needed shot in the arm
ROGER HART
Published Date: 8/29/05
2006 PONTIAC SOLSTICE
ON SALE: Now
BASE PRICE: $19,995
POWERTRAIN: 2.4-liter, 177-hp, 166-lb-ft I4; rwd, five-speed manual
CURB WEIGHT: 2860 lbs
0 TO 60 MPH: 7.2 seconds (est.)
FUEL MILEAGE (EPA COMBINED): 23.6 mpg
Ever since it was revealed at the 2002 Detroit show, the Pontiac Solstice has been more than just a car for General Motors. Brainchild of GM’s then-new product czar Bob Lutz, the two-seater became an experiment for how quickly the automotive giant could conceive a car that would ignite the public’s interest, and then bring it to market.
Shortly after the show car was given the green light for production, the Solstice became the project everyone within GM was looking at. To everyone’s best recollection—and despite a well-publicized delay late in the process— this is the quickest GM has moved from approval to production.
In concept form Solstice promised a lot of fun and sportiness. With a Lutz-mandated, etched-in-stone, read-my-lips base price of $19,995, well, many doubted the promise could be delivered for the price. More than one GM engineer noted the “F-word,” meaning Fiero, still echoed in the halls at GM. The budget two-seat Pontiac Fiero of the 1980s had a sporty shape that promised a spirited ride, but it didn’t deliver until after the car had been killed by the company.
But Fiero didn’t have Lutz— the Solstice team’s trump card and spiritual father.
“There were a lot of times the accountants would look at something I wanted in this car and tell me I could get a similar piece cheaper,” says vehicle line director Darren Post. “I’d tell them we tried that and the cheaper one wasn’t as good, and if they wanted to call Bob [Lutz] I had his number on my cellphone speed dial. I always got the parts I wanted.”
The four-cylinder Ecotec is mounted north-south in the Solstice and at 177 hp, easily propels the 2860-pound car. But more power is on the way. “No question, somebody somewhere will fit a small-block (V8) in here,” Lutz says. “But we won’t be doing it. This car was designed to have a four-cylinder engine.” Pontiac officials hint a turbocharged or supercharged Solstice could be offered down the road.
While Lutz, now GM’s vice chairman for global product development, has had a hand in several other GM cars since his arrival at the company, Solstice is really the first car developed entirely under his watch.
“It’s been a lifelong dream of mine to build an affordable two-seat roadster,” Lutz said.
In September 2001, just 15 weeks before the auto show, Lutz wanted a show car for Pontiac, and he staged a sketch-off among GM stylists that was won by designer Franz von Holzhausen from GM’s California studio (von Holzhausen has since left
GM for Mazda). Solstice has been a fast-track project from the outset.
“Our goal here was not to duplicate an [Honda] S2000 or [BMW] Z3,” says Lutz. “Little would be gained in making another $30,000-to-$40,000 roadster.”
But that didn’t mean the Solstice couldn’t ride and handle like those more expensive cars.
“While everyone will compare the Solstice with the Miata,” says chassis engineer Steve Padilla, the man who has logged more miles behind the wheel of Solstices than anyone else, “the ride dynamics we were shooting for were more like the S2000, only a bit less twitchy.”
Delivering on the car’s sporty looks has been the target of everyone working on the project. Solstice is the first car built on GM’s Kappa small-car rear-drive platform, and because it is being done in relatively small volume (the Saturn Sky, Solstice’s platform sister, will debut next year), the chassis is mostly hand-welded.
Engineers raided the corporate parts bin to speed up the gestation period. Everything from SUVs to midsize sedans contributed components, and while the end result could have been a nightmare, it works.
Solstice’s heart is a 2.4-liter four-cylinder Ecotec positioned north-south for the first time. The aluminum engine with overhead cams and four valves per cylinder—mounted transversely in front-drive cars such as the 2006 Chevy HHR—makes 177 hp at 6600 rpm and 166 lb-ft at 4800 rpm in the Solstice. Down low, the engine has good pull—a couple of 4500-rpm drop-the-clutch launches proved that, as well as producing some tire smoke—and the exhaust note is tuned for a throaty growl. We will always take more power, especially in a car that looks like this, but we are not disappointed with the Solstice’s performance.
GM officials are tight-lipped about offering a Solstice with more punch, but insiders confirm a more potent, turbo*charged or supercharged model will be offered later.
The Ecotec mates to a five-speed manual gearbox that operates with nice short throws. Its action is not lightning-quick, like that on the S2000 for example, but it is tight, and engagement is crisp. The clutch takeup on the cars we drove was just perfect, and the brake and throttle pedals are position*ed for heel-and-toe downshifts. An automatic will be offered early next year.
Unlike Mazda, which offers a six-speed manual on the Miata, GM makes only a five-speed manual for Solstice.
“A six-speed looks good on paper,” says Post, “but in this car it would just be overkill. We tried it, and it made no difference to the performance of the car. In fact, it just made you shift more, and it wasn’t any quicker 0 to 60.”
We did notice some mild driveline lash, which Post says his team is working to correct.
Our test drive included some city driving, freeway stints and long stretches of tight, twisty two-lane roads under sunny skies—perfect roadster weather. While there are a lot of things we like about the Solstice— its looks and price at the top of the list—after several hours in the saddle we came away most impressed with the car’s ride and handling. We were left wanting just one thing: more seat time.
Solstice rides on standard 18-inch aluminum wheels fitted with P245/45 Goodyear Eagle all-season tires. With four-wheel independent short/long-arm suspension, the ride is firmer than that in the new Miata we sampled about a week later. Yet at no point did we perceive the Pontiac’s ride as harsh. The chassis feels rock-solid, with no unwanted vibrations or cowl shake. At freeway speeds the car has a solid, boulevard-cruiser feel, but spot an opening in traffic and you can slot into it with go-kart quickness. The steering action is quick, but not so darty as to change lanes on you if you sneeze. In a car full of pluses, the responsive steering is a delight.
On a closed stretch of hilly switchback road we pushed the car as hard as we would have on a racetrack, and its road manners impressed. The balance is far more neutral than we expected, with the rear end only wanting to step out when you near the limit. That can be credited some to the car’s 52/48 front/rear weight balance, and the big tires gripping the road. The four-wheel disc brakes—11.7 inches up front, 10.9 inches in the rear—did everything we asked of them without complaint. Several hard runs couldn’t bring about any sense of fade. After a couple of runs up and down the hill, there were grins all around, especially on the face of Lutz.
We started our test with the car’s top down. Without a doubt, the Solstice looks much better with the roof stored below the rear deck so its clean, rounded lines are undisturbed by the manually folding cloth top. At freeway speeds, top down, there is a bit of wind buffeting, but you can still easily carry on a conversation with the passenger.
As the day wore on and the temperatures rose toward triple-digits, we gave up style for comfort, raised the top and switched on the air conditioning. The top, fitted with a glass window with standard rear defroster, can easily be handled by one person. It is not as simple as a Miata top, because you need to get out of the car and open the decklid to operate it.
Top up, there’s enough cargo space to hold a couple of pieces of luggage, enough for two people for a long weekend. But with the top stowed, storage space is at a premium. And whatever is stored had better be soft-sided in order to conform to the cramped space. Pontiac officials boasted about getting two sets of golf clubs in there, and they did, but they were the smallest golf bags we ever saw. If you’re planning a golf trip, we’d suggest shipping your clubs—and maybe some luggage—to your destination.
The cockpit is simple and functional. All controls are straightforward. Materials look and feel nice, and the panels fit well. The manual seats are supportive and have decent side bolstering. There is enough leg-room, even for drivers taller than six feet.
At 2860 pounds, Solstice is 300 pounds heavier than the Miata, but it has a bigger interior and a bit more horsepower. Pontiac is said to be working on what might be dubbed a track model, stripped of all sound-deadening, air conditioning and other weight additives.
Lutz also hinted a removable hardtop for the roadster could be available soon and a coupe version is being considered (both roadster and coupe concepts were shown at the car’s 2002 debut), in part because there are some racing classes in which the Solstice could compete that require an enclosed cockpit.
At 20,000 or 30,000 cars annually, Solstice won’t do a tremendous amount for GM’s bottom line. But with 10,000 orders in hand before the first production car rolled off the Wilmington, Delaware, assembly line, the Solstice seems to signal an attitude shift not only inside the company, but also by its customers. A production car nearly identical to its concept that hits the market just a few years after inception at the announced price. What a concept indeed.
http://www.autoweek.com/article.cms?articleId=103020
GM is smart. Not every engine needs a six-speed, Mazda.
I would still take the Saturn Sky over the Solstice. The Sky looks more like a mini-Corvette.
http://www.autoweek.com/news.cms?newsId=103041
ROGER HART
Published Date: 8/29/05
2006 PONTIAC SOLSTICE
ON SALE: Now
BASE PRICE: $19,995
POWERTRAIN: 2.4-liter, 177-hp, 166-lb-ft I4; rwd, five-speed manual
CURB WEIGHT: 2860 lbs
0 TO 60 MPH: 7.2 seconds (est.)
FUEL MILEAGE (EPA COMBINED): 23.6 mpg
Ever since it was revealed at the 2002 Detroit show, the Pontiac Solstice has been more than just a car for General Motors. Brainchild of GM’s then-new product czar Bob Lutz, the two-seater became an experiment for how quickly the automotive giant could conceive a car that would ignite the public’s interest, and then bring it to market.
Shortly after the show car was given the green light for production, the Solstice became the project everyone within GM was looking at. To everyone’s best recollection—and despite a well-publicized delay late in the process— this is the quickest GM has moved from approval to production.
In concept form Solstice promised a lot of fun and sportiness. With a Lutz-mandated, etched-in-stone, read-my-lips base price of $19,995, well, many doubted the promise could be delivered for the price. More than one GM engineer noted the “F-word,” meaning Fiero, still echoed in the halls at GM. The budget two-seat Pontiac Fiero of the 1980s had a sporty shape that promised a spirited ride, but it didn’t deliver until after the car had been killed by the company.
But Fiero didn’t have Lutz— the Solstice team’s trump card and spiritual father.
“There were a lot of times the accountants would look at something I wanted in this car and tell me I could get a similar piece cheaper,” says vehicle line director Darren Post. “I’d tell them we tried that and the cheaper one wasn’t as good, and if they wanted to call Bob [Lutz] I had his number on my cellphone speed dial. I always got the parts I wanted.”
The four-cylinder Ecotec is mounted north-south in the Solstice and at 177 hp, easily propels the 2860-pound car. But more power is on the way. “No question, somebody somewhere will fit a small-block (V8) in here,” Lutz says. “But we won’t be doing it. This car was designed to have a four-cylinder engine.” Pontiac officials hint a turbocharged or supercharged Solstice could be offered down the road.
While Lutz, now GM’s vice chairman for global product development, has had a hand in several other GM cars since his arrival at the company, Solstice is really the first car developed entirely under his watch.
“It’s been a lifelong dream of mine to build an affordable two-seat roadster,” Lutz said.
In September 2001, just 15 weeks before the auto show, Lutz wanted a show car for Pontiac, and he staged a sketch-off among GM stylists that was won by designer Franz von Holzhausen from GM’s California studio (von Holzhausen has since left
GM for Mazda). Solstice has been a fast-track project from the outset.
“Our goal here was not to duplicate an [Honda] S2000 or [BMW] Z3,” says Lutz. “Little would be gained in making another $30,000-to-$40,000 roadster.”
But that didn’t mean the Solstice couldn’t ride and handle like those more expensive cars.
“While everyone will compare the Solstice with the Miata,” says chassis engineer Steve Padilla, the man who has logged more miles behind the wheel of Solstices than anyone else, “the ride dynamics we were shooting for were more like the S2000, only a bit less twitchy.”
Delivering on the car’s sporty looks has been the target of everyone working on the project. Solstice is the first car built on GM’s Kappa small-car rear-drive platform, and because it is being done in relatively small volume (the Saturn Sky, Solstice’s platform sister, will debut next year), the chassis is mostly hand-welded.
Engineers raided the corporate parts bin to speed up the gestation period. Everything from SUVs to midsize sedans contributed components, and while the end result could have been a nightmare, it works.
Solstice’s heart is a 2.4-liter four-cylinder Ecotec positioned north-south for the first time. The aluminum engine with overhead cams and four valves per cylinder—mounted transversely in front-drive cars such as the 2006 Chevy HHR—makes 177 hp at 6600 rpm and 166 lb-ft at 4800 rpm in the Solstice. Down low, the engine has good pull—a couple of 4500-rpm drop-the-clutch launches proved that, as well as producing some tire smoke—and the exhaust note is tuned for a throaty growl. We will always take more power, especially in a car that looks like this, but we are not disappointed with the Solstice’s performance.
GM officials are tight-lipped about offering a Solstice with more punch, but insiders confirm a more potent, turbo*charged or supercharged model will be offered later.
The Ecotec mates to a five-speed manual gearbox that operates with nice short throws. Its action is not lightning-quick, like that on the S2000 for example, but it is tight, and engagement is crisp. The clutch takeup on the cars we drove was just perfect, and the brake and throttle pedals are position*ed for heel-and-toe downshifts. An automatic will be offered early next year.
Unlike Mazda, which offers a six-speed manual on the Miata, GM makes only a five-speed manual for Solstice.
“A six-speed looks good on paper,” says Post, “but in this car it would just be overkill. We tried it, and it made no difference to the performance of the car. In fact, it just made you shift more, and it wasn’t any quicker 0 to 60.”
We did notice some mild driveline lash, which Post says his team is working to correct.
Our test drive included some city driving, freeway stints and long stretches of tight, twisty two-lane roads under sunny skies—perfect roadster weather. While there are a lot of things we like about the Solstice— its looks and price at the top of the list—after several hours in the saddle we came away most impressed with the car’s ride and handling. We were left wanting just one thing: more seat time.
Solstice rides on standard 18-inch aluminum wheels fitted with P245/45 Goodyear Eagle all-season tires. With four-wheel independent short/long-arm suspension, the ride is firmer than that in the new Miata we sampled about a week later. Yet at no point did we perceive the Pontiac’s ride as harsh. The chassis feels rock-solid, with no unwanted vibrations or cowl shake. At freeway speeds the car has a solid, boulevard-cruiser feel, but spot an opening in traffic and you can slot into it with go-kart quickness. The steering action is quick, but not so darty as to change lanes on you if you sneeze. In a car full of pluses, the responsive steering is a delight.
On a closed stretch of hilly switchback road we pushed the car as hard as we would have on a racetrack, and its road manners impressed. The balance is far more neutral than we expected, with the rear end only wanting to step out when you near the limit. That can be credited some to the car’s 52/48 front/rear weight balance, and the big tires gripping the road. The four-wheel disc brakes—11.7 inches up front, 10.9 inches in the rear—did everything we asked of them without complaint. Several hard runs couldn’t bring about any sense of fade. After a couple of runs up and down the hill, there were grins all around, especially on the face of Lutz.
We started our test with the car’s top down. Without a doubt, the Solstice looks much better with the roof stored below the rear deck so its clean, rounded lines are undisturbed by the manually folding cloth top. At freeway speeds, top down, there is a bit of wind buffeting, but you can still easily carry on a conversation with the passenger.
As the day wore on and the temperatures rose toward triple-digits, we gave up style for comfort, raised the top and switched on the air conditioning. The top, fitted with a glass window with standard rear defroster, can easily be handled by one person. It is not as simple as a Miata top, because you need to get out of the car and open the decklid to operate it.
Top up, there’s enough cargo space to hold a couple of pieces of luggage, enough for two people for a long weekend. But with the top stowed, storage space is at a premium. And whatever is stored had better be soft-sided in order to conform to the cramped space. Pontiac officials boasted about getting two sets of golf clubs in there, and they did, but they were the smallest golf bags we ever saw. If you’re planning a golf trip, we’d suggest shipping your clubs—and maybe some luggage—to your destination.
The cockpit is simple and functional. All controls are straightforward. Materials look and feel nice, and the panels fit well. The manual seats are supportive and have decent side bolstering. There is enough leg-room, even for drivers taller than six feet.
At 2860 pounds, Solstice is 300 pounds heavier than the Miata, but it has a bigger interior and a bit more horsepower. Pontiac is said to be working on what might be dubbed a track model, stripped of all sound-deadening, air conditioning and other weight additives.
Lutz also hinted a removable hardtop for the roadster could be available soon and a coupe version is being considered (both roadster and coupe concepts were shown at the car’s 2002 debut), in part because there are some racing classes in which the Solstice could compete that require an enclosed cockpit.
At 20,000 or 30,000 cars annually, Solstice won’t do a tremendous amount for GM’s bottom line. But with 10,000 orders in hand before the first production car rolled off the Wilmington, Delaware, assembly line, the Solstice seems to signal an attitude shift not only inside the company, but also by its customers. A production car nearly identical to its concept that hits the market just a few years after inception at the announced price. What a concept indeed.
http://www.autoweek.com/article.cms?articleId=103020
GM is smart. Not every engine needs a six-speed, Mazda.
I would still take the Saturn Sky over the Solstice. The Sky looks more like a mini-Corvette.
http://www.autoweek.com/news.cms?newsId=103041
Last edited by shelleys_man_06; 08-29-2005 at 04:21 PM.
08-29-2005, 06:45 PM
#2
Kaiten Kenbu Rokuren
I agree, the sky definitely is more appealing looks wise. I hope these cars do well to rejuvenate the company which has been less than lackluster as of late. GM really needs some sort of boost to get out of this lame slump they've been in.
08-30-2005, 08:25 AM
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After seeing those pics, I kinda changed my thinking on its looks. I'm not too attracted to the butt on that car. But I guess its still a good looking car, especially since Pontiac made it. LOL
09-02-2005, 01:13 AM
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Hmm... every GM interview about the Solstice they try to mention "s2000" as much as possible, which is funny, considering it's actually slower than the new miata.
09-02-2005, 04:37 PM
#8
Bummed, but bring on OU!
Originally Posted by m477
Hmm... every GM interview about the Solstice they try to mention "s2000" as much as possible, which is funny, considering it's actually slower than the new miata.
09-02-2005, 06:33 PM
#9
Kaiten Kenbu Rokuren
Originally Posted by therm8
Rx-8 owners/fans, of all people, should appreciate that there is more to a vehicle than 0-60 times.....
Anyway, your avatar is friggin' hysterical :p
09-02-2005, 06:41 PM
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Ok, yeah, it looks like a fantastic car (especially for GM). However, it's waaay too late. They unveiled the concept some 2 years ago? What the hell have they been doing for the last 2 years? They needed to beat the new MX-5 to market, but they're coming out at pretty much the same time. In a matter of months, they'll be selling them at employee cost like everything else.
09-02-2005, 06:54 PM
#11
Kaiten Kenbu Rokuren
Originally Posted by RX8SpdDmn
Ok, yeah, it looks like a fantastic car (especially for GM). However, it's waaay too late. They unveiled the concept some 2 years ago? What the hell have they been doing for the last 2 years? They needed to beat the new MX-5 to market, but they're coming out at pretty much the same time. In a matter of months, they'll be selling them at employee cost like everything else.
09-02-2005, 07:05 PM
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09-06-2005, 06:38 PM
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Originally Posted by therm8
Rx-8 owners/fans, of all people, should appreciate that there is more to a vehicle than 0-60 times.....
09-06-2005, 07:36 PM
#14
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i'm glad GM is marketing the Solstice/Sky, but it's no Miata beater. Congrats to GM for getting the handling right, especially with those heavy-*** 18" wheels!
However - how many people want a toy car? That's what a car with NO luggage space is - and that's what the Solstice has with the top down, NO luggage space. Just look at the poor sales of the Toyota MR2 Spyder (killed this year for the US after only 3 years of production?), while people loved the way it drove, two little cubby bins for total luggage space just wasn't acceptable to most people. Hell, a Lotus Elise has waaay more luggage room than a Solstice! Sure, people will say "but it's a sports car, it's not supposed to be practical", but Miata owners for 15 years have demonstrated that the ability to get away for a weekend or haul a few days worth of groceries is enough practicality to be completely useful, and meets the minimum requirements for a lot of people.
Even worse - say you've got the top up on your Solstice so that you can fit one bag of groceries in there. Or your gym bag, or purse. To open the trunk, you have to release the back of the top, lift the trunk lid backwards, retrieve or place your small item, close the trunk lid, then refasten the top on each side!!! Just a pain.
On price, the Solstice is not actually any cheaper than a Miata. The $19.9K base price is really base - if you want air conditioning, (standard on a MX-5 in the US), you're paying extra, etc. If you option up a Solstice to the equipment level of a Base MX-5 - the price is the same.
For power, the Solstice has 7 more HP than MX-5, but weighs about 300 lbs more!!! (ie nearly as much as an RX-8). Power isn't everything, but at least Mazda remembered that light weight is more important, and allows a decent power to weight ratio even with modest power levels. Even more importantly, the light weight allows a nimble, agile feel - another example would be the feel of the RX-8 vs. the Nissan twins, 350Z and G35C. Light wins over heavy, every time!
To sum up - it's a great first attempt at an affordable roadster, and I hope they sell every one they make. I don't think it is a better car than a new MX-5, though.
Regards,
Gordon
However - how many people want a toy car? That's what a car with NO luggage space is - and that's what the Solstice has with the top down, NO luggage space. Just look at the poor sales of the Toyota MR2 Spyder (killed this year for the US after only 3 years of production?), while people loved the way it drove, two little cubby bins for total luggage space just wasn't acceptable to most people. Hell, a Lotus Elise has waaay more luggage room than a Solstice! Sure, people will say "but it's a sports car, it's not supposed to be practical", but Miata owners for 15 years have demonstrated that the ability to get away for a weekend or haul a few days worth of groceries is enough practicality to be completely useful, and meets the minimum requirements for a lot of people.
Even worse - say you've got the top up on your Solstice so that you can fit one bag of groceries in there. Or your gym bag, or purse. To open the trunk, you have to release the back of the top, lift the trunk lid backwards, retrieve or place your small item, close the trunk lid, then refasten the top on each side!!! Just a pain.
On price, the Solstice is not actually any cheaper than a Miata. The $19.9K base price is really base - if you want air conditioning, (standard on a MX-5 in the US), you're paying extra, etc. If you option up a Solstice to the equipment level of a Base MX-5 - the price is the same.
For power, the Solstice has 7 more HP than MX-5, but weighs about 300 lbs more!!! (ie nearly as much as an RX-8). Power isn't everything, but at least Mazda remembered that light weight is more important, and allows a decent power to weight ratio even with modest power levels. Even more importantly, the light weight allows a nimble, agile feel - another example would be the feel of the RX-8 vs. the Nissan twins, 350Z and G35C. Light wins over heavy, every time!
To sum up - it's a great first attempt at an affordable roadster, and I hope they sell every one they make. I don't think it is a better car than a new MX-5, though.
Regards,
Gordon
09-07-2005, 09:20 AM
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Maybe with a little feng shui, Solstice/Sky owners can make the best of trunk space.
Absolutely. If it came down to buying a small, affordable roadster, it would probably be an MX-5. If you want to get into semantics, a sports car is not a race car. I believe there's a thin line of form and function when it comes down to it. I certainly hope that GM does well in its first attempt to make a small roadster.
BTW, it's good to hear from you Gordon.
Absolutely. If it came down to buying a small, affordable roadster, it would probably be an MX-5. If you want to get into semantics, a sports car is not a race car. I believe there's a thin line of form and function when it comes down to it. I certainly hope that GM does well in its first attempt to make a small roadster.
BTW, it's good to hear from you Gordon.
09-07-2005, 09:59 AM
#16
Kaiten Kenbu Rokuren
Originally Posted by shelleys_man_06
Maybe with a little feng shui, Solstice/Sky owners can make the best of trunk space.
Absolutely. If it came down to buying a small, affordable roadster, it would probably be an MX-5. If you want to get into semantics, a sports car is not a race car. I believe there's a thin line of form and function when it comes down to it. I certainly hope that GM does well in its first attempt to make a small roadster.
BTW, it's good to hear from you Gordon.
Absolutely. If it came down to buying a small, affordable roadster, it would probably be an MX-5. If you want to get into semantics, a sports car is not a race car. I believe there's a thin line of form and function when it comes down to it. I certainly hope that GM does well in its first attempt to make a small roadster.
BTW, it's good to hear from you Gordon.
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