Subaru BRZ pricing announced! - $24k base, $27k high spec
03-23-2012, 09:44 AM
#54
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The slalom and skidpad numbers look decent though, so maybe it is more of a canyon carver than it is with acceleration. I just expected a little better time than 7.3 seconds.
03-23-2012, 09:51 AM
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It's a smaller, slightly slower, 2 door version of the RX-8, just with a different quirky engine and different manufacturing badges.
The reviews for the RX-8 and FR-S/BRZ are nearly identical if you start comparing them.
The FR-S pricing came out, base starts at $24,200, and it's pretty base. If Subaru can hold to the $24k base on the BRZ, they will take most of the buyers, since their 'base' is loaded and the FR-S isn't. It's more likely that the final official MSRP of the 'base' BRZ will be more like $26-$28k.
So it's not really any cheaper than the 8 either.
The reviews for the RX-8 and FR-S/BRZ are nearly identical if you start comparing them.
The FR-S pricing came out, base starts at $24,200, and it's pretty base. If Subaru can hold to the $24k base on the BRZ, they will take most of the buyers, since their 'base' is loaded and the FR-S isn't. It's more likely that the final official MSRP of the 'base' BRZ will be more like $26-$28k.
So it's not really any cheaper than the 8 either.
03-23-2012, 10:06 AM
#56
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On the FR-S/BRZ sites they are all about defending the lack of power/light weight. After a bit of the fanfare dies down, and reality sets in about the general lack of omph, I'd venture they'll be all over power mods, regardless. Hopefully they'll be more successful.
Hell, even an RX-8 or two could likely beat that slowboat...
Hell, even an RX-8 or two could likely beat that slowboat...
03-23-2012, 10:10 AM
#57
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The climbing weight, climbing price, and a couple poor reviews about the harshness of the engine all killed it from my list.
03-23-2012, 10:17 AM
#58
Why do we even bother to compare. Mazda had the RX-8 out 8 years ago and is already superior in every way except fuel economy to the BRZ/FR-S.
I'd say if you own an RX-8 already, the BRZ/FR-S brings absolutely NOTHING to the table. And if you dare say that it gets better fuel economy... why is that even part of the equation when shopping for a sports car?
I'd say if you own an RX-8 already, the BRZ/FR-S brings absolutely NOTHING to the table. And if you dare say that it gets better fuel economy... why is that even part of the equation when shopping for a sports car?
03-23-2012, 10:21 AM
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it's still ******* ugly too.
The only thing it's good for in my eyes is giving Mazda a market to bring out another rotary car that doesn't have to be 300hp to compete in. The bar has been set low to boot.
edit: I'm with you 9k, I've been saying that since the beginning.
03-23-2012, 10:23 AM
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Footman:
Agreed. It was a consideration for me when it was supposed to be 2,500lbs, pending how the engine feels (I hate driving harsh feeling engines). Now at the weight of a base RX-8, it kills off so many of the performance metrics that it's unappealing, and as the price climbs, it's even more of an axe.
9k:
I still like the fact that it was made. There is a whole range of people that are discovering what a joy good handling cars are. That can only be a good thing in the long run.
Agreed. It was a consideration for me when it was supposed to be 2,500lbs, pending how the engine feels (I hate driving harsh feeling engines). Now at the weight of a base RX-8, it kills off so many of the performance metrics that it's unappealing, and as the price climbs, it's even more of an axe.
9k:
I still like the fact that it was made. There is a whole range of people that are discovering what a joy good handling cars are. That can only be a good thing in the long run.
03-23-2012, 10:25 AM
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Did anyone expect the engine to be buttery smooth? Really?
I've never been in a boxer engined car that the engine wasn't at least a little harsh. Hell my buddy's GT3 sounds like a tractor at idle. It has tons of go and is pretty smooth while it pulls, but is still pretty harsh at high rpm.
I've never been in a boxer engined car that the engine wasn't at least a little harsh. Hell my buddy's GT3 sounds like a tractor at idle. It has tons of go and is pretty smooth while it pulls, but is still pretty harsh at high rpm.
03-23-2012, 11:08 AM
#64
This is good... letting a much larger company take the initial risk/hit of bringing a car to the market which focuses on handling/lowerweight/no HP wars type of thing.
Toyota/Subaru will take the hit for the success and failure of the car to see how the public reacts. Then, with the climbing sales/revenue of the CX-5 and Skyactive Platforms... Mazda will have the money to come back with something more fine-tuned and exotic.
Toyota/Subaru will take the hit for the success and failure of the car to see how the public reacts. Then, with the climbing sales/revenue of the CX-5 and Skyactive Platforms... Mazda will have the money to come back with something more fine-tuned and exotic.
03-23-2012, 11:08 AM
#65
I don't remember
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Probably not a bad move for either company. Neither toyota or subaru has a rwd or a sports car and as one article I read somewhere stated "a miata coupe anyone". As for adding a turbo, the added weight up front would only hurt the handling and surely drive the price into the 30k plus range. S2000, NSX, RX8 and others. All gone. 
03-23-2012, 11:11 AM
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You can't put a turbo up front and keep everything else that is crammed into that engine bay. Remote turbo or stripping emissions stuff (which is the logical target) is the only way to make the room. Turbo gear adding weight isn't really a concern. Figuring out where to put it, and the tuning of Toyota's complicated direct injection + high compression is the challenge.
03-23-2012, 11:49 AM
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^ it was only "supposed to happen" if you believed that the fans were the ones making the decisions.
Subaru has never said that they will do it. People just keep assuming it would happen.
Subaru has never said that they will do it. People just keep assuming it would happen.
03-23-2012, 12:38 PM
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You can't put a turbo up front and keep everything else that is crammed into that engine bay. Remote turbo or stripping emissions stuff (which is the logical target) is the only way to make the room. Turbo gear adding weight isn't really a concern. Figuring out where to put it, and the tuning of Toyota's complicated direct injection + high compression is the challenge.
Adding the money in for a turbo and tune, i'd buy an STI for the same price and have a more capable car power wise.
edit: sorry STI turbo is on top side of engine by the bell housing. Regardless a low mount would be the best option.
Edit2: 1st pick is brz engine bay. 2nd is an STI engine bay (turbo is under the S on the IC. Plenty of room for the stock location.
Last edited by fuztupnz; 03-23-2012 at 12:48 PM.
03-23-2012, 12:48 PM
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Do you know how much clearance there is under the car there? The engine sits lower than any other previous flat 4. By a fair margin.
Agreed the turbo would be low, but it can't be under the engine. Forward is the radiator, left and right are the suspension bits, and rearward is the bottom of the firewall.
Agreed the turbo would be low, but it can't be under the engine. Forward is the radiator, left and right are the suspension bits, and rearward is the bottom of the firewall.
03-23-2012, 12:49 PM
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See my edit.
and it would most likely still fit low next to the bell housing, just like it will fit high next the the bell housing.
I don't really care, I would sell/trade one in if I was given one for free.
and it would most likely still fit low next to the bell housing, just like it will fit high next the the bell housing.
I don't really care, I would sell/trade one in if I was given one for free.
03-23-2012, 12:51 PM
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03-23-2012, 12:54 PM
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and it brings me back to it's ugly, slow and a complete dud.
I merely pointing out that it's not as much work to fit a turbo as people would think.
The only thing i can see having to relocate would be the battery. And that's more for safety from the turbo's heat. Hell the TB is even facing forward so a FMIC would be easy to plumb.
I merely pointing out that it's not as much work to fit a turbo as people would think.
The only thing i can see having to relocate would be the battery. And that's more for safety from the turbo's heat. Hell the TB is even facing forward so a FMIC would be easy to plumb.
03-23-2012, 12:58 PM
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I'll admit you were right once someone has one turboed without fitment issues 
"The first thing you need to know, is that it's not the prettiest car in the world..." -Beholder
