rodjonathan

iTrader: (6)

alfy thanks for respecting my opinion and just so you know i respect yours too thats prolly why there have been no fights on this thread yet but yea i guess maybe i will have to wait and see till its out but i just went digging and found nothing really saying their technology is superior (chassis engine transmission wise) even to the current 430 let alone the 458 so all the more i cant justify the great price tag the interios YES its DEFINITELY wayy better than the Ferarris and others too but 150 k for a good interior? comeon now you can buy the 458 and get a s-class or 7 series to have a comfy car right? ... also even if toyota makes a v8 i doubt it will cut the cost of this car enough to compete with the vettes and the gtr ... another problem i see is that even if they do cut the price it wont perform as well and then they will mass produce it which will take away from the exclusivity factor which IMO is the best thing this car has going for it ...

alfy28

so you think Lexus jsut pulled a number out of the sky and said, guys i think 375k is what we will ask for this car. even though , we dont have a rep to back up the price. there is obviously a reason for the price, and my guess being it from lexus its the technolgy.

2nd HP and torque, i am pretty sure they can pull mad numbers from their engine. but this car isnt built for track only (like ferrari cars) this is built for track and every day use.

come on shaun, lets be buddies like in the F1 thread, and just agree with me man (jking)

rodjonathan

iTrader: (6)

theres an f1 thread where??? lol i missed it

renesisgenesis

Well lets see...in one corner we have a toyota for 375k, and in the other we have a ferrari with less weight, more tq/liter, more bhp/liter, more peak bhp and peak torque despite lower displacement, same 9000 rpm redline, excellent styling, probably better performance in every category if not at least equivalent, and it all costs over 100 grand less.

Technology is cool and all, but not when it gets you less performance and then costs you way more. And like Shaun said, the cockpit does not have THAT much more stuff. And it's not like the Ferrari cockpit is cheap...the thing is covered in ultra high quality hand sown leather with state of the art f1 electronics.


The only reason the toyota costs so much more is cuz it is so different from regular toyotas. it's like they are saying "our regular cars are so boring to the point of vomiting, that this hot sports car is so unique and therefore you will pay way too much for it, even though you could get a ferrari which has the pedigree of a world championship winning f1 and sports car racing department with better performance for much less money"

rodjonathan

iTrader: (6)

^ amen very well put

shaunv74

Naw I don't think they pulled the number out of thin air and they can, of course, charge whatever the heck they want. I just want to know why it costs so much. I mean they're not even making money at that price

I suppose if they built the entire factory from the ground up and all the equipment and engineering is just for those 500 cars I can see it.

I suspect the accounts are hiding the actual costs of all the Priuses Toyota loses money on in the cost to build the LFA. How does that sound Alfy.

Rotr8

iTrader: (2)

That is a minor detail that will be adjusted on the production model, you must remember that the two rolling chassis that were in Homstead were 95% resolute prototypes,,,
We'll lets see they built the car with one of two existing CF rotary looms in the world(guess who has the other,,,, NASA) having this technology in house is a tremendous and still super expensive advantage, they didnt just go out and buy CF fabic and laminate it in an autoclave, having this loom essentailly allows them to 'grow' CF...It's(LFA) is currently the only car that is air cooled from the rear of the body, being a mid engine-front orientation car this is the first and only car to be able to successfully do that. Power is sent externally(outside the trannyhousing)by an offset gear through a torque tube to the rear diff, another worlds first... One of the main reasons it cost so much for this particular platform was that initially Toyota was going to build the entire body from Aluminum, when they met thier wieght goal they found that a chassis built out of Aluminum that was built for that wieght of a car wouldnt hold up to the tortion of the drivetrain so they scarpped that whole plan and build the tub from CF...

Quite the opposite, now that they have the rotary loom they can apply that tech to thier entire lineup, the tech will get cheaper dont worry,,,

shaunv74

I think I prefer the idea that they are hiding all the losses from those crappy Priuses in the LFA costs. That way the car would be a martyr for all the hippie tree huggers that think they're doing the world a favor, when in fact there's a bunch of petrol heads that are paying for their sins.

I do understand that they are investing heavily in infrastructure and R&D on mass production of carbon fiber and it's a good idea for them, as a company, to try and develop the technology in house. If they can make it affordable and scalable to make a Camry out of Carbon Fiber they will dominate the competition.

Rotr8

iTrader: (2)

yeah Ive never like the idea of baterries anyway, what do all the hippies think happens the all that hazardous waste anyway,,,

That was my piont all along, no matter what the opinion is of the LFA as a model, the most exciting thing is what will be learned, and made available to the general consumers in yrs to come,,,,

Renesis_8

Take a look at Autoblog's first drive of the LFA.

They definitely gained knowledge in how to produce carbon fibre/composite parts. Toyota could become the leader in mass producing composite parts for cars, and drive the cost down for everyone else. Of course, bringing in lots of $ while they're ahead of the game.
________
RubieROSE

BlueEyes

I think what some people are forgetting when talking about this cars price, especially against the competitors, is the exclusivity.

There will be 500 of these cars in the world. To put that in perspective, if I recall, there were over 12,000 Ferrari F430's made; 1200+ Carrera GT's, etc. This will be an exclusive car.

As well, at this echelon of performance, the idea that somehow a car 0.1secs faster to 60 is the better car is ludacris. They're all better cars than you are drivers.

rodjonathan

iTrader: (6)

^ maybe true and 0-60 times arent really important theyre just numbers but put track times down too and i bet you the Ferrari will still dominate also yes its exclusivity but Ferrari is a name tag ... so thats where i find it hard to digest ... however if this car succeeds in trickling technology and life into their other cars then it definitely is a great success otherwise ... not so much

Renesis_8

Speedhunter has a very good article on the LFA

http://speedhunters.com/archive/2009...-the-lf-a.aspx






________
DulcetBaby live

Renesis_8

The V10 engine is said to be shorter than Toyota's 3.5L V6 under the hood of Camrys, etc.
________
Vaporizer wiki

8 Maniac

iTrader: (1)

Know of any place that has good pics of the looms? There was a clip in one of the LF-A videos but it was way too short considering how interesting and complex that machine is.

Rotr8

iTrader: (2)

yeah thats the only place Ive actually seen it too, Autoblog said they are working with Lexus PR to get a chance to photograph it, almost liek a behind the scenes scenario...

what I want to know about is the uber secret compound and tread pattern Bridgestone developed specifically for the car...

DailyDriver2k5

Its still not worth 375k , other cars out there for far less cash with equal or more tech and can run circles around the LF-A. And not to mention can be driven every day to and from work then to the track and back again.

ZR-1 and GT-R proves this.

I would pay $375k for a Mazda Furai before I would drop $375k on the LF-A. Even if the Furai may not be as technically advance(which we all know it is) but if it wasn't, at least the hyper car looks justifies its price tag, I can't say the same for the LF-A.

Everybody keeps throwing that the LF-A is so technical, the GT-R is more technically advance then the LF-A, on paper the GT-R should fail in more ways then one, its close to 4k lbs, totes less HP/torque(even though we know Nissan underated the GT-R and it sporting close to 520HP) then its competition,has a bunch of computers and PS3's-(joking) to determine active suspension travel, power to the wheels, yaw control,brake pressure, etc, the car is so disconnected from the driver because of computer controlled non-sense, the driver should crash on the first turn it because he is not one with his machine, yet when executed in real life , it can best a GT3 Porsche on a track, smoke a Z-06 in out the hole sprints and twisties except in top end speed, out handles many Ferraris, Lamborghinis and exotics alike, and thats not even the Spec V version. This car from Nissan has many in the industry scratching there head and saying , HOW??????


Until Toyota can create a sports car in the 70k-90k range and beat most of those car mentioned above, I am not impressed , and even so with the $375k price tag. 500 limited or not, I guess Toyota forgot what happened in the '90s. People don't want to pay 100k or more for a Japanese car, (unless its looks like the Furai)look how hard it was to sell the NSX. The only thing to justify the 90k price tag of the NSX was its gorgeous Italian esque body , the industry knew its couldn't hold its own against any exotic from the mid '90's era on up, maybe in the beginning of the '90's. The Type-R excluded the NSX is just another pretty face .

I like the LF-A, but definitely not in love with the car. As the saying goes, sometimes less is more, I rather pick car "A "that is less and does more then pick the LF-A that is more and does less.

shaunv74

Yeah but if they made say 1000 or even 2000 of these they could either A) Sell them for less because they can amortize the R&D and infrastructure they created across more cars, or B)lose less/make a profit at the current price and still be super exclusive. I don't anyone would pay less because there are 1000 vs. 500.

Wolverine

There's more pics of the LF-A, with the spoiler up, on the track in the "Super Autobacs" thread just in case you needed to see more pics.

BlueEyes

It seems to me the fundamental problem people have with the price tag is that they can't comprehend having $375K to spend on a car that's not the worlds most uber elite hyper car. There are people out there that own dozens of Ferrari's, Lamborghini's, Porsche's etc. These are the people that will buy the car. Not some guy who has saved up his entire life to afford a Ferrari while he lives in a semi-detached.

Toyota will probably sell all 500. Which means it is worth the price.

Rotr8

iTrader: (2)

yes exactly , people on here talk like "awww man if it were $120K, that would be perfect," really? you still couldnt afford one, and what do you know about making and selling hypercars,,,

dos

All 500 will most likely be gone before 1 even hits a dealer lot. People who can afford this car won't blink twice about the price tag. I can't afford a LFA, GTR and with a kid on the way my dreams of a Audi S5 will have to wait. Damn!!! Who am I to tell Toyota/Lexus to take a hike.

bassy

It seems to me that some people here talk about rich people and how rich people spend their money like they're actually rich people. If you were sooo rich, this forum shouldn't be where you hang out.

Until I actually see or read about rich people falling head over heels over these LF-A's and until I see all these LF-A's sold out, I ain't believe it.

Remember, image is everything. And that goes for both the rich and poor, although the poor have more important things to worry about than image.

Lexus = luxury appliance

But time will tell whether people will change their perceptions of Lexus. It's too early to say if the LF-A is a hit or a miss. I am suspecting it's the latter, though.

ferg

hmm, well when your rich you have more free time to do things that you like, like being on forms

bassy

Well, yeah...but not a lowly "RX8club" forum. That's what I meant.