Rx8bydocabe

what do F1 cars have? is it SMG? and will it shift for the driver if the driver doesn't? just curious.

sti_eric

Yes, F1 cars have an SMG (sequential manual gearbox). Yes, it can be placed in fully automatic mode.

http://www.automotive-technology.com/projects/williams/
The vehicle uses semi-automatic transmission which allows the driver to make rapid gear shifts. Other benefits of the system are:

Adaptive compensation for AP clutch wear
Throttle blipper or full throttle by wire
CAN link to engine ECU for accurate speed control
Clutched and clutchless change strategy available
Range of driver strategies available eg: wet/dry, clutched/clutchless
Fully automatic up and down shift options available
In-built data logging and operating statistics
Automatic retry on failure to engage.

Sequential Gearboxes are superior on the track, which is why many forms of racing are migrating to it. It is not "a novelty" as was ignorantly claimed in a post above. It is racecar technology that is making its way into production vehicles, and we will see more and more of these appearing as people begin to realize that they are superior to a regular manual transmission.

macnrx8

Never thought I would say this....Ike is 100% correct. AUTOMATIC!!!! Just drove one 30 min. ago. Only options are "standard manual" and DSG w/tiptronic. I drove the tiptronic and it will shift for you just past redline and downshifts automatically when stopping. One good thing though....it does shift nicely for an automatic.

sti_eric

I liken you to the baseball "purists" who fought tooth and nail against having a wild card team make the playoffs. Now, just about everyone agrees that having a September when you have 15-20 teams fighting for a playoff berth is much more exciting and is better for baseball. It will just be a matter of time before you "purists" will stop your illogical fight against sequential gearboxes and realize that they are superior.

cleoent

That is completely programmable by the car company.

Ike claims to have driven a DSG GTI, so if he says it will upshift for you, then it probably will. I can assure you that there are others that will not shift for you and allow you to ping off the rev limiter all day.

My mazda 3 is a traditional auto and it will even allow me to do that in tiptronic mode. This is not a feature exclusive reserved for a F1 style tranny.

cleoent

Please, dont make this claim for every F1 style tranny, as it is not true.

Thanks.

snizzle

It's the future as long as they can make it as cheap as a traditional AT. It's been rumored that Mazda was looking at SMG or something along those lines but it was also rumored that we'd see a Mazdaspeed RX8 so who knows.

saturn

Funny you should mention that. I emailed Mazda a few months ago and told them to make a MAZDASPEED RX-8 with FI and an SMG-style tranny. They replied and said "ok, you're the boss". So, we should be all set.

snizzle

Sounds good. Now tell them the release date is in two weeks and assume it all went to plan.

Ike

You've said that several times now but I haven't seen an example of one that doesn't yet. So why don't you enlighten me/us.

r0tor

iTrader: (1)

a) whats the point of the tranny not shifting into first once you stop - it just saves you the trouble of flicking something 6 times anyway

b) why are you reving past redline? Would you rather have it hold gear and bounce off of a rev limiter and kill your acceleration, or flick it to the next gear because you were to ignorant to do so?


... you can drive a car with either tranny hard all day and if driving correctly it will never to anything you do not desire.

cleoent

I created the same polls on two other car sites i am a regular on.

bimmerforums.com

tehdriven.com

There have been no votes for auto I'm not surprised. It seems most are voting in category 3, and a few in category 1. Those that live with BMW's SMG II say that there is no way the car can be left to shift on it's own because it does such a terrible job.

Of course both boards are bmw influenced, so most of them know what SMG type trannies are, vs here where if you're a mazda guy you dont know much about them. It's very interesting to see how different the poll results are.

Ike

Yeah, all of these RX-8 owners don't know what a SMG is... Of course I can't imagine it would be that the BMW guys are biased and bigger suckers for marketing than the people here, no that couldn't be it...

Ike

C'mon man, you should have had an anwser for this right away... Google search now helping you out fast enough

r0tor

iTrader: (1)

tell me how you would then classify an automatic transmission that gets its automatic feature ripped out?

A GM powerglide tranny is most definately an automatic tranny but in race form no longer has its automatic shifting ability? Would you like to call that a manual transmission then???

cleoent

The ferrari i drove doesn't.

My mazda doesn't. It's traditional auto, but it doesn't.

I didn't test the m3 that much (bounce off limiter but i will ask).

I think the only one that might, is the gti you drove, i've never really heard of a car that does that. The new m5 (7-speed smg III ) doesn't. AMG's traditional auto's dont do that, neither do audi's...

Let me find out about the m3.

yiksing

Its a manual (no torque converter), sadly most car owners can't tell the difference.

saturn

cleoent, do you thinka DSG can properly be described as a "sequential manual gearbox"?

Ike

Please post again when you can make sense.

cleoent

No.

But "sequential manual gearbox" is BMW's term for their f1 style tranny, and that would be a trademark violation.

I think DSG can be properly desrcibed as an F1 style transmission. I think it could be properly described as a manual transmission with automatic capabilities.

r0tor

iTrader: (1)

read and get a clue ... its an autmatic tranny that gets converted into a 1-2-N-R for racing, aka not able to shift itself anymore

its still an automatic transmission though!

cleoent

Most of the rx8 owners in our conversations yesterday didn't even know that SMG (as you continue to describe it) is just BMW's term for their F1 style tranny.


The bmw guys are purists just the same (the community as a whole was so disgusted the new m5 doesn't come with a 6 spd manual that bmw was forced to make that an option on the new m5 next year) and some hate HATE HATE SMG and everything it stands for, that being said, so those same guys will tell you, it's not an automatic transmission.

saturn

So the defining component of an automatic is its torque converter, and the defining component of a manual is the clutch (whether it be computer controlled or pedal controlled)?

I don't see how that is any more valid than saying the defining characteristic of a manual is that you have to manually shift gears and the defining characterstic of an automatic is that it can automatically shift gears.

I personally think my way makes more sense from a linguistic standpoint. But, to each his own.

Ike

Or we could just call it an oxy moron

cleoent

This is from the admin of the bimmerforums.com (biggest bmw board in the US, maybe world, dont know)


lol B would suck.