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This very thread is what I see is the main problem. Honest commoners like ourselves trying to objectively evaluate a situation that is in front of us.
But it is in front of us because those we think and trust are supposed to know better are writing policy based on garbage.
I think the world is in one of the most dangerous times in history, not because of climate problems, but leadership problems.
We are governed by idiots. All of us, regardless of nation represented here. The level of incompetence and corruption is astounding. Throw in a mighty dose of hubris, and you have a very explosive combination.
Reuters, AP, and of course the Fact Check sites should be used with great caution, as should G---le. They are not your friends. Treat them as tabloids, not authorities. They are all part of the problem.
I don't know about this particular case, but I have caught them all in lies on almost a daily basis. In fact, anytime I really look, I am astounded of how they tint news. And news becomes history.
The people who VOTE for these morons time and time again deserve to reap that which they sowed.
It is unbelievable that bureaucrats who advise these people in power (politicians) have NOT GOT A F*CKING CLUE on how anything really works or
runs, how a IC Engine works and the fuels they use, todays ICE are the most efficient and give the best bang for the buck than ANY other power source per litre/gallon including EV.
Let alone the convenience factor, Gasoline powered car 500 miles in < 3 minutes (a tank fill) or 500 miles in 6 hours (a battery re-charge), to just ban or change a fuel source within a small time frame is nonsense.
Newsom has also banned 2 stroke Leaf Blowers, domestic Lawnmowers, and large ride on field mowers, replaced by Power Pack units that have a minimal battery life of < 5 years.
How about they let the market and the consumer decide.
DONT get started on the Climate Change chargers.
Ash,
I agree completely.
Recently, in the US White House, it was found that the almost entire Cabinet had never (yes never) worked in the private sector in their entire lives. They went from academia to government. I bet if you dig, you will find this same issue in many governments today. This is one of many reasons why unrealistic policies destined to fail and cause misery, are becoming the norm, not the exception.
This very thread is what I see is the main problem.
At least we agree on that. There appears to be an assumption that the government is always wrong (see your own, Ash's and 200's posts), all governments everywhere are wrong, therefore nothing the government says is true and anything that supports its actions must be a lie. It's conclusions before evidence.
Ash in particular is for some reason claiming that gasoline power is cheaper than EV which is demonstrably false with basic arithmetic. So I don't think any of yall are interested in the situation before you, you just want to bash the government (s). Or listen and repeat people that do.
One system is currently working, with admitted flaws (what doesn't have flaws?) ....
It's a wonderful thing to get people to firmly believe in a looming disaster in the future.....
Solar and wind are, "green energy" now, but in 20 years will it be seen the same as the Fossil Fuel Boogyman when fusion or whatever next comes around? More than likely, then we'll have to pay whomever billions/trillions to support that new, "green energy". The circle keeps repeating itself.
At least we agree on that. There appears to be an assumption that the government is always wrong (see your own, Ash's and 200's posts), all governments everywhere are wrong, therefore nothing the government says is true and anything that supports its actions must be a lie. It's conclusions before evidence.
Ash in particular is for some reason claiming that gasoline power is cheaper than EV which is demonstrably false with basic arithmetic. So I don't think any of yall are interested in the situation before you, you just want to bash the government (s). Or listen and repeat people that do.
No, not really. If you read what I have written and the arbitrary nature of government policy with regard to "transitioning" to a green economy, and take a step back maybe you will see the point. This is not something you can force, and yet they try.
Someone brought up the IPhone, and how it was buggy at first. Yes ,it was, but there was no government mandate in place for everyone to buy one, on an arbitrary timeline, set by some central planner, which in effect is what is happening here. If EV works, people will buy them, and gas stations will eventually become fewer and fewer.
Like now with phones. Who doesn't have a smartphone? It is your choice if you don't want one. But if you do, there are so many to choose from. That is how it should be done. People will "vote" their own self interests, as well they should. Not be forced. The governments, coupled with "scientists" are creating a very toxic alliance.
Also Time and other publications had numerous articles in the 70s (quoting scientists, of course) about the looming Ice Age, even if the cover art example was false. My mom was a subscriber, I remember them .
Not all government is bad, but the current group of clowns should take some award. Do you feel they are competent to manage such an undertaking as energy transition after the c19 fiasco the last 2 years? I was railing about that back then, and almost everything I predicted then came to pass. With more to be unveiled as time goes on.
Just wait until they unveil the de-pop strategies. Think its impossible? No way.
Last edited by kevink0000; 08-25-2022 at 09:47 AM.
A preface to my next comments. I'm all for looking at alternative and renewable energy sources, away from coal and oil.
However, I live in the state of South Australia, where 70% of our electricity on any given day is generated from renewable sources, such as solar and wind. When the conditions are right and the sun is shining, we can generate enough solar energy to meet 110% of our current electricty demands. Our government has invested heavily in renewable energy sources, is continuing to spend heavily, and is proud to spruik that we're a state that leads the world in this area...
But.... South Australia has the most expensive electricty out of all the states and territories in Australia. On average we pay 20% more than everyone else. So as consumers, apart from feeling 'good' that we're using predominantly renewable energies, it is costing us a lot more.
For the last ten years our government has been pushing residential home owners to install roof top solar systems, and provided subsidies to incentivise people to do so to stop the reliance on coal fired power stations. We also use to be paid, in credits, a fair amount for any excess solar energy we produced from our home solar systems, that was sent back to the grid to be used by others.
Fast forward 10 years and over 40% of homes in our state have solar panels fitted to their roofs. Now in Summer when the sun is shining the authorities turn off power to suburbs, as the electricty grid and infrastructure can't handle all the power that is generated from the home roof top solar panels. Encouraged and rewarded at one time to install home solar systems, now we have power disconected for hours at a time, unless we invest further in home batteries to provide our own power when the electricty is shut off. We use to be paid credits for the excess solar we generated, now we're being advised that that in the near future we will likley be charged per Kw of solar energy we send back to the grid. We've been advised also that our taxes are likely to increase significantly to fund the billions of dollars required to upgrade our states electricty infrastructure....
Some might say this is just typical teething problems of using alternative energy sources. But right now in our state we aren't living the 'green dream' that our politicians told us we would.
Are the components in almost anything these days not Chinese? Are we worried China is building an empire on solar panels? Or os this about cobalt and nickel mining? One climate disaster doesn't cancel the other one.
I was asking because there is a movement here in the USA to have solar panels domestically made. I think it is a good idea to generally try not support one the most brutal, repressive, and now powerful (because of the West's weakness and love of $$) regimes in history, with making more of our infrastructure. Don't you?
I was asking because there is a movement here in the USA to have solar panels domestically made. I think it is a good idea to generally try not support one the most brutal, repressive, and now powerful (because of the West's weakness and love of $$) regimes in history, with making more of our infrastructure. Don't you?
Cut costs, increase profits, make shareholders happy, buy back stock, ignore refining and power infrastructure improvements, while maintaining it just enough to keep it profitable.
That's been the Big Business strategy for decades.
Cut costs, increase profits, make shareholders happy, buy back stock, ignore refining and power infrastructure improvements, while maintaining it just enough to keep it profitable.
That's been the Big Business strategy for decades.
not to mention the basic assumption everything will just continue on as it has and thus being completely oblivious to the possibility that the world as you know it today might not even exist any more by then …
it will just keep going on forever; eating and drinking to your hearts content, the joyful feasts of marrying and giving to marriage, one minute taking every word so seriously and the next posting up some hypocritical nonsense on the tab of employer who will never cease sending you a paycheck …
as if that thief in the night will never unexpectedly walk through your door at an hour when you expect it not and neither are prepared for it.
.
This might be relevant, it's not an MSM or gov't source, so maybe it's not automatically a lie?
https: //twitter.com/RoachSN/status/1562512812802703360
For some reason we can't post twitter links properly. Have a look.
"UK gas power now costs a staggering 9 times more than renewables"
Again, climate problems aside, I don't understand why keeping the oil industry running is worth more than money in your pocket, or the dependence on a controlled substance. If you follow the theories they go to insane places: the government both started wars over oil, and wasted money fighting them for 20 years, but is also wasting money on breaking oil reliance and alternative energy.
Ah, a pro-russian and pro-chinese propagandist, 9/11 conspiracist and climate denier, who somehow earned a mention by NATO information warfare specialists. That tracks with what I see on site. But he's above board and we should repeat his claims? If you're worried about covers of Time Magazine from the 70s, wait till you read the **** you find on Sputnik, that his site reposts.
This might be relevant, it's not an MSM or gov't source, so maybe it's not automatically a lie?
https: //twitter.com/RoachSN/status/1562512812802703360
For some reason we can't post twitter links properly. Have a look.
"UK gas power now costs a staggering 9 times more than renewables"
I was asking because there is a movement here in the USA to have solar panels domestically made. I think it is a good idea to generally try not support one the most brutal, repressive, and now powerful (because of the West's weakness and love of $$) regimes in history, with making more of our infrastructure. Don't you?
Sounds great, let me know when its competitive. I'd like nothing more, but it's a free market. Unless... wait... what if the gov't offered subsidies? :o
the uk sucks and is a silly place, we are talking about a us state here. i dont see how this is remotely legal but time and time again its proven that our betters dgaf about laws, kinda like people getting more of our money stolen to pay for some idiots gender studies degree . we are living in a banana republic and the rule of law is dead. act accordingly
anyway im out of this thread before i get banned, i know someone here is dying to drop the hammer on me
Ah, a pro-russian and pro-chinese propagandist, 9/11 conspiracist and climate denier, who somehow earned a mention by NATO information warfare specialists. That tracks with what I see on site. But he's above board and we should repeat his claims? If you're worried about covers of Time Magazine from the 70s, wait till you read the **** you find on Sputnik, that his site reposts.
You really didn't realize that was a set-up?
Last edited by kevink0000; 08-25-2022 at 02:11 PM.
Ah, a pro-russian and pro-chinese propagandist, 9/11 conspiracist and climate denier, who somehow earned a mention by NATO information warfare specialists. That tracks with what I see on site. But he's above board and we should repeat his claims? If you're worried about covers of Time Magazine from the 70s, wait till you read the **** you find on Sputnik, that his site reposts.
I posted this because it was going to end up being chum in the water for someone. I suspected it would be Loki, but it could have been anyone.
This goes to my point also about where to get info. It's not easy.
Wikipedia is not much less a prop source than that guy's website for many topics.
In the amount of time you took, it's doubtful you went anywhere else to see if the Wikipedia entry was accurate. Which it sounds like it probably is, but also has a distinct smell of propaganda itself. Do you not agree?
Did you look to see if the chart was accurate? I doubt it. You just went with what Wikipedia said, because it propped up your own bias about people here, which you are so very quick to accuse others of.
Not trying to beat you up personally, it could have been anyone.
Its too quick and easy to jump to conclusions, especially in this modern, so very enlightened age.
Sounds great, let me know when its competitive. I'd like nothing more, but it's a free market. Unless... wait... what if the gov't offered subsidies? :o
When the government offers subsidies, things get more expensive, not less. This has been proven time and again.
I posted this because it was going to end up being chum in the water for someone. I suspected it would be Loki, but it could have been anyone.
This goes to my point also about where to get info. It's not easy.
Wikipedia is not much less a prop source than that guy's website for many topics.
In the amount of time you took, it's doubtful you went anywhere else to see if the Wikipedia entry was accurate. Which it sounds like it probably is, but also has a distinct smell of propaganda itself. Do you not agree?
Did you look to see if the chart was accurate? I doubt it. You just went with what Wikipedia said, because it propped up your own bias about people here, which you are so very quick to accuse others of.
Not trying to beat you up personally, it could have been anyone.
Its too quick and easy to jump to conclusions, especially in this modern, so very enlightened age.
I mean I went to the site and scanned the type of takes it has on other current events. Red flags went off, that lead me to wikipedia and on to other references to this "Center for Research". Wikipedia isn't exactly an opinion piece, most of the statements there are cited, you're free to verify them, unlike whatever research this center does or doesn't do. If I got something wrong, please tell me, but a fast opinion isn't automatically a wrong opinion. Doubt isn't a stance.
I could take more time to find other graphs but I didn't particularly feel like arguing with an etch-a-sketch drawing of Greenland ice core records, which may or may not be a good indicator, if it's even accurate given the lack of actual research citation. We can go down that road if it's productive, that would at least improve the level of discourse here.
08-25-2022, 06:12 AM
