WTBRotary!

iTrader: (6)

Okay guys some background info:

I got a new engine about 4K miles ago after initially being denied by Mazda. After receiving the Reman I let her break in on MM's Base Tune and started to premix w/ Idemitsu @ 1K miles (6oz.).

Im now on MM's 4.05 tune.

So the last month or so ive noticed my car running a tad rougher (Around April 5th)
and making a weird noise up in the higher rpms. Today I noticed my car start to bog down again and make the EXACT SAME NOISE my old engine made before it **** itself randomly.

So I had a thought that maybe MM's tunes were masking a problem my engine had developed, so I decided to reflash my car to the stock ECU tune (MSP-16). It obviously ran rougher at idle but I noticed I would misfire ANYTIME I came or went above 6K RPMS. WTF!!! I grabbed a few datalogs but I forget when I switched tunes so... :/

Even under half throttle I would misfire as soon as I hit 6k. Doesnt Matter if I was WOT either. I drive around for awhile messing around but still cant figure it out. I noticed when I got to 6K rpms my engine would BOG down really bad and the CEL would flash.

I decide to try MM's 4.05 tune to see if I get any misfires or bogging down. I reflash my ECU and go for a spin. Idle is smoother upon start up as expected. Slowly reaching to 6K and above does NOT produce a misfire or CEL flash but it does BOG down still a little, not nearly as pronounced though.

Does this seem weird to anyone? I should not misfire on the Stock MSP-16 flash let alone MM's Tune. This leads me to assume that MM's tune is covering up a problem.

Here are the Videos, They are kinda Choppy but they get the Job done.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m8nWZni3asI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XJ8hw5jHvpw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0N9Y23MLAf4


Ill try to post some Datalogs to show yall whats going on...


DISCLAIMER: I am not blaming Jeff for this at all, after rewatching the videos I caught a hint I might be making it seem like that. What Im trying to say is I believe Jeffs Tune might be masking my engines problem and making is seem less pronounced because his tunes are custom to make the car run better.

yiksing

Are all the valves opening up properly? The loud pop on 3rd video sounds like a backfire to me but the bogging is apparent though.

WTBRotary!

iTrader: (6)

I cleaned my SSV like 2K miles ago and it was still clean. Im sure the pops are backfires lol, its just habit to go "Pop" or "Bam"
Im glad you can hear it bogging down though. Its way more pronounced on the Stock MSP-16 flash than MM's 4.05 Flash. Idk why that is...

dannobre

iTrader: (3)

Coils, plugs, wires?

Injector/s?

Intake ECU......

Ton's of things it could be.....

WTBRotary!

iTrader: (6)

Im thinking I just had to of gotten a shitty reman because ive never gotten worse MPG than with this engine, and I shouldnt be. I find it hard to break 17mpg in this thing even in mixed driving/highway driving. I should be getting atleast DECENT MPG stock, even better with all the mods I have to help MPG and reliability.

My Reman sounds alot like HiFlite999' Highway8's. It smokes, and it gets horrid MPG.

WTBRotary!

iTrader: (6)

I have BHR's Ignition system basically brand new. When I first received my reman I was premixing and running on MM's Base tune it basically fried my brand new oem CAT that I got with my new reman. I took my car in and the replaced the CAT but said it was the Ignition system that caused mifires and ultimately caused my CAT to fail (somehow in like 2k miles) . I laughed at them and told them It wasnt the BHR Ignition but sent it off to Charles anyways to double check my coils were okay. He shipped me my ignition system back with new coils. My plugs are brand new as well.

Injectors? Im not sure if it could be these, not quite sure how to check them either. Can you tell if they are operating correctly by looking at a Datalog?

Intake? I dont think it was my intake as my car has made this noise regardless of rain .

ECU? Im not quite sure how I would figure that one out either...

Why would my car not misfire when running MM's tune but would misfire when running the MSP-16 tune. It doesnt make sense

Hope this helps Dan.

Nadrealista

I would start by pulling and inspecting the plugs..frying the cat that quickly means you are sending lot of unburned fuel down the exhaust.

datalogging would be a good next step.

or just take it back to dealer and let them deal with it..they just put the new engine in and it is not running right.

olddragger

iTrader: (3)

Like someone already said dude--could be tons of things.
Could be fuel pressure/ injectors leaking/vacuum leak/pcm etc etc.
You just have to work down the list.
You are right in your statement that the custom tune will make the engine run better, but the problem is still there.
What is your vacuum reading?
Do you do the pedal dance? What dtc's are showing?

Nadrealista

what is healthy renesis vacuum reading at idle?

HiFlite999

iTrader: (2)

I have an original engine with 23k miles, must be thinking of someone else here. I remember though that Rotary-Kytten told me she has a recent reman in hers that get 19 mpg highway vx. 21 in the previous motor. Might be a common problem with the recent ones.

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

How long were you back on the stock tune? I would check the plugs just to be sure, I replaced min this past weekend and they were done after less than a year and on eof them was not really tight so i wonder if that had something to do with it. My problem was not as bad as yours but I was having a bogging issue and it disappeared after I put the new plugs in.

MazdaManiac

iTrader: (3)

If it is misfiring more on the OE tune, than it is probably the APV.

WTBRotary!

iTrader: (6)

I will check the plugs to be safe but they have like 7K miles on them Max. My Cat clogged because I was on MM's Base Tune which increases how much the OMP shoots in, and I was premixing 6-8 oz. of Idemitsu.

My dealer is really cool/calm about modifications done to cars but I dont have my CAT installed nor my Air Pump. Normally my dealer wouldnt care but since id be taking it in for an Engine related problem no CAT (Even though it has nothing to do with how much engine is acting) looks bad on my part.

I really do think, keyword Think, its my engine though I have NO compression numbers or Vac readings, I need to get those soon.

Im just not sure how to test my if its my fuel injectors are leaking...

As for the PCM/ECU I have had some weird problems! I have talked to Jeff (MM) about this slightly but sometimes when I am redlining my car in 3rd gear ill push into fuel cutoff usually letting off and decelerating. Every once in awhile as soon as I hit redline my rpms will like jump down to 7K rpms then jump back up to redline. There is a power surge for sure and the only way I can describe it (could be wrong) is it felt like a clutch letting go then grabbing again, there was a jerk in power for sure. This happens so rare I have not been able to record it on video nor datalog :/

Any ideas? This never happened before I installed the Cobb AP like half a year or so ago, but then again Ive had this Cobb for half the life of my car so :/

Okay im glad someone agrees with my custom tune statement... I do not know my Vacuum reading, I need to test it out. I dont have a Vacuum gauge (Lost it) but I will buy another soon and figure out where to test it (Nipple behind throttle body right?)

Im not familar with this "Pedal Dance" you speak of and "DTCs", sorry im usually good with this car jargon lol.


Im sorry sir, I confused you with Highway8 for some reason. Sorry man...

I was on the stock tune for around 30 minutes, just to test the waters. Ill check the plugs but they only have like 7-8K miles on them.

As for you bogging down issue I was reading about it slightly in this thread ( https://www.rx8club.com/showthread.p...=vacuum+tester )
This kinda sounds like whats happening to me. That noise or bogging down is what my last engine sounded like before it crapped out on me for some reason, but I will check the plugs if that fixed it for you.

as for your MAF readings mine are around 230-240g/s @ Redline so :/


I will check out the APV and see if this guy is causing the problem. I just hope its not the ECU/PCM problem I was discussing with you slightly.


I will post a few datalogs from the my 4.05 tune from MM...


2nd gear Accel. Pedal Position of ~30% to redline
https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?...CO-PiIwK#gid=0

2nd & 3rd gear redline @ WOT
https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?...COjw8PcB#gid=0

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

Check your APV, there is a video here that Jon13g posted on how to do it. Then check your plugs.

WTBRotary!

iTrader: (6)

http://www.vimeo.com/5353829

Jesus it took me forever to Find Jon, the search function on this website...

At anyrate the video helps out alot but to test the APV Im going to have to remove the motor that opens the valves and apply current to it? :/

Dammit, because the APV isnt controlled by Vacuum this is going to be annoying...

Edit: I just uploaded my datalogs (Last post) ... I dont believe it is my APV because I dont see any problems from my MAF Airflow jumping up anywhere from 6-9K... Assuming my APV would cause problems my MAF at WOT would be around what 9krpmrx8's was (~195 @ Redline)

WTBRotary!

iTrader: (6)

Bump...

So I went out and bought a MityVac to test my Vacuum



I tested the VDI and SSV, both of them worked correctly and opened up fully around 10" of Vacuum.

I tested my Vacuum at idle by the valve under the throttle body and got 17" of Vacuum fully warmed up.



As for the APV couldnt you have the help of another person to see if the APV Motor opens the APV at 6K+ rpms while revving in neutral? From my Datalogs my APV seems to be opening up just fine.

Any ideas anyone?

DocBeech

iTrader: (1)

Did you check the omp as well? You need to test you oil injectors and make sure one of them isn't locked. If it is then your not getting any oil to the apex seals and well that would end the life of your engine.

Edit - You caught up right before I posted for you to get a vacuum tester.

WTBRotary!

iTrader: (6)

OMP values are fine as monitored from my Cobb AP and the datalogs I have from it. I did not check it myself but I will give it a good visual scan to make sure everything looks okay. I premix 6-8oz. of Idemitsu so if one of my lines was partially blocked I still have some protection...

DocBeech

iTrader: (1)

Your vacuum levels are within reason. Next up is for you to check all of your vacuum lines and valves and make sure none of them have any leaks, and they are all opening properly.

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

it does look like your engine is not getting enough air of some kind. it happened me once cuz the side plates inside my airbox fell apart, and it blocked 1/2 the throttle all the time. and it makes some weird noise when I go on my throttle. took me a while to figure it out, fix it, good as new. but that's just me.

WTBRotary!

iTrader: (6)

You should be able to tell (most of the time from what I understand) if you have a vac leak based on your datalogs. Jeff diagnosed someone having a vac leak by looking at their logs. I just received my 5th tune from Jeff and he hasnt said anything for the rest of the tunes so everything seems to be okay. I have my VDI & SSV with my hand and a vacuum. They both work. I have no taken a look at the APV but based of my datalogs it seems to be working okay.

Hmm. How does it look like my engine isnt getting enough of air? How are you coming to that conclusion? Im not saying your wrong but I dont see how you came to that. Can you elaborate?

Im stuck scratching my head at what this could be...

DocBeech

iTrader: (1)

So no vacuum leaks? No air flow problems? From your photo your vacuum at the throttle body is really good, but you having a misfire problem at 6K?

How are your plug wires? I understand you got new coils, and your plugs are ok, but could you have a problem with the plug wires?

Also your e-shaft sensor? Might be either a problem with the e-shaft sensor not detecting the proper time to fire off the plugs. If its dirty, or maybe even the wire/sensor itself is acting up. If the timing is thrown off by a bad e-shaft sensor that would do it, it would cause the plugs to fire off late which in turn would give you a back fire from excessive fuel being sent through the exhaust. It would also explain your trouble past 6K RPM. If its only a tiny bit off it would be less noticable at low rpms due to the motors sensors possibly correcting the timing, but become more prevalent at higher rpms. Its just a thought to be had.

WTBRotary!

iTrader: (6)

I only misfire when Im on the Stock MSP-16 flash. When im on my 4.05 MM Tune I do not misfire, but I do still bog if im about 50% on the throttle, if under WOT you can feel the bog still through the power delivery, its not butter smooth, its somewhat jerky a little about 7K. Now by bog what I mean is not a power loss (per say) but very rough unsmooth power delivery. Youd have to have a VERY good foot to be smooth while slowly accelerating with this Bog.

My plug wires should are fine, ive checked them.

I havent checked the E-shaft sensor, I will take a look at that and clean/reset it in hopes of that helping me.

:/

alz0rz

iTrader: (41)

Make sure you didn't mismatch the coil terminals on the engine harness...

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

I don't believe you can test the APV while at a stand still I believe the PCM needs to see load so having a friend there won't help.


Clean the ESS, MAF, everything. I did all this and as i said, it ended up being plugs but just cover all your bases.