car just died on the road
05-18-2010, 08:49 AM
#26
Registered
@ninjajim4........ So
-The car stumbles and dies. It cranks strongly but won't start.
-You get on your phone and text in your situation and get an almost immediate response from club members. The help offered is not very useful but must have been comforting.
-You suspect an ignition issue, and since you changed to Yukon coils, and the tow might take you to the dealer, you call out your buddy to bring you the stock coils. You also call the tow truck.
-Your buddy arrives before the tow and you swap out the coils. It is pouring rain at times. The car fires right up and you scoot out of town. Tow truck is still out there looking for you. You kick yourself that you didn't check for spark before the swap. Don't worry about it, there almost certainly wasn't any.
-Suggested problems are bad cat, poor compression, bad coils, mystery electrical connection issues.
-You argue against a single bad coil or connection, since the others would have fired and provided some ignition feedback. You appear to suspect a total ignition failure but can't see how that could be. You are not alone.
-You're hesitant about getting a compression test. I say forget about it unless it's handy and free. When the car would not start, you were still pumping gas into it. This would have washed down some of the oil and decreased compression. The fact that it started right away on changing out the coils suggests that the compression was still pretty good.
-I also say take the car out and run it as fast and as hard as you can to get as much air flowing through that cat as possible. You're not going to get much power out of this car if the cat is plugged, and it should be pretty noticeable. Flow through cat is insignificant during cranking.
-You owe it to the club and mankind to sort out this ignition issue. I say stick with the stocks for a while and pay attention to how it starts and runs. Then switch back to the Yukons and run those until and if you have an issue. Keep your stocks in the trunk.
Finally, can someone please explain this grounding thing. Stock coils are grounded through one of the three pins in the connector. Do Yukons have four pins, and one of those brought out and physically grounded to the engine?
-The car stumbles and dies. It cranks strongly but won't start.
-You get on your phone and text in your situation and get an almost immediate response from club members. The help offered is not very useful but must have been comforting.
-You suspect an ignition issue, and since you changed to Yukon coils, and the tow might take you to the dealer, you call out your buddy to bring you the stock coils. You also call the tow truck.
-Your buddy arrives before the tow and you swap out the coils. It is pouring rain at times. The car fires right up and you scoot out of town. Tow truck is still out there looking for you. You kick yourself that you didn't check for spark before the swap. Don't worry about it, there almost certainly wasn't any.
-Suggested problems are bad cat, poor compression, bad coils, mystery electrical connection issues.
-You argue against a single bad coil or connection, since the others would have fired and provided some ignition feedback. You appear to suspect a total ignition failure but can't see how that could be. You are not alone.
-You're hesitant about getting a compression test. I say forget about it unless it's handy and free. When the car would not start, you were still pumping gas into it. This would have washed down some of the oil and decreased compression. The fact that it started right away on changing out the coils suggests that the compression was still pretty good.
-I also say take the car out and run it as fast and as hard as you can to get as much air flowing through that cat as possible. You're not going to get much power out of this car if the cat is plugged, and it should be pretty noticeable. Flow through cat is insignificant during cranking.
-You owe it to the club and mankind to sort out this ignition issue. I say stick with the stocks for a while and pay attention to how it starts and runs. Then switch back to the Yukons and run those until and if you have an issue. Keep your stocks in the trunk.
Finally, can someone please explain this grounding thing. Stock coils are grounded through one of the three pins in the connector. Do Yukons have four pins, and one of those brought out and physically grounded to the engine?
05-18-2010, 10:03 AM
#27
@ninjajim4........ So
-The car stumbles and dies. It cranks strongly but won't start.
-You get on your phone and text in your situation and get an almost immediate response from club members. The help offered is not very useful but must have been comforting.
-You suspect an ignition issue, and since you changed to Yukon coils, and the tow might take you to the dealer, you call out your buddy to bring you the stock coils. You also call the tow truck.
-Your buddy arrives before the tow and you swap out the coils. It is pouring rain at times. The car fires right up and you scoot out of town. Tow truck is still out there looking for you. You kick yourself that you didn't check for spark before the swap. Don't worry about it, there almost certainly wasn't any.
-Suggested problems are bad cat, poor compression, bad coils, mystery electrical connection issues.
-You argue against a single bad coil or connection, since the others would have fired and provided some ignition feedback. You appear to suspect a total ignition failure but can't see how that could be. You are not alone.
-You're hesitant about getting a compression test. I say forget about it unless it's handy and free. When the car would not start, you were still pumping gas into it. This would have washed down some of the oil and decreased compression. The fact that it started right away on changing out the coils suggests that the compression was still pretty good.
-I also say take the car out and run it as fast and as hard as you can to get as much air flowing through that cat as possible. You're not going to get much power out of this car if the cat is plugged, and it should be pretty noticeable. Flow through cat is insignificant during cranking.
-You owe it to the club and mankind to sort out this ignition issue. I say stick with the stocks for a while and pay attention to how it starts and runs. Then switch back to the Yukons and run those until and if you have an issue. Keep your stocks in the trunk.
Finally, can someone please explain this grounding thing. Stock coils are grounded through one of the three pins in the connector. Do Yukons have four pins, and one of those brought out and physically grounded to the engine?
-The car stumbles and dies. It cranks strongly but won't start.
-You get on your phone and text in your situation and get an almost immediate response from club members. The help offered is not very useful but must have been comforting.
-You suspect an ignition issue, and since you changed to Yukon coils, and the tow might take you to the dealer, you call out your buddy to bring you the stock coils. You also call the tow truck.
-Your buddy arrives before the tow and you swap out the coils. It is pouring rain at times. The car fires right up and you scoot out of town. Tow truck is still out there looking for you. You kick yourself that you didn't check for spark before the swap. Don't worry about it, there almost certainly wasn't any.
-Suggested problems are bad cat, poor compression, bad coils, mystery electrical connection issues.
-You argue against a single bad coil or connection, since the others would have fired and provided some ignition feedback. You appear to suspect a total ignition failure but can't see how that could be. You are not alone.
-You're hesitant about getting a compression test. I say forget about it unless it's handy and free. When the car would not start, you were still pumping gas into it. This would have washed down some of the oil and decreased compression. The fact that it started right away on changing out the coils suggests that the compression was still pretty good.
-I also say take the car out and run it as fast and as hard as you can to get as much air flowing through that cat as possible. You're not going to get much power out of this car if the cat is plugged, and it should be pretty noticeable. Flow through cat is insignificant during cranking.
-You owe it to the club and mankind to sort out this ignition issue. I say stick with the stocks for a while and pay attention to how it starts and runs. Then switch back to the Yukons and run those until and if you have an issue. Keep your stocks in the trunk.
Finally, can someone please explain this grounding thing. Stock coils are grounded through one of the three pins in the connector. Do Yukons have four pins, and one of those brought out and physically grounded to the engine?
seriously, it is 100% dead on (except i was cool enough to call and cancel the tow
) i was just coming now to post an update. i had drawn the same conclusion (no spark) and have the exact same plan of attack.
didn't bother with the compression check. so far been continuing to drive on the stock coils, no issues at all. cold starts same as always. intentionally ran hard while between running errands, at the gas pump, picking up lunch, etc. no hot start issues, with exception to that one occasion previously mentioned when it took a few seconds longer than usual. i should mention that i've observed this on cold starts as well. rarely, in both scenarios.
so far as your question regarding the Yukon harness, i believe that they do have 4 wires if memory serves. given that there must obviously be a ground wire on the engine side of the harness, i would (blindly) guess that that fourth ground wire could be tied back to the one on the harness instead of the need for the extra ground point.
at this point, the only thing i am deliberating is whether or not to send the kit over to BHR for the new terminals and the old once over, neither of which i feel is strictly necessary.
most likely i will just put the kit back as is, and keep the stockers in the trunk. i think i will also augment the ground point with a ph@ttie JDM ground wire i have. don't worry, it's street legal.
06-28-2011, 07:36 PM
#28
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@ninjajim4
Dude I really don't know what to say except that there are several threads out there (myself included) that have experienced hot start issues with the Yukon coils.
Now I'm too scared to get a compression test done, somethings you just don't wanna know.
<I probably do have low comp>
But I've swapped coils back and forth more times than a cheap wife at an 80's key party and every time I put my stock coils back on I have no issues. This is hard to do to when you are scared ****-less to even touch the plug wires on the BHR coils.
I know when I adjusted the dwell for the Yukon coils it helped
With the BHR coils on the car idles fine, runs fine just the hot start. Funny enough what I do is this and it seems to help/work.
When starting car in a hot start situation I crank it over for a few seconds 2-3 and if its not going to catch (you generally can tell) stop cranking. Wait for only a second or two for the starter motor to disengage and try again. 99% of the time the car will fire right up.
What can I say, this what happens <dunno> <shrug>
Dude I really don't know what to say except that there are several threads out there (myself included) that have experienced hot start issues with the Yukon coils.
Now I'm too scared to get a compression test done, somethings you just don't wanna know.
<I probably do have low comp>
But I've swapped coils back and forth more times than a cheap wife at an 80's key party and every time I put my stock coils back on I have no issues. This is hard to do to when you are scared ****-less to even touch the plug wires on the BHR coils.
I know when I adjusted the dwell for the Yukon coils it helped
With the BHR coils on the car idles fine, runs fine just the hot start. Funny enough what I do is this and it seems to help/work.
When starting car in a hot start situation I crank it over for a few seconds 2-3 and if its not going to catch (you generally can tell) stop cranking. Wait for only a second or two for the starter motor to disengage and try again. 99% of the time the car will fire right up.
What can I say, this what happens <dunno> <shrug>
The one quirk MM and I cannot figure out about the D-585 coils when used on the RX-8 is why they seem to have difficulty hot-starting certain Renesis engines while the OEM coils do not. The one thing we have learned, for certain, is that the only engines they have difficulty hot-starting are always of low compression. When he and I have time we will look into it further and figure it out. Engines with proper compression, the D-585s have no issues whatsoever.
The coils you purchased from your GM dealer are VERY unlikely to be "bad". Of the nearly 1,600 coils we have sold, there was only one that was suspect and even that was never confirmed to have actually failed. I simply suspected it to be problematic and that was enough for me to replace.
The coils you purchased from your GM dealer are VERY unlikely to be "bad". Of the nearly 1,600 coils we have sold, there was only one that was suspect and even that was never confirmed to have actually failed. I simply suspected it to be problematic and that was enough for me to replace.
I just wanted to share with you guys that a few months back when I installed my BHR kit I too was having annoying hot-start issues. A couple of times when I went to fill up at a gas station or step inside a store.....when I came back to the car it would just crank and crankk and crank and not start. I would have to wait around 10 minutes or so for the car to cool down so it could start.
I too figured that I was having this problem due to low compression, but then I decided to try out an upgraded starter. I bought and installed an 06 starter from autozone....and since then I have not had any hot-start issues. The car always starts now. Do you guys still think I have low compression ? I've been meaning to get a compression test done anyway to see the condition of my engine.
06-29-2011, 05:58 PM
#29
well, FWIW, i don't appear to be a member of that particular club. for one thing, i remember clearly that my car died WHILE driving, which isn't quite the same as a hot start issue.
i reinstalled the kit with newly purchased coils and have been running for over a week at least with no issues and what is shaping up to be a pretty dramatic bump up in mileage. hot starts are fine too.
maybe something had gone wrong with the install, or else with the harness, which has since been rebuilt courtesy of Charles. i am not the sort to normally just fix things and not care why it went wrong, but hey, sometimes you just want your sh*t workin
i reinstalled the kit with newly purchased coils and have been running for over a week at least with no issues and what is shaping up to be a pretty dramatic bump up in mileage. hot starts are fine too.
maybe something had gone wrong with the install, or else with the harness, which has since been rebuilt courtesy of Charles. i am not the sort to normally just fix things and not care why it went wrong, but hey, sometimes you just want your sh*t workin
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