Smoker

Hi,
I understand the basics of how the misfiring system function and its purposes in a regular piston engine but how does it work in a Rotary Engine ?

Often I see modified RX-7s going around with flames shooting out of their tail pipes so just wondering how it works in a Rotary. Thanks.

FYI: What's a misfiring system:
http://www.rallycars.com/Cars/bangbang.html
http://www.northarc.com/~edkwon/turbo.html

TerenceT

to my understanding, it's only sounds like a misfiring, hence the name, it sounds more like back firing to me tho

it's used when your turbo is constantly boosting, as in the waste gate is always close.

i don't think it'll be possible for NA motors.

oh, and their turbo last for only a couple of hours, don't think it'll be a good idea to do that on your street cars.

if you do decide to get say IHI turbos in bulks, let me know, i can hook you up directly with a wholesaler

wakeech

whaaaaaat??? you don't think NA rotaries shoot flames??? :D oh, but oh, rotaries and flames is like peas and corn.

seriously guy, the deal with rotaries and flames isn't the spool-up system (or MisFire thing), it's just 'cause they can just blow a ton of fuel out the exhaust without a wink... high overlap engines, or turbo engines with really low A:F ratios (a lot of the guys at rx7club.com say they run like 10:1 on phat boost), you're at WOT, then lift all the way (to shift up or whatever) and flames will shoot, oh, they will... i've even seen some with cats shoot a little bit, or if tuned highly enough, a lot.

this "problem" though, is relatively resolved in the RENESIS, as the exhaust port is no longer on the perhiphery... it'll probably still happen if you tuned it and had a straight pipe and whatnot, but i doubt it would go to the same extent.

zoom44

are you saying you want to shoot flames but the renesis might not? 'cause if you want to shoot flames there are ways to do it so that you can when ever you want. hell my dad was putting flamers on his cars in the '50's. all you need is a spark plug some wiring a switch and a fuel line running to the end of your exhaust. hell that guy that builds up trucks on TNN put a flame system on one of his trucks awhile ago.

TerenceT

i hope smoker wants more than just flames out his tail pipe??

Seriously, anti lag sys would not be streetable

some magazine somehow managed to take the one of the subaru rally car for a photoshoot aka joy ride in France and ended up street racing some guys on public streets, of course they turn on the anti lag system and pop pop pop later, they got arrested LOL

Smoker

Alrite alrite, let me rephrase my question.....

I was just wondering if an ALS can be installed on a Tubo'ed Rotary Engine in general since the principal is based on Piston engines.
( NO, I DO NOT WANT TO INSTALL ONE ON THE RX-8)

More over, I got the feeling that people are already doing it since I've seen "ALS type" of beavour on a lot of the FDs. (ie, POP POP POP and Flame Flame Flame)

So from what I get so far is that ALS are not for Rotary and the
"POP POP" on FDs are simply from highly tuned engine right ??

TerenceT

actually
the ALS i've seen on suby is a very high pitch whirling sound (from the turbo?) and the exhaust sounded like continuous back firing.

i've also seen the 7 shoot flame when he let go of the gas from WOT, but that's because his 7 is tuned extremely rich becausd he's afraid of detonation from running lean

getting back to your question, ALS is not based on the principle of piston engine, but on force induction. Theoraticall YES it can be installed on a Rotary

BUT, my fear would be on the continuous and extreme heat from the exhaust and turbo affecting the rotary

since the 8 is not a rally car nor a drag car, i don't see why you need ALS

unless it's not a question of need but wants right?

wakeech

the ALS systems are far more destructive on the hot side of the turbo, where the ignition and combustion actually takes place... the air and fuel together pass right through the engine, and the heat of the turbine and housing ignite the fuel and air inside the turbo... this is why you'll hear these guys talking about how their turbo's "failed"... how often does that happen in an "endurance" race car which gets rebuilt every few thousand kms?? never. these systems are hell on turbos.

there wouldn't be much extra strain on the engine from using a system like this, it'd just suck for emissions, and cost you and arm and a leg as you replace your turbo every couple of weeks.

SmokingClutch

As an antilag system basically gets unburnt fuel into the exhaust manifold to burn and keep the turbo spooled, the old turbo rotaries have a bit of natural antilag to them as they tend to dump excess fuel out the exhaust ports anyway.

Antilag systems aren't necessary on turbo rotaries as their exhaust pulses are very powerful and very hot. Nothing spools a big turbo fast like a rotary engine. I've always thought the sequential twin system on the 13B-REW and 20B-REW was overkill, rotaries spool turbos well enough, especially two small turbos, which is why FD RX-7s run so well with the twins converted to run in parallel mode.