Anyone know of 200+whp STOCK RX8s? I saw one today...
02-27-2005, 11:41 AM
#26
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Originally Posted by cgrx
why the loss from the flywheel?
It should be less than average with eletric steering/carbon fiber drive shaft, etc.
It should be less than average with eletric steering/carbon fiber drive shaft, etc.
02-27-2005, 12:36 PM
#28
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Wow, 187.5 whp on your best pull. You guys were getting some great pulls up there. I wish I was getting that stock (w/ cat back, instaed I got 179 whp) & that guy with 206 whp...WOW. I guess he doesn't need a CZ unit to tune his car.
On the dyno being variations I think these are the best dyno pulls I have ever seen. I think the tq # (159 lb.-ft.) might be more realistic than the hp #. It seems from our 0-60, 0-100, 1/4 mi., & other hp dyno #'s & this car actually runs around 220 hp (not 238 hp), or closer to the European specs (stated 228 hp) if the dyno #s are correct.
On the dyno being variations I think these are the best dyno pulls I have ever seen. I think the tq # (159 lb.-ft.) might be more realistic than the hp #. It seems from our 0-60, 0-100, 1/4 mi., & other hp dyno #'s & this car actually runs around 220 hp (not 238 hp), or closer to the European specs (stated 228 hp) if the dyno #s are correct.
02-27-2005, 04:06 PM
#33
Here's the pics of the Dyno Graph for run 3...don't have the 206HP run...might have been on the all gear run?? Also the CanScan Graph with timing and A/F values.
Note..the 12.05 flatline values over 75K are all righer than that......it stops reading at that value.....could be a lot richer. Renwar1...post a copy of the Picture if you have it from the dyno
This is in 5th gear.....
Note..the 12.05 flatline values over 75K are all righer than that......it stops reading at that value.....could be a lot richer. Renwar1...post a copy of the Picture if you have it from the dyno
This is in 5th gear.....
02-27-2005, 05:20 PM
#36
Originally Posted by neit_jnf
i don't understand that last dyno... 
going through the gears?
going through the gears?
ie 1st gear up to 9k shift to 2nd
rev 2 9k, shift to 3rd, and so on
02-27-2005, 05:31 PM
#37
Close, but we went thru 1-4th to get up to about 2500-3000 RPM, then shifted to 5th and gave the thumbs up to the crew and put it to WOT. Then we watched the RPM's and Canscan to know when to let off and shift into nuetral....
We also did a couple of spirited dynos by rapping out each gear to see what the data logs would produce on dan's laptop canscan. It seems 4th gear pulled the highest doesn't it...
Is that right Dan?
Where's "renwar1" when you need him??
We also did a couple of spirited dynos by rapping out each gear to see what the data logs would produce on dan's laptop canscan. It seems 4th gear pulled the highest doesn't it...
Is that right Dan?
Where's "renwar1" when you need him??
Last edited by Nemesis8; 02-27-2005 at 05:36 PM.
02-27-2005, 08:46 PM
#39
RX8 and a Truk....
Thread Starter
Originally Posted by dannobre
Looks like 4th Gear gives the highest results on this car. dmp did an all gear run...his maxed out in 3rd/4th....so I think 3rd and 4th gear dynos will be better to run....less wear and tear on the car...and on the dyno
except his hp peak - his highest was in 5th gear
02-27-2005, 11:53 PM
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Originally Posted by dmp
One oddity I noticed yesterday...
All/most of us dyno'd about mid-140s lbs-ft of torque...that's about a 10% loss from the factory rating of ~160....I wonder why the car appears to lose much less tq thru the drivetrain as it does HP.
All/most of us dyno'd about mid-140s lbs-ft of torque...that's about a 10% loss from the factory rating of ~160....I wonder why the car appears to lose much less tq thru the drivetrain as it does HP.
02-28-2005, 09:42 AM
#42
RX8 and a Truk....
Thread Starter
Originally Posted by 124Spider
I thought that was interesting, too. I dyno'd my car with all of those guys, but I brought my S2000 rather than the RX-8. My torque was 145 corrected, 152 uncorrected, which was not all that much higher than most of the RX-8s ran, but my HP was 210 corrected, and 219 uncorrected. Since the engines have very similar torque curves, and both rev very high, (and are rated very similarly--my S2000 is rated 240 hp and 162 ft-lbs of torque), I don't understand why fairly similar torque numbers translated into such different HP numbers.
Yup...doesn't make a lot of sense.
Great meeting you, btw
02-28-2005, 04:45 PM
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Originally Posted by dmp
Yup...doesn't make a lot of sense.
Great meeting you, btw
Great meeting you, btw
BTW, I think S2000 has more HP since S2000's torque in the high RPM range doesn't drop as much as ours.. HP = (Torque X RPM)/5250....
So the difference in HP between S2000's and RX8's can be explained by how much torque you have at the peak HP rpm... etc not how much peak torque you have
Last edited by e46328; 02-28-2005 at 04:54 PM.
03-01-2005, 06:01 PM
#45
Hummmm not to down play your results BUT in my experience the higher the gear the dyno is the more inaccurate the results are because of the higher wheelspeed and for some reason the inaccuracy always favors higher horsepower numbers. This is just a **** in the wind but if rotarygod or mazdamanic could explain why?
Abbid my best dyno was 187rwhp in 3rd gear. I did a 5th gear dyno once but it was on a different dyno it resulted in 187, the 3rd gear on this dyno was 178 so I may be on to something. Don't have a soft copy of it; I did it to see what the leanest points for gas mileage were.
Now lets also remember that the Rx-8 runs different maps in each gear due to increased load on the engine. For example the point at which you start getting lean in 3rd gear is much later then the point you start getting leaner in 5th gear.
Not sure how but this may be helping you, but it may be a possibility.
Did you remove the mufflers? If not what the hell is that thing shooting flames, if you remove the mufflers of course youre going to make more horsepower, then normal.
Also was a 2004 or 2005 Rx-8, although its not that big of a deal because ITO did Dyno 196 or 198 on his 2004 stock car.
Abbid my best dyno was 187rwhp in 3rd gear. I did a 5th gear dyno once but it was on a different dyno it resulted in 187, the 3rd gear on this dyno was 178 so I may be on to something. Don't have a soft copy of it; I did it to see what the leanest points for gas mileage were.
Now lets also remember that the Rx-8 runs different maps in each gear due to increased load on the engine. For example the point at which you start getting lean in 3rd gear is much later then the point you start getting leaner in 5th gear.
Not sure how but this may be helping you, but it may be a possibility.
Did you remove the mufflers? If not what the hell is that thing shooting flames, if you remove the mufflers of course youre going to make more horsepower, then normal.
Also was a 2004 or 2005 Rx-8, although its not that big of a deal because ITO did Dyno 196 or 198 on his 2004 stock car.
03-01-2005, 06:20 PM
#46
After watching the 15MB video Im going to go under the assumption that you removed the exhaust system.
Quoting racing beat:
3. Mufflers muffler & connecting pipe - 2-3 HP.
4. Removing the muffler from the car (engine) about 4 HP.
5. Remove catalytic converter and resonator from the engine completely, and replacing with "cat" replacement tube max benefit 8 HP regardless of what muffler is used (or even no muffler).
So if you removed everything back from the headers you should see about a 15HP increase, subtract that from your 201 or 198 run and you get to 186/183 which is where my car is. You still have a GREAT car just not that GREAT
Maybe slightly more then 186/183 because im unsure if racingbeats numbers are talking about wheel horsepower or crack as they have an engine dyno.
Quoting racing beat:
3. Mufflers muffler & connecting pipe - 2-3 HP.
4. Removing the muffler from the car (engine) about 4 HP.
5. Remove catalytic converter and resonator from the engine completely, and replacing with "cat" replacement tube max benefit 8 HP regardless of what muffler is used (or even no muffler).
So if you removed everything back from the headers you should see about a 15HP increase, subtract that from your 201 or 198 run and you get to 186/183 which is where my car is. You still have a GREAT car just not that GREAT
Maybe slightly more then 186/183 because im unsure if racingbeats numbers are talking about wheel horsepower or crack as they have an engine dyno.
03-01-2005, 06:44 PM
#47
RX8 and a Truk....
Thread Starter
As stated, only one car - the flamethrower, had it's muffler removed.
The further away from a 1:1 Gear ratio, the more innacurate the results.
I'd say all of the cars are 2004 models.
The further away from a 1:1 Gear ratio, the more innacurate the results.
I'd say all of the cars are 2004 models.
Originally Posted by PoLaK
Hummmm not to down play your results BUT in my experience the higher the gear the dyno is the more inaccurate the results are because of the higher wheelspeed and for some reason the inaccuracy always favors higher horsepower numbers. This is just a **** in the wind but if rotarygod or mazdamanic could explain why?
Abbid my best dyno was 187rwhp in 3rd gear. I did a 5th gear dyno once but it was on a different dyno it resulted in 187, the 3rd gear on this dyno was 178 so I may be on to something. Don't have a soft copy of it; I did it to see what the leanest points for gas mileage were.
Now lets also remember that the Rx-8 runs different maps in each gear due to increased load on the engine. For example the point at which you start getting lean in 3rd gear is much later then the point you start getting leaner in 5th gear.
Not sure how but this may be helping you, but it may be a possibility.
Did you remove the mufflers? If not what the hell is that thing shooting flames, if you remove the mufflers of course youre going to make more horsepower, then normal.
Also was a 2004 or 2005 Rx-8, although its not that big of a deal because ITO did Dyno 196 or 198 on his 2004 stock car.
Abbid my best dyno was 187rwhp in 3rd gear. I did a 5th gear dyno once but it was on a different dyno it resulted in 187, the 3rd gear on this dyno was 178 so I may be on to something. Don't have a soft copy of it; I did it to see what the leanest points for gas mileage were.
Now lets also remember that the Rx-8 runs different maps in each gear due to increased load on the engine. For example the point at which you start getting lean in 3rd gear is much later then the point you start getting leaner in 5th gear.
Not sure how but this may be helping you, but it may be a possibility.
Did you remove the mufflers? If not what the hell is that thing shooting flames, if you remove the mufflers of course youre going to make more horsepower, then normal.
Also was a 2004 or 2005 Rx-8, although its not that big of a deal because ITO did Dyno 196 or 198 on his 2004 stock car.
03-01-2005, 06:46 PM
#48
RX8 and a Truk....
Thread Starter
Originally Posted by PoLaK
After watching the 15MB video Im going to go under the assumption that you removed the exhaust system.
Quoting racing beat:
3. Mufflers muffler & connecting pipe - 2-3 HP.
4. Removing the muffler from the car (engine) about 4 HP.
5. Remove catalytic converter and resonator from the engine completely, and replacing with "cat" replacement tube max benefit 8 HP regardless of what muffler is used (or even no muffler).
So if you removed everything back from the headers you should see about a 15HP increase, subtract that from your 201 or 198 run and you get to 186/183 which is where my car is. You still have a GREAT car just not that GREAT
Quoting racing beat:
3. Mufflers muffler & connecting pipe - 2-3 HP.
4. Removing the muffler from the car (engine) about 4 HP.
5. Remove catalytic converter and resonator from the engine completely, and replacing with "cat" replacement tube max benefit 8 HP regardless of what muffler is used (or even no muffler).
So if you removed everything back from the headers you should see about a 15HP increase, subtract that from your 201 or 198 run and you get to 186/183 which is where my car is. You still have a GREAT car just not that GREAT
Bad assumption to make
See above. The 206whp ran full exhaust...full everything...100% 'off the showroom' (except for springs and clear corners and some dirt. He may have had some CDs in the car... :p)The Car with the flames - again - the only car who ran sans muffler, (Midpipe and cat were left in place) got in the low 190s.
03-01-2005, 07:05 PM
#49
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Originally Posted by Nemesis8
Dynojet
DSC/TCS Disabled
5th Gear Pull
Wheel sensors left on the car untouched
DSC/TCS Disabled
5th Gear Pull
Wheel sensors left on the car untouched
Polak - 5th gear dyno's higher not because its inaccurate, but because your lowering drivetrain losses by keeping the drivetrain acceleration down and in some cases using a straight thru arrangement in the tranny. When people quote the "normal" drivetrain loss of 15% thats referring to the drivetrain loss in the 1:1 gear.