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slash128's Top Mount Build
5 Attachment(s)
So we seem to be getting an early thaw which means roads have been nice and I've been able to start driving this project around. Still got work to do, but figured I would share progress to date and some photos. I picked up a brand new PTP kit on ebay, minus the turbo, bov, wg and misc pieces. I added a Comp Turbo CT4-6062 with a .81 A/R hot side. The PTP kit comes with a 3" intake, so I redid all that 3.5" all the way to the compressor, where I have a 3.5" to 4" silicone elbow. I added an HKS SSQV bov, only because I was trying to replicate what came with the kit, along with a TiAL 38mm wg with a .3bar spring to stay real low while starting to tune. I recirculated the bov. So far it idles really nice, like stock averaging 5g/s. Still got lots to do, but having fun... I lost an OMP line earlier this week, more on that in next post...
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details on how you lost the OMP lines please
is the 38mm wastegate going to handle the duties? everything looks good so far man. Keep up the good work . Any goals in mind? |
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I had wrapped all the pipes and put thermal sleeve on all the hoses in the area but hadn't gotten my heat shield yet for the OMP. The front line blistered and started squirting just a bit. I picked up some SS braided Teflon tubing and clamps and repaired the ruptured line. So far it is holding up, and if it lasts I will do the others. I also put some Inferno shield around the OMP and it seems to be helping.
Much thanks to FazdaRX_8 for his advice and inspiration! You are a great guy! UPDATE - Info on the SS/Teflon OMP lines I made: For anyone interested in making their own I called the place where I got my supplies, NW Hose & Fittings here in Spokane, WA. Their prices did go up a bit, now they are selling the 1/8" ID hose for $4.30/ft and the crimp connectors are $0.45/ea. When I made mine I bought 12 feet and I had about 2-3 feet left over. I wanted margin for error :) The 1/8" is tight to get the fittings into, but it can be done with a little lube, muscle and love. Wait, that came out way wrong:lol: They also have 3/16" ID but I don't think I'd recommend that at this point. |
what injectors are you using?
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Eventually I will probably look at a bigger wg. In order to get things going I just went with what was originally included in the kit. It will be a work in progress :) I am using stock reds for P1s and uncapped yellows for secondaries and P2s.
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who is handling the tuning? Sorry for all the questions but according to 9k it might be possible for me to get my hands on a PTP manifold so I want to know how well it holds up for reference.
Have any pictures of your downpipe/wastegate dump set-up? |
Fazda is helping and teaching me to tune, he's been awesome :) He has quite an impressive setup that he put together from scratch.
I didn't snap any pics of the manifold or wg while under the car. I will eventually be under there again and will try to remember. I never got around to calling on that manifold. I don't know if I will at this point, got some other things I really should address first. This manifold does come up under the OMP very close because it was designed to keep a battery in the bay. This is why the OMP line blistered, even with the wrap. I put inferno shield in between, I'll see how long it holds up. |
Nice man, glad to see it all coming together. It will always be a work in progress :)
I was actually thinking of this kit today because I was reading thru Corky Bells book on turbocharging a little while ago and in the waste gate section he used and example of how not to setup a waste gate and the manifold drawing he used was similar to the PTP manifold. You should read that book. I am really glad to see you still fighting the good fight man. |
Thanks for the heads up, I will check it out. I thought it was funky the way they did it at the other end of the manifold. I could always do a block off on the wg end of the manifold and relocate the wg up by the turbo.
Update: like this: https://www.rx8club.com/series-i-maj...5/#post4628274 |
Everything looks great
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I can almost guarantee that you'll have boost issues with a .3bar 38mm mounted on the opposite end of the manifold.
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You will need a bigger wg right from the beginning... other than that, good luck with the project!
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Thanks for the advice guys. I hear ya on the wastegate: bigger and on the same end of the manifold as the turbo. When I get that reworked I may also have the manifold reworked to give more clearance to the OMP and move the turbo farther forward in the bay. I'll have to relocate the battery for this, but it would be worth the improvement.
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So is it just the .3 bar spring that is going to give me trouble or the actual size of the wg as well? I really haven't gone into boost to notice yet, just bounced up around 0-1psi briefly. Going over tdiddy's thread it appears he is using the 38mm that came with the kit, and no mention of moving it from the original location, but with a .5 bar spring, and he indicated it was working fine for him:
Originally Posted by tdiddy
(Post 2501895)
I am only running on the .5 bar wastegate spring but the wastegate is controlling the boost very well.
http://https://www.rx8club.com/showp...&postcount=506 |
38mm is too small regardless of location
Too bad you didn't get the oil-less center. CT has some nice offerings, a 6065 would have been a better balance IMO. A rotary typically needs more turbine flow relative to the compressor. A Tial turbine housing is worth every penny too. |
Ya I was interested in the oil-less version but it was an extra $500. Thank you for the advice. I may swap pieces down the road. Justin at Comp is great to deal with. I was originally trying to get the Turbonetics that the kit originally came with but they were in the middle of end if year inventory and it was going to be several weeks before they could ship, so I looked at options. The oil-less option caught my attention, it was just more than I wanted to spend, but I still went with CT. Justin had this turbo at my door a week after ordering.
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slash, you should contact Hoss-05, he has an extra Synapse WG that I am sure he would sell you.
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Thanks 9k. Unfortunately, it won't be a simple swap. These pipes are really tight in the wg area and anything bigger wont fit. I originally tried a Precision 39mm and it was just big enough that it wouldn't go together. I have to figure out where I am going to relocate it which is going to require relocating the battery and some rework of the manifold and downpipe. I also have a number of other things I need to do, like relocating the bov and some non-turbo related things. Now that it is running reliably I am not looking forward to tearing it back apart again right away :) I think I will drive it like this for a while and make a list of things I want to change all at once.
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If you can get it to make low to mid 300s as is ..... I would just leave it alone .
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That would be plenty for me! Not looking to build a monster. Just wanted to give my summer DD some extra oomph...
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Originally Posted by Brettus
(Post 4428270)
If you can get it to make low to mid 300s as is ..... I would just leave it alone .
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Originally Posted by 9krpmrx8
(Post 4427723)
...I was reading thru Corky Bells book on turbocharging a little while ago and in the waste gate section he used and example of how not to setup a waste gate and the manifold drawing he used was similar to the PTP manifold. You should read that book...
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I would be keen to see more of that book I have two others you might want to read too
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That's the book :)
page 125 Fig. 10-13 and page 145 Fig. 12-9 |
Originally Posted by pdxhak
(Post 4428279)
Easier said than done even with the "proper" setup :)
It's more about understanding how everything works and making sure each part does what it should than making sure the wastegate can handle ten million horsepower - or whatever other flight of fancy people go off on. |
Originally Posted by Brettus
(Post 4428619)
wastegate can handle ten million horsepower - or whatever other flight of fancy people go off on.
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Originally Posted by yomomspimp06
(Post 4428624)
making sure the wastegate can do it's job is part of having a "proper" setup isn't it?
Plus what is optimum on a PeriPort 400whp rotary does not necessarily have to be used on a Renesis where it has been shown time and time again that 300-350 is the comfortable range for the engine. |
true
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yomomspimps--you going boosted?---oops sorry thread highjack--sorry.
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OD,
Just piecing together a kit. I've been trying to contact the guys in Texas that have an extra PTP manifold. I'm not having any luck though :( |
dont want to highjack the thread--i will talk to you at the mazmart thingy--ok?
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I don't mind OD, high jack away :) I'd be interested to see another PTP build.
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I think i found the same kit you bought off of ebay but i was wondering
what was exactly missing? Besides the things you've mentioned of course Build looks great so far can't wait to see more pics :) |
Just to clarify, nothing was missing per the eBay listing, I received everything that was in the listing. The seller was great, packed things well and shipped pretty darn quick. Just want to make sure that people don't misunderstand the "missing" part :) The listing stated it didn't have the turbo, bov, wg or EMS. I have a Cobb AP and added everything else I needed. All that being said, I don't know what all the PTP kit came with when PTP was still selling them. I also redid the entire intake pre-compressor, so I picked up a bunch of polished 3.5" tubing, couplers and clamps. I also had to add t-clamps and some reducers/couplers for the charge pipe. Then all the odds and ends like hoses, nuts and bolts, fittings, exhaust wrap, heat shielding, etc. I haven't added it all up,but I think at this point I am probably in about $3500-$3700 range. I have some additional modifications I need to make, like moving the O2 sensor closer to the turbo, it seems to be hunting in CL. Reading tdiddy's thread they talked about the bov needing to be ron the last charge pipe before the TB and recirculated. Mine is still in the original location, just after the compressor, but I at least recirculated it for now. It started snowing again this week so it's parked again for now, so I can probably do some of this work, including redoing the rest of my OMP lines with the SS lines. It's actually not difficult, nor costly. But you definitely will need to shield the OMP and the APV, the pipes are just too close.
EDIT I just checked eBay and I see two kits. Both look like they are fairly equivalent to what I picked up. I forgot I also got the battery tray, lower rad hose and lower pipe brace with mine, like in those listings. If you plan to tune with the Cobb then you'll want to redo the intake. The intake that comes with it is 3". |
Originally Posted by olddragger
(Post 4430756)
dont want to highjack the thread--i will talk to you at the mazmart thingy--ok?
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Originally Posted by slash128
(Post 4430793)
Just to clarify, nothing was missing per the eBay listing, I received everything that was in the listing. The seller was great, packed things well and shipped pretty darn quick. Just want to make sure that people don't misunderstand the "missing" part :-) The listing stated it didn't have the turbo, bov, wg or EMS. I have a Cobb AP and added everything else I needed. All that being said, I don't know what all the PTP kit came with when PTP was still selling them. I also redid the entire intake pre-compressor, so I picked up a bunch of polished 3.5" tubing, couplers and clamps. I also had to add t-clamps and some reducers/couplers for the charge pipe. Then all the odds and ends like hoses, nuts and bolts, fittings, exhaust wrap, heat shielding, etc. I haven't added it all up,but I think at this point I am probably in about $3500-$3700 range. I have some additional modifications I need to make, like moving the O2 sensor closer to the turbo, it seems to be hunting in CL. Reading tdiddy's thread they talked about the bov needing to be ron the last charge pipe before the TB and recirculated. Mine is still in the original location, just after the compressor, but I at least recirculated it for now. It started snowing again this week so it's parked again for now, so I can probably do some of this work, including redoing the rest of my OMP lines with the SS lines. It's actually not difficult, nor costly. But you definitely will need to shield the OMP and the APV, the pipes are just too close.
EDIT I just checked eBay and I see two kits. Both look like they are fairly equivalent to what I picked up. I forgot I also got the battery tray, lower rad hose and lower pipe brace with mine, like in those listings. If you plan to tune with the Cobb then you'll want to redo the intake. The intake that comes with it is 3". Thank you for the information very helpful!! can't wait to see more on this build! :D |
Ill try to get some more pics and updates posted soon!
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Nice build, really helpful info as well.
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Thanks! Sorry for the lack of updates. Been trying to work thru some issues. I am thinking I may have a boost leak and need to test. It doesn't seem to hold boost well and there is a whistling noise that starts as I get to 0psi and beyond, not the turbo whine. Also it runs really rich and bogs in boost, could be a tuning issue but want to rule out a leak. Also need to extend my O2 sensor. It seems to be hunting quite a bit. There is a bung farther forward but even undoing the harness its still a few inches short. I ordered this extender. Hopefully it does the trick and I can leak test this weekend:
http://www.casperselectronics.com/st...oducts_id=1400 |
one way or another we will get it running
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Oh I know we will :) I should clarify, when I said "tuning issues" I should have said "tuning related". I didn't mean it as a bad thing! Thanks for your help!
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are you guys close to each other? When are you seein positive pressure in the rpm range?
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Originally Posted by slash128
(Post 4433017)
It doesn't seem to hold boost well and there is a whistling noise that starts as I get to 0psi and beyond, not the turbo whine. Also it runs really rich and bogs in boost, could be a tuning issue but want to rule out a leak. ]
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Thanks Brettus, I hope this is what it is so it can be addressed :) and move on...
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Originally Posted by yomomspimp06
(Post 4433046)
are you guys close to each other? When are you seein positive pressure in the rpm range?
I haven't really put my foot in it yet until I get these little kinks figured out but when I have been feeling ballsy I believe I have hit 0psi in second at around 3-3.5K rpm. |
Make up a leak test kit out of some pvc caps etc as per utube link
But remember that air can leak through the turbo seals and past the engine seals so make sure you test the right area of your system. |
my seccessful boost leak test resulted with the engine turning over :O
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Originally Posted by Brettus
(Post 4433061)
Make up a leak test kit out of some pvc caps etc as per utube link Boost Leak Tester DIY - YouTube
But remember that air can leak through the turbo seals and past the engine seals so make sure you test the right area of your system. |
Originally Posted by slash128
(Post 4433060)
I haven't really put my foot in it yet until I get these little kinks figured out but when I have been feeling ballsy I believe I have hit 0psi in second at around 3-3.5K rpm.
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Thanks.
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