Pettit Super Charger Owners
05-15-2009, 08:21 AM
#5230
...I heard it was from a whole car he bought and ripped the Pettit off to replace it with a Hymee...
I asked him how much he wanted for it. He's asking $5000 for the complete CS kit which has 5 k miles. I then said I had a full exhaust already and he said $4700 for just the kit.
...this reminds me, I forgot to tell him I'd be better off buying a new one from Cam...
I asked him how much he wanted for it. He's asking $5000 for the complete CS kit which has 5 k miles. I then said I had a full exhaust already and he said $4700 for just the kit.
...this reminds me, I forgot to tell him I'd be better off buying a new one from Cam...
05-15-2009, 02:57 PM
#5233
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do NOT change the maf tube!! I repeat Do not!!!
also --word of warning here---anytime you change anything on the intake whether it is a cold air supply--new type filter etc--ALWAYS do some data logging before you run it hard. Check the a/f's. Some maf's do not like change!!!! Some will develop excessive long term trims, some will actually run leaner---i have had that happen----some will have wildly fluctuating a/f's--i have had that happen also. I have not found the right one for my car yet. I am probably preaching to the choir here --but wanted to throw that out.
I just tried a new one--looked good per a/f meter--best i could tell --until i did a 30mpg to 80 mph 3nd gear run and logged per efi dude. after looking at the file its coming off. I barely made it into the 12's under boost and at 7.5K!! Thats with the water meth running!! The efi dude monitors the most important a/f --the one that the computer talks too. My innovate a/f was also not showing any low 12's or any 11's during the little run--but it happens so fast. But on the road during normal driving she was reading right--you know low 14's cruising drops in the 13's etc during light acceleration or above 3.8K.
JUST BE CAREFUL.
olddragger
also --word of warning here---anytime you change anything on the intake whether it is a cold air supply--new type filter etc--ALWAYS do some data logging before you run it hard. Check the a/f's. Some maf's do not like change!!!! Some will develop excessive long term trims, some will actually run leaner---i have had that happen----some will have wildly fluctuating a/f's--i have had that happen also. I have not found the right one for my car yet. I am probably preaching to the choir here --but wanted to throw that out.
I just tried a new one--looked good per a/f meter--best i could tell --until i did a 30mpg to 80 mph 3nd gear run and logged per efi dude. after looking at the file its coming off. I barely made it into the 12's under boost and at 7.5K!! Thats with the water meth running!! The efi dude monitors the most important a/f --the one that the computer talks too. My innovate a/f was also not showing any low 12's or any 11's during the little run--but it happens so fast. But on the road during normal driving she was reading right--you know low 14's cruising drops in the 13's etc during light acceleration or above 3.8K.
JUST BE CAREFUL.
olddragger
It's been *widely* reported that the RX-8 MAF is extremely sensitive to turbulence in airflow, and I can only imagine with that short a distance between the filter and MAF, it must be seeing a lot of turbulence.
I'm not very familiar with the pettit setup (Rotr8 is the only one near me, and I doubt he wants me playing with his
), but are you guys running screens before your MAF to even out the airflow?I would love to try replacing the pettit intake completely with the AEM intake... the only reason it should cause issues is if the Pettit MAF housing is not stock sized and the EFI dude reflash is scaling the MAF readings. (Not proposing someone try this, but I can't see why it should matter unless pettit added some sort of special sauce to a round 3.5" tube that makes it special...)
--------------------*added*---------------------------
Got to thinking about it and I can't see any reason why a 3.5" intake would be harmful as opposed to a 4". It's all about intake air velocity. Obviously you have less resistance if you run the same amount of air through a larger pipe, but the restrictive element is probably the air filter and not the pipe (as olddragger is indirectly saying). I would propose someone try a hacked up AEM intake fitted directly to the pettit MAF housing with a larger K&N filter fitted to it. Not sure how much room remains in the bumper with the intercooler in there...
*muses*
Last edited by Salamanth; 05-15-2009 at 03:02 PM. Reason: More thought while bored at work...
05-15-2009, 03:26 PM
#5234
in speaking with Cam--he advises no screens, no velocity pipes(aka racing beats) etc. The maf is tuned for the pipe and the filter where it is now. Any changes at your on risk.
Filters? He said stick with K&N, size should not matter as far as the tune is concerned--he is familar with flow patterns etc of the k&N's. A bigger filter that is maf friendly may help a little up top. I am going to try the K&N RF-1033.
Now cold air is ok if it is delivered to the filter--Juan tried a true cai once and had to abandon it because of abberant a/f's readings.
here is a formula for getting the surface area of a cone
get the surface area of the base --surface area of the base is equal to pie R2 , the lateral surface area is = to pieRslant height of the cone --add the 2 and that is the surface area.
Some one want to try?
olddragger
Filters? He said stick with K&N, size should not matter as far as the tune is concerned--he is familar with flow patterns etc of the k&N's. A bigger filter that is maf friendly may help a little up top. I am going to try the K&N RF-1033.
Now cold air is ok if it is delivered to the filter--Juan tried a true cai once and had to abandon it because of abberant a/f's readings.
here is a formula for getting the surface area of a cone
get the surface area of the base --surface area of the base is equal to pie R2 , the lateral surface area is = to pieRslant height of the cone --add the 2 and that is the surface area.
Some one want to try?
olddragger
05-15-2009, 03:43 PM
#5235
Registered
05-15-2009, 08:08 PM
#5236
new info with Rotary God's help
Thanks RG--I wasnt aware of the boost addition, but in just consulting with K&N I found out that some of use are using filters that are approx 50sq inch of filtering area. That is not enough for a non FI renesis engine turning just 8K.
Some folks are trying to tune and I am not sure if this aspect of the system has been considered.
In consulting with K&N they gave this info also to work with---
"Use the formula below to compute the minimum size filter required for your particular application. The usable portion of the filter is called the EFFECTIVE FILTERING AREA which is determined by multiplying the diameter of the filter times Pi (3.1416) times the height of the air filter in inches, then subtracting .75-inch. We subtract .75-inch to compensate for the rubber seals on each end of the element and the filter material near them since very little air flows through this area.
A=(CID X RPM) / 20,839
A = effective filtering area
CID = cubic inch displacement
RPM = revolutions per minute at maximum power
Example: A 350 CID Chevy engine with a horsepower peak at 5,500 rpm.
A=(350 X 5500) / 20,839 = 92.4 square inches "
Now remembering that the rotary engine moves air like an engine that is over 2 L I used 2.3 liter as the effective size for the formula.
---So
140.35 cubic inches x 9000/20,839== 60.61 square inches of filtration. Round it to 61.
Looks like Racing Beat and their Revi intake meets that requirement? But us FI boys that i have seen are not! Most that i have seen are using the K&N 6 inch cone shaped with a 3.5 inch inlet and a 5.75 base and 4.5 inch top with 6 inchs long. Now figuring out the sq inches of a cone shaped filter is a little harder BUT my best est is in the 50's.
now just running a 9 lb boost and running your formula that comes out to a 98 square inches of air filter. I have not seen an fi rx8 with that big of a filter. We have work to do.
Appreciate the help dude.
olddragger
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Thanks RG--I wasnt aware of the boost addition, but in just consulting with K&N I found out that some of use are using filters that are approx 50sq inch of filtering area. That is not enough for a non FI renesis engine turning just 8K.
Some folks are trying to tune and I am not sure if this aspect of the system has been considered.
In consulting with K&N they gave this info also to work with---
"Use the formula below to compute the minimum size filter required for your particular application. The usable portion of the filter is called the EFFECTIVE FILTERING AREA which is determined by multiplying the diameter of the filter times Pi (3.1416) times the height of the air filter in inches, then subtracting .75-inch. We subtract .75-inch to compensate for the rubber seals on each end of the element and the filter material near them since very little air flows through this area.
A=(CID X RPM) / 20,839
A = effective filtering area
CID = cubic inch displacement
RPM = revolutions per minute at maximum power
Example: A 350 CID Chevy engine with a horsepower peak at 5,500 rpm.
A=(350 X 5500) / 20,839 = 92.4 square inches "
Now remembering that the rotary engine moves air like an engine that is over 2 L I used 2.3 liter as the effective size for the formula.
---So
140.35 cubic inches x 9000/20,839== 60.61 square inches of filtration. Round it to 61.
Looks like Racing Beat and their Revi intake meets that requirement? But us FI boys that i have seen are not! Most that i have seen are using the K&N 6 inch cone shaped with a 3.5 inch inlet and a 5.75 base and 4.5 inch top with 6 inchs long. Now figuring out the sq inches of a cone shaped filter is a little harder BUT my best est is in the 50's.
now just running a 9 lb boost and running your formula that comes out to a 98 square inches of air filter. I have not seen an fi rx8 with that big of a filter. We have work to do.
Appreciate the help dude.
olddragger
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05-16-2009, 01:38 AM
#5237
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Someone made a prior comment before stating that the Pettit MAF housing was stock size. As I said, I do not have a pettit system and I'm not super familiar with the particulars.
So the pettit flash has the MAF readings scaled to match the new housing diameter, interesting...
So the pettit flash has the MAF readings scaled to match the new housing diameter, interesting...
05-16-2009, 07:06 AM
#5238
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still no idle
Hi !!!
I have still no idle, the car tuns off.
I sent an efi log to Cam and Dian (Efidde team) and I am still waiting.
meanwhile I was by my side wandering what can be the reason...
- is it possible it comes from the sparks..they are brand new (from pettit), but maybe a didn't put them in the correct position...
- I checked my engine and I remember I didn't do the next picture red connection ; can it comes from theire ?
or else the car looks to run good ...no CEL again...for now
I have still no idle, the car tuns off.
I sent an efi log to Cam and Dian (Efidde team) and I am still waiting.
meanwhile I was by my side wandering what can be the reason...
- is it possible it comes from the sparks..they are brand new (from pettit), but maybe a didn't put them in the correct position...
- I checked my engine and I remember I didn't do the next picture red connection ; can it comes from theire ?
or else the car looks to run good ...no CEL again...for now
05-16-2009, 07:25 AM
#5239
pettit has its own maf tube as you know--it is relativly oem size--but the oem tube is not circular--its actually slightly oblong/oval shaped(racing beat had this same issue) Racing beat maf tube is actually larger than Pettits. every maf is custom tuned to the pipe it sets in. even the lenght can make a differance.
JMK --man i dont know what is going on with your car. even with the stock tune the car should idle. Mine did -when i swapped over from the int x to the pettit flash--before the flash but the int x out of the car--Cam had me crank it--didnt rev it!!---and the car cranked fine and idled fine.
Start basic troubleshooting---i am not familer with the diagram you posted but it looks like a vacum line going through the TB? Thats not essential.
Can you crank the car and hold the rpms--say at 1500? Will it do that?
Check all coils and harness's, double check fuel injection harness to insure the right plug is to the right injector.
check the electrical connectors i the maf--if they are not good my car will not idle!
send us pics of you vacuum line hook ups? Wiring maybe? dunno--just trying to help anyway i can.
olddragger
JMK --man i dont know what is going on with your car. even with the stock tune the car should idle. Mine did -when i swapped over from the int x to the pettit flash--before the flash but the int x out of the car--Cam had me crank it--didnt rev it!!---and the car cranked fine and idled fine.
Start basic troubleshooting---i am not familer with the diagram you posted but it looks like a vacum line going through the TB? Thats not essential.
Can you crank the car and hold the rpms--say at 1500? Will it do that?
Check all coils and harness's, double check fuel injection harness to insure the right plug is to the right injector.
check the electrical connectors i the maf--if they are not good my car will not idle!
send us pics of you vacuum line hook ups? Wiring maybe? dunno--just trying to help anyway i can.
olddragger
05-16-2009, 09:04 AM
#5240
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yeah....i saw that used SC for sale...
some people seem to think that's a good price...not me...
i would not pay $5 for a used SC...
also, it seems like "mums" the word on who's it was...
some people seem to think that's a good price...not me...
i would not pay $5 for a used SC...
also, it seems like "mums" the word on who's it was...
05-16-2009, 06:11 PM
#5242
Londons Yellow Peril
when you did the reflash did you leave the car to adjust and find idle?
You need to leave it running for a good 5 minutes while the computer sorts itself out adjusting to new loadings and so on? Does it run badly then stall, or just cut out straight away?
You need to leave it running for a good 5 minutes while the computer sorts itself out adjusting to new loadings and so on? Does it run badly then stall, or just cut out straight away?
05-17-2009, 12:49 PM
#5243
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The car worked well after but with the same probleme then now : no idle...meaning run badly on the idle then stall.
EfiDude Team told me that it is normal as the flash is for a supercharged rx8.
So I did the install, but it changes nothing, if I turn on my car it runs badly then stall.
To keep the idle position, I have to put a very slow pression pression on the accelerator pedal to keep the RPM around 1200RPM.... so I think the probleme just comes from the flash... I am waiting for Cam's answer to know what to do ...
05-17-2009, 05:44 PM
#5245
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I did the reflash before installing the kit.
The car worked well after but with the same probleme then now : no idle...meaning run badly on the idle then stall.
EfiDude Team told me that it is normal as the flash is for a supercharged rx8.
So I did the install, but it changes nothing, if I turn on my car it runs badly then stall.
To keep the idle position, I have to put a very slow pression pression on the accelerator pedal to keep the RPM around 1200RPM.... so I think the probleme just comes from the flash... I am waiting for Cam's answer to know what to do ...
The car worked well after but with the same probleme then now : no idle...meaning run badly on the idle then stall.
EfiDude Team told me that it is normal as the flash is for a supercharged rx8.
So I did the install, but it changes nothing, if I turn on my car it runs badly then stall.
To keep the idle position, I have to put a very slow pression pression on the accelerator pedal to keep the RPM around 1200RPM.... so I think the probleme just comes from the flash... I am waiting for Cam's answer to know what to do ...
Usually a failed flash means a bricked ECU, not a bad idle.
I would just remove the ECU and FedEx it to Cam and let him flash it.
05-17-2009, 06:56 PM
#5246
Londons Yellow Peril
a bricked ECU would mean no start at all, not a bad idle.
Are you sure you did the flash successfully?
Did you watch he LED on the Efidude go red and then back to green? And it had defintely had the flash installed on it successfully?
Are you sure you did the flash successfully?
Did you watch he LED on the Efidude go red and then back to green? And it had defintely had the flash installed on it successfully?
05-17-2009, 09:00 PM
#5249
Misfit Moderator TnC
