View Poll Results: If you could go for forced induction...
Turbo
115
56.93%
Supercharger
87
43.07%
Voters: 202. You may not vote on this poll
If you could go for forced induction...
03-19-2006, 08:39 PM
#1
petrolhead
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If you could go for forced induction...
If you could go for forced induction, what would you get?
I am curious as to your motives for considering each system.
I am curious as to your motives for considering each system.
Last edited by Midnight Wankeler; 03-19-2006 at 08:44 PM.
03-20-2006, 01:06 PM
#8
My Goodness My Guinness
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i personally would go with a supercharger. the reason i say this is because of the power curve this car has its just too linear and i think that a supercharger would better accomodate it. i wish procharger would come out with a kit or hell ever a vortech would be nice. the low end grunt doesn't bother me. other than puttin round town i'm not in the lower rpms too often lol
03-20-2006, 01:49 PM
#9
More Cow Bell
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The only thing keeping me from turboing my car is the UPS man. I dint know enough to make a choice so I lurked for 3 months and woalah!! I still don’t know Jack. But it’s what everyone else is doing so it seamed like a god choice at the time. Pretty sheeple huh?
03-20-2006, 05:43 PM
#14
petrolhead
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According to Rotary God, supercharging is better:
That's actually a little backwards. The older peripheral exhaust port rotaries were more suitable for turbochargers. This was due to the suddeness of the ports opening. They reached full open much faster than in the Renesis which caused a very strong pulse that was perfect for moving a turbo with. The Renesis exhaust ports resemble a piston engines more in terms of their flow profile and rate at which they open.
A trubocharged engine and a supercharged engine also require different timing. THis may sound strange but with a supercharger you want less overlap whereas it isn't as critical with a turbo. The 13B's had some overlap as do all piston engines. With a trubo the added backpressure in the exhaust will help prevent the intake charge from getting blown through during overlap and out the exhaust. You almost always have more exhaust pressure than intake pressure with a turbo which is why this can't happen. With a supercharger you always have more intake pressure than exhaust pressure. This means that if there were an engine with overlap, you would blow some of the charge out the exhaust. The Renesis has zero overlap. This is perfect for a supercharger. The intake ports are also large compared to the 13B intake ports which helps even further. The exhaust pulses are also not as strong as the 13B's which would aid a turbo better. None of this means that a turbo can't work very wel on a Renesis. Due to the exhaust pulse energy difference, it would just require a smaller exhaust housing to get the same spool rate. This will become more of a problem at higher rpm's though as a smaller exhaust housing makes less top end power than a larger one. The 13B is just better suited to make big power with a turbo.
https://www.rx8club.com/showpost.php...&postcount=351
That's actually a little backwards. The older peripheral exhaust port rotaries were more suitable for turbochargers. This was due to the suddeness of the ports opening. They reached full open much faster than in the Renesis which caused a very strong pulse that was perfect for moving a turbo with. The Renesis exhaust ports resemble a piston engines more in terms of their flow profile and rate at which they open.
A trubocharged engine and a supercharged engine also require different timing. THis may sound strange but with a supercharger you want less overlap whereas it isn't as critical with a turbo. The 13B's had some overlap as do all piston engines. With a trubo the added backpressure in the exhaust will help prevent the intake charge from getting blown through during overlap and out the exhaust. You almost always have more exhaust pressure than intake pressure with a turbo which is why this can't happen. With a supercharger you always have more intake pressure than exhaust pressure. This means that if there were an engine with overlap, you would blow some of the charge out the exhaust. The Renesis has zero overlap. This is perfect for a supercharger. The intake ports are also large compared to the 13B intake ports which helps even further. The exhaust pulses are also not as strong as the 13B's which would aid a turbo better. None of this means that a turbo can't work very wel on a Renesis. Due to the exhaust pulse energy difference, it would just require a smaller exhaust housing to get the same spool rate. This will become more of a problem at higher rpm's though as a smaller exhaust housing makes less top end power than a larger one. The 13B is just better suited to make big power with a turbo.
https://www.rx8club.com/showpost.php...&postcount=351
03-20-2006, 07:00 PM
#16
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Yeah, the argument that you get more torque early on in the rev band is only applicable to one kind of supercharger (Lysholm/Roots/Screw type unit). The other kind of supercharger (centrifugal) will provide you with similar, if not worse tq characteristics on the low-middle end of the rev range, but more power up top. Good & bad points about both types.
With my Greddy I can get full boost at as low as 3000 RPM.
With my Greddy I can get full boost at as low as 3000 RPM.
03-21-2006, 10:55 AM
#17
Remember the White Supercharged Mazdaspeed Concept Car? Here is info to back up what Rotarygod said about the exhaust ports:
Bern posted these comments on Rotarynews.com:
"This is a development project that members of Mazda's R&D team have been working on. Because our engineers also happen to be enthusiasts, they're never completely satisfied and they're always tuning and developing vehicles one step further. This car is not for general sale now or in the future.
We're not ready to confirm when - or even whether - a MAZDASPEED version of the RX-8 is coming. We're always looking to improve the power, styling and drivability of our vehicles in each successive generation, and we're certainly looking at ways of adding the MAZDASPEED-DNA to RX-8, but we are not ready to talk in more detail about it.
Mazda touched on some details about this particular car, though...
* It is supercharged. Because of the location of the exhaust ports in the RENESIS rotary engine, it doesn't respond in quite the same way to turbocharging as earlier rotaries. Our team thought they'd experiment with supercharging for this project car.
* Virtually everything on the car is custom-designed and built, including the bodywork, interior trim, suspension and exhaust. Our R&D team saw this project as an opportunity to take the RX-8 as far as they could, while still maintaining its streetability."
With all due respect to those that have gone turbo on the Renesis, my vote went to SC.
Bern posted these comments on Rotarynews.com:
"This is a development project that members of Mazda's R&D team have been working on. Because our engineers also happen to be enthusiasts, they're never completely satisfied and they're always tuning and developing vehicles one step further. This car is not for general sale now or in the future.
We're not ready to confirm when - or even whether - a MAZDASPEED version of the RX-8 is coming. We're always looking to improve the power, styling and drivability of our vehicles in each successive generation, and we're certainly looking at ways of adding the MAZDASPEED-DNA to RX-8, but we are not ready to talk in more detail about it.
Mazda touched on some details about this particular car, though...
* It is supercharged. Because of the location of the exhaust ports in the RENESIS rotary engine, it doesn't respond in quite the same way to turbocharging as earlier rotaries. Our team thought they'd experiment with supercharging for this project car.
* Virtually everything on the car is custom-designed and built, including the bodywork, interior trim, suspension and exhaust. Our R&D team saw this project as an opportunity to take the RX-8 as far as they could, while still maintaining its streetability."
With all due respect to those that have gone turbo on the Renesis, my vote went to SC.
03-21-2006, 01:14 PM
#19
Boost Junkie
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You know... I can't stand the sound of superchargers... and all in all I think I just like Turbos better. I think they are on fairly even ground, but if you look at what we have seen, it would appear that there are a heck of a lot more proven turbo options available at this time.... 310WHP on the Greddy! 326 if you are willing to dump a boat load of cash on the SFR kit.
03-17-2008, 05:49 PM
#22
Administrator
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yup, boost is boost BUT some methods are currently better at making boost then others.
ie; Pettit makes a SC BUT MM's turbo is making more power through almost the entire band.
Just comes down to what you're you looking for out of your car, what your end-goal is, and how much you're willing to spend.
ie; Pettit makes a SC BUT MM's turbo is making more power through almost the entire band.
Just comes down to what you're you looking for out of your car, what your end-goal is, and how much you're willing to spend.
03-17-2008, 06:03 PM
#23
Registered
03-17-2008, 07:03 PM
#25
Additionally, we have not seen a single dyno that shows any SC kit for the RX-8 make more boost or torque than the MazdaManiac GT3071R turbo kit in the low end, where the SC proponents claim the SC has an advantage.
That is the sound of inefficiency in motion. There's some new SC tech out recently that is more efficient, but lacks the sound.
I can think of zero advantages of the SC over a TC for the RX-8. The ONLY justification is personal preference. The SC loses in power, torque, cost, and anything else you can throw out at it.