slavearm

Hey guys..

I got a pair of Focal Utopia 7" Components going in the front, polyfiber 6" in the back (just for fill anyways), but I need to select an amp. I thought a reasonable amp to power the focals was an alpine V12 MRV-F545 4 Channel.

For the subs, I am having some trouble and could really use some help.

I am thinking of going with 2-3 8" subs. I listen to techno and a lot of fast music so clean sound is more important than big bass. As a matter in fact I don't even like big bass. So, I am thinking about using 2-3 JL 8W3s, but might be swayed to go with 1 10Wx or something along those lines. I want to conserve trunk space, so I need some help with an enclosure and an amp for the speakers.

NOTE: I am NOT USING THE STOCK BOSE CRAP. I already have the face plate made and the stock radio tucked away to control my climate and led display. I am using a pioneer 860MP for the head unit.

So here are my questions


1. Is the Alpine MRV-F545 4 Channel good enough to run those focals, or make some suggestions please
2. Any complaints about the 8w3s? 2 or 3
3. How about an amp for the 8W3s Alpine MRD-M605?
4. What type of enclosure would work best for this setup.

Thanks, and sorry for being a noob about this stuff. I am not a complete idiot, but I know there are people on the forum here with a lot more experience than I have.

Slavearm

forbidden

Upgrade from the Alpine amp to a Zapco or Audison. No offence intended to the choice of cd players as I sell them as well, however a Eclipse will school the Pioneer for tonal response. If you do not want big bass, 2 8's or 1 or 2 10's is more than enough in a small sealed box. If you are more interested in tonal response, a simple 5 channel amplifier like the Audison LRX5.600, Eclipse PA5532 or Crossfire VR705D is going to be more than ample output. Make sure you read the grounding sticky as it applies in this vehicle.

slavearm

Thanks for the feedback. I am not going to do the install, but want to make sure I get the right parts together. I don't like salespeople telling me what I need for my car. I will however talk to the installer about grounding. What about the enclosure? You think I can sneak something premade in a corner somewhere, or do I need to go custom?

Thanks,

Slavearm

forbidden

For the corner, it is a custom premade, do a search on this forum for a 4080 box which houses one 10". If you want to go under the rear deck, a custom sealed box fits with ease.

Link to the sites.

http://www.audison.com/default.asp?lang=eng
http://www.eclipse-web.com/amp/xa5000.html
http://www.crossfirecaraudio.com/frameset.asp

slavearm

About the head unit. 2 reasons I wanted the pioneer.
1. Ipod input
2. Steering wheel controls will still work (with addon module)

Hmm... so sounds like the 5 channel amp is out with the focals in the front requiring 120W each.

I think I like the idea of going with 1 10". It should save me some space. So for a small tight enclosure what is the tightest 10" sub around? And by tightest, I mean super clean, super tight bass.

So that leaves us with the amp question. It appears the choices are:

1. Audison LRX 2.250 for the focals in the front, and LRX 4.300 for the rear/sub (price is probably going to be rediculous, although I am having trouble even getting a quote)

2. Eclipse PA4212 for the front and PA5422 for the rear and sub (probably most reasonable price/performance please feel free to correct me here)

3. Zapco REF350 front and REF360.4 for rears (probably somewhere in the middle as far as price goes, is the upgrade to the REF series worth the extra money?)

4. Crossfire VR402 front and VR404 Rear (dunno much about crossfire, but price seems to be between eclipse and zapco)

Thanks again for the help.

Slavearm

forbidden

Eclipse has new models of amps out, look at the XA4000 for the front / rear and the XA1000 for the sub. Now these are a uber step up from the ones that are still to be found right now. I would probably try and save the $ and find the old ones while they are available. The PA4212 will drive 130w rms x 2 to the front speakers, 85w x 2 rms to the rear speakers and approx 300w x 1 rms to the subwoofer. This is not a copious amount of power for the sub but should be more than enough.

Audison as nice as they are I would rule out when you are looking at a 30w rms x 4 amp vs the Eclipse at 85w rms x 4. I suggest Audison as they are a nice small footprint amplifier.

As far as the sub goes, the sub to choose must match the choice of the amp first and then have the box constructed to match the sub + vehicle. If you arbitrarily put sub a into box b, it my only deliver 50% of the subs true abilities. This is where a good installer comes in. Choose your amps first, then choose the sub, then that will tell you about the box.

slavearm

Forbidden,

Your advice here is proving invaluable here. I am thinking I will try and save the cash and go with the older eclipse models for the time being. Maybe upgrade later, but the price is REALLY NICE for a decent amp with the PA series. The PA series would run about $550 for both amps, as where the XA series would be ??? Some retailers are supposed to get them next week. Although, the XA series amps are insane (just read a few reviews), supposedly I might be able to get a deal if I get them when they are first released. But I bet for a XA4000 and either a XA2000 or XA1000 to drive the sub, I would be looking at almost $1000. Tough choice.

forbidden

I would wager that you are going to be well over the $1000.00 mark according to my pricelists..... advice comes with 20 years of experience.

slavearm

Maybe I can just go with an XA4000 and get a cheaper amp for the sub. I am really concerned about the mids and highs. Thanks again forbidden.

forbidden

Ah, no, the fashion police will give you a ticket for having mismatched amplifiers. BE nice to the 8, it deserves it.

ferris11

My setup (Thanks to Forbidden) is nice. (pictures to come this weekend if I ever get out of work in time to have some sunlight)

The bass is pretty tight. Not huge booming, but a nice system.

I used the 5 channel Eclipse5532 with an Eclipse 10 inch (aluminum series - I forget the model number) in a 4080 box. I wanted to replace the head unit, desperately, but the price just wasn't worth it, so I put in an Audio Control LC6. Alpine speakers in the fronts, and Phoenix gold's in the rears (the phoenix's are far from the best that I've heard, but are much better than stock and are good "fill").

I have a PIE adapter for the Sirius radio that I installed into the Ashtray.

I still need an RCA switch so that I can use an IPOD, though.

Things I like about the system: Pretty clean bass with decent response. Of course I've heard better systems, but all of that comes with a price, too. The install was very stealth. The Amp is large, though, and takes up the whole well.
I was very concerned with trunk space since I refuse to travel without a spare tire. I installed the preamp under the deck (nice and clean) - you don't even see it unless you remove the spare tire.

Things I don't like: If the production of the music isn't very good, or doesn't have crisp bass, it's tough to turn up the bass to a point that I'd like it. Sometimes the bass is too heavy, sometimes, not enough. I think I need to play with the preamp a bit.
I will still wonder if a ported sub wouldn't have sounded better (I build a few ported ones in the past that sounded like they had a lot more "boom" with an 8inch). Of course, the compartment on my old MR2 was a lot smaller which I'm sure was the major factor in that.

slavearm

Here is what I went with

Pioneer DEH-P860MP (until the new P9 comes out that supports XM and Ipod)
Eclipse PA5532 Amp
Focal Utopia 180W 7" Component System in the Doors
Focal 690CV 6x9 Coaxials in the rear deck for fill


All I can say is, I do not regret getting the 5532 AT ALL! This is by far the cleanest system I have ever owned (maybe eclipse will do XM and Ipod and I can get an eclipse head unit) I have not got a sub yet, but I want to get a 4080 box and put a sub in there to take some of the load off of the Focal 7" speakers. The great thing though... anyone who rides in my car and checks out the system goes... where did you hide the sub?

It is amazing how awesome good speakers are.

So... knowing the amp I have, and the box I am going to use, can anyone recommend a CLEAN CLEAN CLEAN 10" sub to go with it, no HUGE Booming crap bass please.

Thanks,

Slavearm

forbidden

Eclipse SW7304DVP.

slavearm

Got one for $94 dang dollars. Cheap!!! Hopefully this sucker is as clean as I am hoping.

forbidden

$94.00 dollars? Were you threatening someone within a inch of their life or something, holy good score dude.

ferris11

wow $94 is a steal!

It's a nice sub. You're gonna like it.

I don't even remember what I paid for mine, but I know it wasn't that cheap.

RX8INCH

I would say JL 300/4 and for your sub amp maybe the 250/1 mopo... JL has awsome quality... A 10w3v2 would do nicely... enough bass but not overklll. what do u guys think?

slavearm

Well the system is built. I did consider the JL parts, but in the end, I went with the Eclipse amp, and I can't say I am unhappy at all. I got the 5 channel, which is LARGE! It also provides enough power that I can listen to my killer fronts and only need to put the volume to about 1/3 to get full range from them. The sub is not here yet, and I lost the deal I though I was going to get for a 4080 sub enclosure, so I am still looking for one. That being said, the bass from the 7" focals is AMAZING! I am not even certain that I need a sub, as my car already hits pretty well. The reason I am pursing a sub though it to take some of the bass duties off of the focals and allow them to not have to produce all the really bassy bass (does that make sense?).

I want to thank forbidden as well. I was not even considering the eclipse amp, and I will be damned if that isn't one of the cleanest amps I have ever heard. The only future upgrades I have planned are getting an enclosure for my sub preferably a 4080 box after the holidays, and then a nice eclipse unit (if they make one that supports ipod and xm) or the replacement for the current P9. Once I get the new head, I will be taking it in to have it professionally tuned, which I expect to make a huge difference.

Thanks for all the help,

Slavearm

forbidden

Your welcome, 20 years of car audio allows me to make a educated and informed decision when I am recommending equipment to people. Eclipse has new heads coming that will be previewed in the first week of January at CES. Keep it simple for your sub, the 4080 box and any dvc 4 ohm sub that works in a small sealed enclosure is good. MB Quart Reference series RWE 254, Lightning Audio S4.10.VC2, Eclipse SW7104DVCT4 are all good subs to consider for this application.

TRU681

Lightning Audio is crap except for their wiring stuff.

forbidden

Wanna bet? I have a pair of Lightning aluminum 12's in a RX8 that makes peoples heads spin. Their equipment once you know the ins and outs of it can do a fantastic job. The entry level Bolt amps have proved pretty much indestructable, the entry Bolt sub on the other hand suck ****. The Strike and Storm gear has been great. Meh, it took me awhile to warm up to the line, but it has it's purpose as well. As far as what Rockford has done or will be doing to it, time will tell.

slavearm

Finally got my sub enclosure... now do I wire the sub for 2 ohm or 8 ohm?

Thanks,

Slavearm

forbidden

If your sub is dvc 4 ohm, connect one coils + to the other coils + and then connect to the amps sub out +. Now do the same for the - side of the sub and you are off and running.

slavearm

Thanks... I figured I knew the amp supported 2ohm with a DVC sub so.. I wired it up in parallel as stated by Forbidden above.

BTW... I LOVE THIS SUB Forbidden! It is really tight and punchy in the small 4080 enclosure.

Fair warning for 4080 sub enclosure with this specific Sub. You will have to widen the wooden ring the sub mates to for the cage of the sub to fit.

Otherwise.... kickarse! The 7" focals sound better now as well since they aren't pumping all that bass.


Can someone please ask Eclipse to start supporting XM? They have a decent iPod interface now, and that is the only thing stopping me from getting one of their newer head units.

Slavearm