Efini 8

Nitrous Express is technologically superior and better quality IMO. Venom is also quite nice but very complex which is safer, but not for n2o newbies.

alphapenguin

they dont have one specific for an RX8, can you just throw anyone on? I wouldnt think so, but I have no clue anyway. Also, does using N2O damage the engine?

Superfan

Running n2o in an untuned rotary is like playing Russian roulette. Piston engines are more tolerant to knocking than rotaries. Leaning out is fatal 99.9% of the time in a rotary. Just go over to rx7club.com and you'll find thread after thread where lean conditions have blown engines. Luckily older 13b's are readily available but its going to be a while before you can get a RENESIS. It would suck to have your car sit in a shop for 6 months waiting on an engine. The car has been out for 3 months; give the tuners a little time to R&D their wares.

wakeech

please do some actual reading and know your stuff before opening your mouth. find one of those blown engines that wasn't turning +12 psi on a turbo: that forum is the gathering place of performance elites, and thus a gathering place of those who are extremely hard on their equipment. a 50 shot of nitrous would be extremely hard pressed to outstrip any engine.

every real expert on this forum has knocked this engine at least a little (canzoomer admits to more than a little) and it's been fine.

Superfan

Easy there big fella. Can we agree that a rotary is more likely to fail than a piston engine under a lean condition? FI or NA, a lean A/F will cause detonation. My FC had 210k on it when it went south so the engine was already due. Regardless, on a cold night in Florida (45F, that's summer for you) I went WOT on an incline and I swear it didn't knock for more than 1 sec and poof went the engine. My FD (downpipe, midpipe, catback, boost controller, IC, etc..) running stock boost (10psi) saw spikes up to +15psi several times. It took the knocking like a champ and didn't pop. My friends FC (back in 95, car was a 91) /w 43k (no mods) had a clogged fuel filter, knocked under WOT and popped the engine.

These cars run rich so they "should" handle a 50 shot. But if anything were to go wrong, you'll have voided the warrantee and popped the engine. It's a 30k car that's been out for three months. If you want to slap a 50 shot on and chance it, by all means, it's your car. As for me, well waiting +2 years for Mazda to make this car makes you a patient man. I can certainly wait a few more months while the aftermarket R&Ds their stuff.


FD: M3 ECU 12psi Lean and Pop
http://www.rx7club.com/showthread.ph...highlight=lean

FC: Running 75 Shot successfully
http://www.rx7club.com/showthread.ph...highlight=lean

akrx8

thanks efini 8 for a knowledgable response,i run a n20 set up on my drag car thats fairly sophisticated in saftey(timing retards,low fuel pressure shut off,etc)only a speculation but i think the right kit could run a 50 hp shot safley on the 8 but just have to wait and see.

Floyd

Well being broke right now and seriously wanting to get back into a RX-SOMETHING i'm thinking of getting another 2nd gen untill I can afford my rx-8(haven't had a rotary for about 4 years now). How would this zex system work on a stock 88 or 89 NA RX-7? I assume there is more concrete data/opinions on this than the 8.

rotarygod

A rotary engine may fail arfter pinging once or it may ping a hundred times and be just fine. You never know. Some of the aftermarket seal companies make some very strong seals that are very tolerant of detonation. Since the Renesis has all new seals it will be interesting to see how it stands up to detonation. The apex seals are shorter and that may play a big part of it. The fact is that nitrous is absolutely no different than adding forced induction. Both types will detonate and fail if not done properly. The problem is that movies like the F&F make people go out and slap a bottle on only to see their seals shoot out the tail pipe. Tuning is everything regardless of what it is. The stock ecu is tuned like crap. Imagine how much better the car would run if it were done properly. To say that leaning out is fatal 99.9% of the time in rotaries is a pretty high number than I'm sure isn't in writing or documented anywhere. The fact is that that statement can apply to forced induction as well. A more accurate statement would be that impatience and lack of understanding are fatal more often. Run a non turbo rotary lean and it will love you for it. You'll get better gas mileage and to a point better power. Pinging is almost not even a concern on an n/a and is almost never fatal. It is much more fatal when there is alot more pressure in the combustion chamber ala forced induction or nitrous. Very high temperatures of forced induction may also accentuate this problem as well as a very sudden burst of cold from nitrous. Sudden major temperature variations also put stress on seals. Adding fuel to the mix is also half of it. You also need to be able to control the timing.

m0j0

1 word....

ZEX

neit_jnf

YESS!!! THE MORE THE BETTER! :D

Oh wait, what are we talking about?

TiTaniumRX8

Im becoming very impatient waiting for the turbo's to come out and after some research i have decided i may try and go with a nice bottle of N2O for my 8.

After thinking about this thought, i decided this could go both ways, bad or good. N2O cools acording to a few web-sites i found. And I see that the Rotary does get hott fast. And i also read that this is only bad for your car if you "Shoot too high".

im just wondren if this is a good idea, and if any of this stuff is true. I really wana get a turbo, but sumthen tells me that it will not be possible till im in colege!

Please help my stupid @$$!

mikeb

just relax

its not even 2004 yet
wait a month or so

ranger4277

Be patient... NOS is quite risky right now with all the unknowns with the fuel map. Not worth losing an engine and voiding the warranty.

Sin

No Nos...

rotarygod

mileb said exactly what I was thinking. You are driving a 2004 car and it is still 2003! Why are you impatient? Do you really plan to buy the first kit on the market or are you willing to wait a couple of years and see what else develops?

The key to running nitrous effectively is in the tuning. Tuning is more critical than the amount you are using. You can blow the engine up with a 10 shot if it is tuned wrong. I think it will be a bad idea in the cars current state to add to it. Like the turbos, wait until a kit arrives for it. That car is so computer controlled it probably kicks microchips out the exhaust. If you want to add nitrous now then you will need to be sure it is tuned properly. Heres how:

You'll need a new ecu. The factory ecu does a crappy job as is. It doesn't need to get complicated by adding nitrous to the mix. Plan on a really good system. Since you have a drive by wire system you'll need a Motec which can control this. Plan on a couple thousand here. You can go as simple as a Microtech for less than a grand but then you'll need to convert to cable throttle. You'll also need a new fuel pump, fuel lines, and a fuel regulator. The car has no fuel regulator or return fuel line. Based on computer info the fuel pump delivers the correct amount of fuel to the engine. Don't forget that with the new ecu you will not be able to pass inspection. Now you'll need the nitrous setup. I'd only use some kind of progressive controller such as the one that Holley sells. You'll need to bend your own lines, pick your own jets, etc. It MUST be a wet shot. Then you have to get it tuned right. Once you've done all of this the car will probably be fast as hell. Of course you have now spent several thousand dollars. The other nitrous option is to wait for a company like Venom to make their kit for the car that controls air/ fuel ratio and timing to accomodate the amount you want to use. If for some reason the nitrous backfires into the intake, kiss that upper platic intake manifold goodbye!

Waiting doesn't sound that hard now does it?

Superfan

I say go for it! Someone has to be a guinea pig. Let us know how it works out.

-SoNiK-

LOL, yea i wanted to put NOS on the 8, but rotary now discouraged me. I dont know i REALLY want a turbo kit for the 8, so i dont know Greddy might come out with that turbo kit for the 8 soon! and when they do im guna be the first to install that sucker.

XeRo

Best read up on the few threads concerning NOS...


Whoa boy Whoa!!....patience....

https://www.rx8club.com/showthread.p...threadid=13763

Kev

Just ask yourself if you are willing to take the risk of detroying your engine and or drive train.

If you are willing to take the risk and fork out the subsequent replacement cost of new engine, transmission, diff, etc - go for it!

Just don't come crying back saying "my terrible engine blew up" without being honest about exactly what you did to it.

It may sound harsh, but most professional tuners have years of experience and typically offer conservative add ons with some form of warranty.

I'd wait!

rotarygod

Hopefully no one interprets me ask a nitrous hater. I'm not. I'd love to see a good nitrous kit, Whipple based supercharger kit, and turbo kits all arive for the RX-8. The key to all of them is in the tuning. With the crazy ecu the cars have right now it would be dangerous to try any of these routes until the ecu problems are figured out. Once they are, people are going to have lots of fun! There was a saying we had when I worked in retail car audio that applies well here. "Be patient and do it right or don't be patient and do it again".

XeRo

wow..rotary, thats really wierd...i had that exact quote on a poster that hung on one of the walls in our installation bay...i totally agree!!.

deadrx7conv

Add a direct port or at least a wet n2o setup. I'm guessing that anyone who blows their engine with nitrous did not know what they were doing. They went dry and expected the ecu to be happy or they overdid the n2o.

TiTaniumRX8

Thanks for the Help guys, but my situation is pissen me off. Im getting alota race offers at school, and i got my *** wooped by my best friend's WRX w/ sum mods... and that just pisses me off, i wana win!

Im going to college in less-than 2 years, and i wana enjoy my "pride and joy" by woopen the shyt outa ppl! (college= 1-3 years w/o the 8 in the winter)

How long is the Waranty on the 8 again? What should i do? I WANA PUT HP ON MY BABY!

--oh yea, sory if i seem FU(ked up bout this... but all this talk and rummor about turbos, Intake (what does that do w/o turbo?), ect, is really gettin to me.

rotarygod

Next time someone wants to race you do it where it counts, on an autocross track. Anyone can make any car fast in a straight line. Anyone can drive in a straight line too. Not every car or every person can drive around a corner though.

I personally don't care when someone wants to race me. I am more mature than that. You didn't buy that car for all out speed. You bought it because it is the coolest car available right now. If you wanted speed for that price you should have bought an LS1 Camaro. You wouldn't be as cool looking though. I've learned that high school kids who want to race typically aren't worth racing in the first place. I KNOW I can drive good. I've done it longer than they have. I'm not the one with anything to prove so why do I need to race? Their opinion of me is worthless anyways.

ranger4277

I changed my mind. Go for the NOS.