Mazsport Cooling mod - does it work ?
07-09-2007, 06:53 AM
#52
Finally did the mazsport fan mod, even though I have an Re-Amemiya ECU flash. I figure f*** it, its cheap and if I don't like than I would have sold it. I noticed that the fans turned on "more aggressively" than the ECU flash did, which I think is a good thing. I noticed only a small drop in idle quality and that was from the fans being on. My rpms can take a slight dip from slightly above 800rpm towards 750rpm when the fans kick on and at idle. I can just tell when the fans kick on.
By the way, I know bad idle quality really well because my engine mounts went bad and before I got it fixed, the idle would suck. My car would really vibrate, so I have a very clear memory of bad idle. Luckily, the mazsport fan mod is not a problem for me and my idle quality is very acceptable. I will give the mazsport fan mod a thumbs up.
I think people that are having a problem may be turbo or have alternate EMUs. I'm NA, which may be why I don't have a problem.
I can see why people could have problems. A- If you get a dance between the fans shutting on and off and the rpms jumping back and forth between 800 to 750 to 800 etc... B- Once you start going below 750 than your car can "shimmer" like it was going to stall. It also might be that your idle point was a little low to start with.
By the way, I know bad idle quality really well because my engine mounts went bad and before I got it fixed, the idle would suck. My car would really vibrate, so I have a very clear memory of bad idle. Luckily, the mazsport fan mod is not a problem for me and my idle quality is very acceptable. I will give the mazsport fan mod a thumbs up.
I think people that are having a problem may be turbo or have alternate EMUs. I'm NA, which may be why I don't have a problem.
I can see why people could have problems. A- If you get a dance between the fans shutting on and off and the rpms jumping back and forth between 800 to 750 to 800 etc... B- Once you start going below 750 than your car can "shimmer" like it was going to stall. It also might be that your idle point was a little low to start with.
Last edited by sosonic; 07-09-2007 at 06:55 AM.
07-19-2007, 07:25 PM
#53
Update on mazsport fan mod evaluation.
I got the scanguage 2 finally (which I also give a thumbs up for any NA RX-8) and this helped me analyze the mazsport fan mod a little better. It definitely works.
I want to confirm that my temps are usually around 185 degrees. I have to really high rev the engine and/or zoom around at high speed (for me that is 100+mph) for extended periods of time to get temps over 200 degrees and then they gradually fall back down to 185 to 190 degrees. The mazsport fan mod is very aggressive in keeping temps down.
Interestingly, according to the scanguage2, air intake temperatures when you stop and are at idle, combined with the high engine load of our small engine appears to be the real "sneaky f*cker". I would definitely recommend, for any serious enthusiasts, to focus on cooling mods of all sorts. Synthetic oil, Redline Water Wetter/NPG, catch can with breather mod, throttle body bypass, etc... Its up to you what you do, but it does seem if your serious that you focus on combating heat.
I got the scanguage 2 finally (which I also give a thumbs up for any NA RX-8) and this helped me analyze the mazsport fan mod a little better. It definitely works.
I want to confirm that my temps are usually around 185 degrees. I have to really high rev the engine and/or zoom around at high speed (for me that is 100+mph) for extended periods of time to get temps over 200 degrees and then they gradually fall back down to 185 to 190 degrees. The mazsport fan mod is very aggressive in keeping temps down.
Interestingly, according to the scanguage2, air intake temperatures when you stop and are at idle, combined with the high engine load of our small engine appears to be the real "sneaky f*cker". I would definitely recommend, for any serious enthusiasts, to focus on cooling mods of all sorts. Synthetic oil, Redline Water Wetter/NPG, catch can with breather mod, throttle body bypass, etc... Its up to you what you do, but it does seem if your serious that you focus on combating heat.
Last edited by sosonic; 07-19-2007 at 07:29 PM.
07-19-2007, 07:38 PM
#54
having both the racing beat pod and the scangauge2, i think the stock coolant sensor is located nearby the radiator, because temps are dropped immediately. I noticed tonight that coolant temp elsewhere (by the passenger side of the engine) was at 220 F when the odb2 was reading 195 F. Usually the two are fairly close once warmed up.
08-13-2007, 07:48 PM
#55
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RB reflash costs twice as much and gets erased anytime your dealer reflashes your car. It's not an ideal mod for some of us, especially those of us who aren't using the factory PCM to control fuel.
Also, what do you mean by "better" cooling? Either route will use the OEM radiator fans.
Also, what do you mean by "better" cooling? Either route will use the OEM radiator fans.
08-15-2007, 10:09 AM
#59
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Thanks.. as far as cooling is concerned does anyone know if they make a plastic gasket for the rx8 similar to the ones made by hondata? Those work pretty effeciently and they are a pretty inexpensive.
08-21-2007, 03:28 AM
#62
Yes. The idle goes to crap whenever the fans kick on.
I thought it was just me, but I've spoken with about 3 others who have similar problems.
Car runs fine when moving, but at idle, the rpms and batt voltage drop to the point where sometimes the car can stall.
I recently installed a brand new red top with 750 CCA. It didn't help. I also added in a new breather to the intake manifold so it gets more air at idle (one way check valve so I don't lose boost), it didn't help much, if any.
Scott spent a while trying to tune it out (int-x), but that didn't fix it either.
What I was able to do was install one of the stock fuses, so that only one fan operated by the cooling mod... this completely stopped the idle issues, but it also doesn't cool nearly as well. Temps were allowed to reach 200 degrees again. Still better than stock, but 2 fans are better than one.
At this point I'm out of ideas on how to fix it. Is the alternator able to keep up with the loan of two fans at near max rpm at idle?
I thought it was just me, but I've spoken with about 3 others who have similar problems.
Car runs fine when moving, but at idle, the rpms and batt voltage drop to the point where sometimes the car can stall.
I recently installed a brand new red top with 750 CCA. It didn't help. I also added in a new breather to the intake manifold so it gets more air at idle (one way check valve so I don't lose boost), it didn't help much, if any.
Scott spent a while trying to tune it out (int-x), but that didn't fix it either.
What I was able to do was install one of the stock fuses, so that only one fan operated by the cooling mod... this completely stopped the idle issues, but it also doesn't cool nearly as well. Temps were allowed to reach 200 degrees again. Still better than stock, but 2 fans are better than one.
At this point I'm out of ideas on how to fix it. Is the alternator able to keep up with the loan of two fans at near max rpm at idle?
Since having the scanguage 2 and the Mazsport fan mod, I notice the issue is at idle and when the AC is on.
With the AC on at idle rpms jump up and down between around 800 rpm to 850 rpm. This is not a problem for me as my idle quality is acceptable and my car never stalled.
However, I did hear a faint clicking noise as something turns on and off, in tune with the rpms jumping up and down like every 8 to 15 sec. (timed with stopwatch). Actually you have to have the hood up to really hear the noise (I have really good hearing by the way....). Looks to be coming from the area of one of the pulleys (alt, crank, or water) making the noise.
When I took the Mazsport mod out, I did not get such a jump in rpms or hear the faint click noise.
EDIT- The ambient temps were also probably lower, thus less cycling and less clicking noise. It would only do it every minute or more at odd intervals. The mazsport fan mod did NOT appear to be having a negative effect and I was being overly suspicious and cautious. As later confirmed by an actual Mazda tech./mechanic that tool a look at the mazsport fan mod.
I've put it back and it came back. Nothing else appears wrong, so I don't know what to make of it. I have a R-magic ground and my voltage is fine at around 13.5. However the scanguage 2 shows the engine at a higher load (LOD) and the load jumping up and down from around 45 to 50+. With the Mazsport cooling mod in and AC on.
Also, if you turn the AC off, than the rpms and LOD are steadier as well and no noises with the Mazsport mod still in.
I have to find an alternate mechanic that knows RX-8s to look at the Mazsport mod and AC at idle issue, as the Mazda dealers may dry to screw with me, because of the mod.
EDIT- See later post
Interested in the opinions of everyone else...
Last edited by sosonic; 08-25-2007 at 12:25 AM.
08-21-2007, 03:35 AM
#63
Since having the scanguage 2 and the Mazsport fan mod, I notice the issue is at idle and when the AC is on.
With the AC is on at idle rpms jump up and down between around 800 rpm to 850 rpm. This is not a problem for me as my idle quality is acceptable and my car never stalled.
However, I did hear a faint clicking noise as something turns on and off, in tune with the rpms jumping up and down like every 30 sec to a 1 minute. Actually you have to have the hood up to really hear the noise (I have really good hearing by the way....). Looks to be one of the pulleys (alt, crank, or water) making the noise.
When I took the Mazsport mod out, I did not get such a jump in rpms or hear the faint click noise.
I've put it back and it came back. Nothing else appears wrong, so I don't know what to make of it. I have a R-magic ground and my voltage is fine at around 13.5. I have to find an alternate mechanic that knows RX-8s to look at, as the Mazda dealers may dry to screw with me, because of the mod.
Interested in the opinions of everyone else...
With the AC is on at idle rpms jump up and down between around 800 rpm to 850 rpm. This is not a problem for me as my idle quality is acceptable and my car never stalled.
However, I did hear a faint clicking noise as something turns on and off, in tune with the rpms jumping up and down like every 30 sec to a 1 minute. Actually you have to have the hood up to really hear the noise (I have really good hearing by the way....). Looks to be one of the pulleys (alt, crank, or water) making the noise.
When I took the Mazsport mod out, I did not get such a jump in rpms or hear the faint click noise.
I've put it back and it came back. Nothing else appears wrong, so I don't know what to make of it. I have a R-magic ground and my voltage is fine at around 13.5. I have to find an alternate mechanic that knows RX-8s to look at, as the Mazda dealers may dry to screw with me, because of the mod.
Interested in the opinions of everyone else...
beers
08-21-2007, 08:19 AM
#68
The clicking noise seems consistent with AC compressor issues, but I'm still looking for confirmation. The interesting thing is my AC works very well and I never had an issue with its function or working. There is also the possibility of a pulley belt slipping, but it does not seem like it.
Hmmm... the scary thing is it appears the AC compressor is PCM controlled, it also would interact with high/low temp. and pressure sensors. I'm not clear on how it all would work on the RX-8 or whether or not this is related to the mod.
The AC compressor might yet be cycling within the normal range and the jump in RPM range with the AC on appears acceptable for RX-8s. Definitely something that an expert with RX-8s would have to decide if it really is an issue or not.
The frequency of the click sound (and just the sound of it) seems weird though, so I'm trying to narrow down if it is a true problem or not. Swoope has giving me some suggestion to check out. I will report on the results later.
EDIT-
I had a Mazda tech/mechanic that I'm cool with take a look at the mod and the situation.
The frequency of cycling was normal based on the ambient outside temperatures. The RPM increase and decrease was in the normal range.
The mazsport fan mod appeared to be safe and working properly to do as advertised, which is to turn the fans on at lower temps. This coming "off the record" from a respected Mazda tech/mechanic that checked out the Mazsport fan mod. I was slightly surprised that he would be so positive towards the mod.
An ECU flash to have the fans work more aggressively, may be the better route. However, that is more expensive too and Mazsport mod would continue to work if you have your ECU re-flashed by Mazda (overwriting a 3rd party flash) by mistake.
The fan mod has proved its definitely useful.
Hmmm... the scary thing is it appears the AC compressor is PCM controlled, it also would interact with high/low temp. and pressure sensors. I'm not clear on how it all would work on the RX-8 or whether or not this is related to the mod.
The AC compressor might yet be cycling within the normal range and the jump in RPM range with the AC on appears acceptable for RX-8s. Definitely something that an expert with RX-8s would have to decide if it really is an issue or not.
The frequency of the click sound (and just the sound of it) seems weird though, so I'm trying to narrow down if it is a true problem or not. Swoope has giving me some suggestion to check out. I will report on the results later.
EDIT-
I had a Mazda tech/mechanic that I'm cool with take a look at the mod and the situation.
The frequency of cycling was normal based on the ambient outside temperatures. The RPM increase and decrease was in the normal range.
The mazsport fan mod appeared to be safe and working properly to do as advertised, which is to turn the fans on at lower temps. This coming "off the record" from a respected Mazda tech/mechanic that checked out the Mazsport fan mod. I was slightly surprised that he would be so positive towards the mod.
An ECU flash to have the fans work more aggressively, may be the better route. However, that is more expensive too and Mazsport mod would continue to work if you have your ECU re-flashed by Mazda (overwriting a 3rd party flash) by mistake.
The fan mod has proved its definitely useful.
Last edited by sosonic; 08-25-2007 at 12:32 AM.
08-26-2007, 07:51 AM
#69
I don't buy Kool-Aid
Hmmm... the scary thing is it appears the AC compressor is PCM controlled, it also would interact with high/low temp. and pressure sensors. I'm not clear on how it all would work on the RX-8 or whether or not this is related to the mod.
08-26-2007, 09:43 PM
#70
Originally, I was afraid that there was some type of conflict between the Mazsport fan mod and the AC compressor. Perhaps the combination of the 2 was causing the rpms to fluctuate wildly or the compressor to cycle extremely fast. Basically, I was being paranoid.
This was not the case, as confirmed by a Mazda tech. The Mazsport fan mod just works and works well.
This was not the case, as confirmed by a Mazda tech. The Mazsport fan mod just works and works well.
09-17-2007, 11:29 AM
#71
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i installed this mod about a week ago and everything was well.... except.... two times i have went out to start my car and the battery has been dead... i notice that when i get out of the car and shut it off and the fan starts to run ... when i go back out to start the car that it is sluggish to start and or does not start at all due to a dead battery ... anyone else have this problem?... its an 05 with the factory battery so i am assuming the battery is still good. thanks for the input guys
09-17-2007, 11:53 AM
#72
I hope you're right. I just ordered the fan mod kit & AP pulley also.
09-17-2007, 04:01 PM
#73
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also, ... on top of the battery being dead when the fan runs after the car is shut off... since the first time the battery has been dead the car has died 3 times since then... all when in neutral coasting to a stop light... but starts right back up and has no funny idle... i am NA so stock computer... is the stalling out because of the dead battery and the computer having to relearn and adjust itself again?
10-19-2007, 04:20 AM
#74
The following chart shows two track sessions of about 14mins each . In the first session both fans were on full for the whole time . In the second session both fans were turned on at 98deg C and off at stock Mazda switch point . Ambient temp was about 18deg C and the track is a very high speed one with a long straight where I was reaching up to 220km/hr .
Note how much longer the temps take to rise when the fans are always on and the highest temp reached is approx. 2-3 deg less .
Note how much longer the temps take to rise when the fans are always on and the highest temp reached is approx. 2-3 deg less .
Last edited by Brettus; 10-19-2007 at 04:37 AM.
07-02-2009, 08:53 PM
#75
i too have this mod and was messing around with the scan gauge yesterday and today at about 110 deg peak las vegas heat i was getting a low 198 to a high 225 in traffic with the a/c full blast. i personally dont think that this mod works that great for temps in the triple digits.