Header theory:
07-06-2007, 07:56 PM
#151
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I'm not quite sure what you mean. That still looks like a 3 into 1 header.
I've had the idea for several years now to collect the outermost runners at one point and then collect the center port farther downstream. I've never tried it even though I have the piping and the flange. I just don't have the car as a template.
Hey Team: How much did emachineshop want for those?
I've had the idea for several years now to collect the outermost runners at one point and then collect the center port farther downstream. I've never tried it even though I have the piping and the flange. I just don't have the car as a template.
Hey Team: How much did emachineshop want for those?
07-06-2007, 10:37 PM
#153
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RotaryGod, et al--
I've read through this entire thread and it's very informative, but there's something that's bugging me. This may be a dumb question, but I have to ask: Everyone says the Renesis has no overlap. I understand that this means the exhaust and intake ports for a single rotor are never open at the same time. But with the siamesed/shared center exhaust ports, is it possible that there is in fact an effective overlap from one rotor's exhaust port to the other rotor's intake port? Or does the basic geometry of the engine and its ports preclude this possibility?
Anyone? Bueller?
Thanks,
Bug
I've read through this entire thread and it's very informative, but there's something that's bugging me. This may be a dumb question, but I have to ask: Everyone says the Renesis has no overlap. I understand that this means the exhaust and intake ports for a single rotor are never open at the same time. But with the siamesed/shared center exhaust ports, is it possible that there is in fact an effective overlap from one rotor's exhaust port to the other rotor's intake port? Or does the basic geometry of the engine and its ports preclude this possibility?
Anyone? Bueller?
Thanks,
Bug
05-10-2008, 06:05 AM
#154
Tony says, RX8s are GREAT
This looks like a good place to post this since PM's don't work that well with some people...LOL
This is what im making now...
I should have it dynoed sometime August.. gotta finish the cat-back first.
It will either be stainless steel or regular steel but ceramic coated... I'm leaning towards the ceramic coated to save some cash and engine bay temps.
Racing beat did a 4 to 2 to 1 I think or something simular to that... according to Rotarygod
The exhaust of the front rotor were together and the exhaust of the rear rotor were together.
So it looked like this... YY
I have not seen anyone making it like the way I'm doing it and I dont see anywhere that anyone has tried... or I just could not find it when I searched.
I'm putting the front rotor front exhaust with the rear rotor front exhaust and the front rotor rear exhaust with the rear rotor rear exhaust.. like a ..... W... get it?
Well, hope all goes well.
This is what im making now...
I should have it dynoed sometime August.. gotta finish the cat-back first.
It will either be stainless steel or regular steel but ceramic coated... I'm leaning towards the ceramic coated to save some cash and engine bay temps.
Racing beat did a 4 to 2 to 1 I think or something simular to that... according to Rotarygod
The exhaust of the front rotor were together and the exhaust of the rear rotor were together.
So it looked like this... YY
I have not seen anyone making it like the way I'm doing it and I dont see anywhere that anyone has tried... or I just could not find it when I searched.
I'm putting the front rotor front exhaust with the rear rotor front exhaust and the front rotor rear exhaust with the rear rotor rear exhaust.. like a ..... W... get it?
Well, hope all goes well.
05-10-2008, 07:01 AM
#155
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I'm not quite sure what you mean. That still looks like a 3 into 1 header.
I've had the idea for several years now to collect the outermost runners at one point and then collect the center port farther downstream. I've never tried it even though I have the piping and the flange. I just don't have the car as a template.
Hey Team: How much did emachineshop want for those?
I've had the idea for several years now to collect the outermost runners at one point and then collect the center port farther downstream. I've never tried it even though I have the piping and the flange. I just don't have the car as a template.
Hey Team: How much did emachineshop want for those?
Ours hits the dyno on Monday, but it's not your perfect version of this theory though, so it may not show either way.
05-10-2008, 11:42 AM
#158
it was 18 & 20 Ga T321 material, the OE flange could be reproduced lighter, but it was expedient WRT to retaining the air injection function. This was my original intention, but I was short on time and had to make do on that one feature.
it weighed 8 lbs completed, the OE manifold is 17 lb; a 9 lb (53%) reduction even with the OE flange
the entire exhaust system with FIA ultra-flow racing cat converter, resonator, and dual tip mufflers out the back weighed only 33 lbs total, the entire OE exhaust weighs 79 lb total
it weighed 8 lbs completed, the OE manifold is 17 lb; a 9 lb (53%) reduction even with the OE flange
the entire exhaust system with FIA ultra-flow racing cat converter, resonator, and dual tip mufflers out the back weighed only 33 lbs total, the entire OE exhaust weighs 79 lb total
Last edited by TeamRX8; 05-10-2008 at 11:50 AM.
05-10-2008, 12:38 PM
#160
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it was 18 & 20 Ga T321 material, the OE flange could be reproduced lighter, but it was expedient WRT to retaining the air injection function. This was my original intention, but I was short on time and had to make do on that one feature.
it weighed 8 lbs completed, the OE manifold is 17 lb; a 9 lb (53%) reduction even with the OE flange
the entire exhaust system with FIA ultra-flow racing cat converter, resonator, and dual tip mufflers out the back weighed only 33 lbs total, the entire OE exhaust weighs 79 lb total
it weighed 8 lbs completed, the OE manifold is 17 lb; a 9 lb (53%) reduction even with the OE flange
the entire exhaust system with FIA ultra-flow racing cat converter, resonator, and dual tip mufflers out the back weighed only 33 lbs total, the entire OE exhaust weighs 79 lb total
Aye, the stock flange weighs a hell of a lot, milled ours out of 316Ti and saved about 2lb just there.
I thought ours was quite heavy until that, 79lb for a stock system? Ouch!
I will say one thing about the unequal length header setup though, it sounds fantastic.
Last edited by PhillipM; 05-10-2008 at 12:40 PM.
but I like it lol
05-14-2008, 07:21 AM
#173
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i saw this thread and got the wrong idea and lauphed.... hahaa i suck
Seriously though ... lets say I want to keep the air injection thing.. what headers are available that give a noticible gain ..... at what cost?
Seriously though ... lets say I want to keep the air injection thing.. what headers are available that give a noticible gain ..... at what cost?
05-14-2008, 03:15 PM
#175
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While I'd like to think my ideas have merit, and I have no proof they do, from everything that I have heard about RB's experiments as well as the experiments from Speedsource, gains are extremely hard to find in a Renesis header and all info points to team being correct when he states it's about flow and not header design. Currently that is accurate.
Now saying all that, the best exhausts on naturally aspirated rotaries of the past (engines with overlap) have been long primary systems that collect at the rear of the car before the muffler. That is what this spaghetti header appears to be doing but the fact that the center is still one pipe and not 2 seems counter intuitive to this working. While I can't cry absolute bs as I can't prove without a shadow of a doubt that their dyno is fake, it does seem interesting to see that their base power number is 228 which is basically what everyone knows it to be close to. Their new top number states nothing about the state of tune. This chart implies that the only difference is the header. I see nothing to confirm that though. We also see no mention anywhere of temperature, or octane or type of fuel used, or correction factors. Speedsource has stated that the max they've seen out of the engine with all the tricks is about 255 and that is also consistent with the new top number in this dyno. While the beginning and end numbers are realistic for an engine measured at the crank, I do have questions in regards to what else was done to achieve the new result.