TeamRX8

iTrader: (25)

you would just need to put a spacer between the hub and the hat, then space the caliper out too.

dannobre

iTrader: (3)

1 spacer is bad enough....2...

TeamRX8

iTrader: (25)

you run spacers?

dannobre

iTrader: (3)

Hell no.....I just couldn't imagine using 2...to get bigger rings to fit. More likely to have a failure due to the spacers than the brakes fading

TeamRX8

iTrader: (25)

it wouldn't be much, maybe 3mm and the OE studs can handle that, but it was my bad anyways because the calipers are mounted radially, not on the side. It would take a different caliper mounting bracket to make it work

edit: maybe not, I was thinking the bracket was mounted on the far side, now I seem to recall it's mounted on the rotor side, that means it could be safely shimmed out. There's no safety issue with doing that if the shim washers are at least as large in diameter as the OE spindle mounting pads, same for the hub spacer

mac11

iTrader: (1)

Are the racing brake calipers floating like the OE's or are they fixed?

TeamRX8

iTrader: (25)

the front RB calipers are a fixed 4-pot

kinchu007

iTrader: (1)

Sorry to bring this back from the dead...

To summarize (and confirmed by RB):
1...13" Enkei offset BBK will fit 18x9.5 RPF1 wheels (duh!)
2...12.6" BBK will NOT fit 18x9.5 RPF1 wheels
3...rotor hats for 13" kit and 12.6" kit are different (this negates the possibility of buying the stock sized 2-piece rotors and then upgrading to the aluminim calipers later and just swapping rotor rings)
4...Brian at Good Win Racing has asked RB to build a 12.6" Enkeit offset BBK to be used on the current gen MX-5 (RB denies that they are working on this, siting that they have too many 12.6" BBK kits on the shelf to even consider it)

I need a solution of some kind...I have Endless CC-X pads, Centric Premium rotors (Stoptech blanks), SS lines and brake ducting as I've shown everyone on previous posts.

I'm still warping rotors at the track and even though they are only $136 a pair for the fronts I'm really getting tired of swapping them. Some of it has been pad transfer, some of it rotor warpage.

MY QUESTION: from your direct experience (please don't weigh in if you think stock brakes are just dandy and I'm wasting my money on bling), is the 2-piece RB rotor by itself a worthwhile purchase for weekend racing, in terms of rotor longevity, pad longevity, and lastly braking and handling performance? Or should I just continue swapping rotors every other track day at $136 a pair like I did last year?

justjim

Even though you stated you don't want to hear from the "OEM brakes are just dandy" people I am going to reply anyway and I give you permission to disregard what I say.

I do not believe you are warping your rotors. I believe your pad selection is inadequate for your task at hand. If I can run my RX8 at a high speed brake intensive course (Sebring) on R-compound tires at competitive lap times without rotor warpage and I can run my previous car, a FWD with smaller less effecient brakes, at the same course, generating front rotor temperatures well in excess of anything you are generating in your RX8 without any rotor warpage, I feel confident that your rotors are not warping but your pads are probably the problem and you are right that pad deposits are occuring. Try some Carbotech or Cobalt track pads, quit swapping rotors, and get with the program.

Two piece floating hat rotors will reduce unsprung and rotational weight, will look cool, and will run cooler, possibly allowing you to get by without proper pads. If you want to get them go ahead.

dannobre

iTrader: (3)

I've run 7 sets of front pads on the rings on mine.....2 sets of HPS 4 sets of HP+ and i set of HT-10's I have minimal wear..no warping...and zero problems. I bought 2 sets of rings because I figured I'd need them...and so far they are sitting in the parts bin. I don't know what they make them out of...but they are damn durable with the Hawk pads anyway

sdoow

We appreciated Kinchu007's dilligence in research and follow up on this.
Right.
Correct as we don't make stock kit to Enkei offset yet.
The hats are different, however we do offer aluminum caliper kits upgrade so you can retain our two piece stock size rotors.
This was a few months ago when we received feeback from Brain saying our Enkei deeper offset kit can interfer with MX5 ball joint. We will be retesting this kit for MX5 this week and figure out an optimal offset which will be good for Enkei wheels on both RX8 and MX5. This kit is expected to release in early march 2009.
Most our track customers with RB two piece rotors have great success w/o cooling duct. See latest testimonial from Rob (Grand AM racing team) who raced with RB two piece rotors with "drilled" finish. If they were not vented properly it can do more harm to the brake rotors (heat balance) than good.
Some customers do what you are doing now but later find out it actually costs a lot more, w/o enen considering the down time and the confidence at tracks, than investing on a good two piece rotor with matching pads.
It seems quite a fes enthusiasts facing a situation like you:

- My stock is not good enough for me.
- Aluminum caliper kit is a bit too much for me to consider at least for now.
- There are so many choices out there which can be even more cofusing and frsustaing when it comes to decision.

RB is a brake solution provider and we offer more upgrade choices for RX8 than any other brake manufactures, our advice is don't over spend unless you really need it. We have different upgrades to meet your need - from stock one piece rotors (our one piece rotors are made with curved vanes, upgrade to OE straight vane), to two piece rotors, and aluminum caliper kits.

We also have performace brake pads for your choice.

ET300 - Street performance pads, no dust, now squeak.
ET500 - For agressive driving and auto cross
ET800 - Track pads

The ET compounds have received favorable reviews in various motorsports forums.

Please feel free to PM or email us if you are interested in trying our two piece rotors with ET pads so you can post your experiene and share with others.

Thanks

Warren-RB


.

olddragger

iTrader: (3)

nice response.
I know Rob--really nice guy--he knows what he talks about.
olddragger

olddragger

iTrader: (3)

oh one thing to mention if you do get drilled discs--clean them out before a track w/e.
oD

I8U

iTrader: (1)

Yes he does! hehe

We ran 2-piece RB drilled/slotted rotors throughout the entire KONI season. They are f'n great!

eviltwinkie

Few things...

1) If your going to be tracking...spend the money to get right parts, and especially the better quality components...failure is not a good idea, especially just because your trying to save a few bucks...in the long haul, you'll end up spending more money just replacing components or eating a wall...

2) Part of the problem might be your braking/driving style...you might be riding or relying on your braking too much and thus aggravating the issue...

3) Cool down...cool down...cool down...check your ducting to ensure proper flow to where its really needed, and then take the time to do your cool down lap focusing on NOT using the brakes unless you need to...which means drive slower...

I'm a fan of RB's gear...but most problems are generally being created by the driver and/or not remembering to do the "little things" which are critical in the long haul...

Spin9k

My 3c worth. I never had problems w/stock rotors w/various pads, but added duct cooling anyway to bring temps down. Then went to RB 2-p rotorsw/stock calipers + 1st HP+ pads (yuk), then Cobalt pads ( ). In both cases, rotor warpage was never ever an issue. Only my opinion, but if you can (actually) warp rotors on an RX-8 w/less than 400Hp, something is very very wrong with your setup. The Centric Premium rotors you're using??... never heard of them, but if they're decent, they should not warp. Pad problems, and pad deposits specifically, as someone said, are far more the likely answer.

Given good rotors (like RB) ...Good pads give no rotor warpage, no deposits, very little rotor wear, more stopping power than R-Comps can provide gripping power, do it over and over wo/fade or drama.....what more can you ask for...? You'll replace the pads every no and again sure, but that's nothing, just normal maintenance. Use pads RX-8 race teams use, they're more expensive, but work as advertised. They've done the testing what works, take adavantage of it.

olddragger

iTrader: (3)

maybe you are getting caliper flex?
OD

justjim

Its my opinion that Kinchu007s perception that he has rotor problems is entirely due to his selection of a pad with an inadequate heat range for the driving conditions he's using them for. The Endless CC-X pad he is using is a crossover pad between street and track use. Although I have no personal experience with them, their Endless website advertised operating range is 100 to 700C (212 to 1292F) which is probably not high enough for agressive track use. Whether or not he could get by with the Endless pads with a 2-piece rotor is an unanswered question, maybe yes, maybe no.

I use pad compounds on the RX8 at the track that are good to 1600F (871C) (Carbotech or Cobalt) with the OEM rotor and caliper setup. These pads are easy on the rotors, don't fade, and don't make pad deposits. He just needs a better pad. If he wants a 2-piece rotor go for it. Even if I got the 2-piece rotors I would still use track pads with them and probably just get more life out of my track pads. I am a big believer in dedicated track pads.

olddragger

iTrader: (3)

Oh---I see---second that--carbo tec xp 8's for me--never had a problem even without ducting.
OD

Ketan002

Im receiving the big brake kit from racing beat on Friday, jan 16. The service with this company is awesome and quick, from previous replies from those of you on the forums it looks like a great kit and will be trying them out on my first time on the track @ willow springs on feb. 7. Anyone one going to that event, please join if your local (speedventures.com). Any tips on install. I will keep you updated on the performance once they are on.

Ketan002

Sorry typo, not racing beat but RACING BRAKE.

Razz1

I belive it's the pads.
I use the carbon kevlar from Porterfield. They are local here in Calf.

No problems. Also braking style could add to the problem.

One sure fix I did was to use Cryogenic's. Porterfield can do that to you rotos for a fee. Bring them in. The Cryo rotors resist heat very well...

I drive very slow on cool down and sometimes i'll drive around the pit a couple of times for good meaasure on those hot 105 degree plus days.

I also have sloted rotors.

kinchu007

iTrader: (1)

Thanks for all the replies!

I've thought about it and thought about it and I think you guys/gals are right...I have to use a pad with a higher temp range.

I have a set of brand new Endless CC-R front pads sitting in my room.

I'll try using those and see how it goes.

If that doesn't work out, I'm gonna go with the Racing Brake 2-piece rotors.

P.S. -- thanks for scaring the crap out of me with tha caliper flex idea olddragger

eviltwinkie

Racing Brake 2-piece rotors...eventually anyway...

EricMeyer

Can you describe what your calling "warped"?


I've found great success with the stock calipers and rotors. The DTC Hawk compounds are superior to the previous BLUE and BLACK that people still think of when they hear "Hawk". Try a 60 front and 10 rear for a dedicated track car.

Caliper Flex. My good friends at Hawk Brake share with me (and have showed me on our cars) that many brake calipers flex over time. You'll see this in PAD WEAR. More typical on the front and occurs more when your entire suspension package is maximized giving you strong braking potential.

Purchase a pair of inexpensive measuring calipers and measure your brake pads. If your pad wear is not even, it may be time for a new set of calipers (which we put on new at the beginning of each season).

Measure. Measure. Measure.