Marklar

Very true, rotaries tend to have a bad rep because of a combination of legit issues and apples vs. oranges comparisons. The FD really didn't help the reliability reputation for rotaries, and 159 ft/lbs of peak torque sounds laughably weak when you don't understand the torque curve of a rotary.


It's an old car now, they advertised it as much as any sports car ever gets advertised. Sports cars don't get advertised much, because they don't need to be advertised much, the buyers are a group that already knows. When did you last see an ad for a 911?

CrazyJek

I read somewhere else in this thread...

What Mazda needs to do is have 2 cars. One $25k, and the other $32k (or around there). They both have 16x, one is FI. One produces 250-270hp and 180-200tq and the FI one should be putting out 250tq and 350hp at least... all while keeping it at around 2800-3000lbs...

Lets not forget... If your going to spend mid 30k on a car... there is still the Evo. Great handling, AWD makes it great for all weather (and conditions), and its very quick off the line. Chip it and you get even more.

Mazda has a lot of serious competition. The new 2.0 Genesis coupe is very nice interior wise (i drove it). Its kinda slow.. but it practically has the evo engine... and stock it can handle 500hp without throwing a rod. Tuners are going to eat that **** up.

Mustang is putting out a new V8 to compete with the Camaro. Its gonna put out 400hp. There new V6 already puts out more then their old v8 (lols).

Camaro... nuff said.

New toyota (although i think it will be a fail).

BMW128i...

370z is a nice car, and a big improvement on the 350... The G37s is also a much wanted car.

Mazda needs to do some serious thinking. I know emissions and EPA mpg is killing their R&D, but if they can keep the car around 20mpg average, then i dont think they will have a problem as long as the weight/power is enough to compete with the ever growing competition.




Do it Mazda.

ccd

CrazyJek's post shows what has vexed the current RX-8 and the challenge any new rotary would face: what exactly is it? Is the RX a muscle car? Can/should it compete with rally cars like the EVO? Or is it competition for the Z?

The new car will need to address hp/torque/reliability issues, but if Mazda does not define, what it is, none of that may matter. How much hp the new car needs, depends in part, on what it is.

CrazyJek

People come up to me all the time and ask... "Why would i buy a brand new Rx8 for 32-35k... when i could get an Evo for a tiny bit more?" I say, "Well you get the exclusivity of owning a rotary and the amazing handling on the car. You get that zoom-zoom feeling!" They reply with.."Well the Evo has amazing handling too, and it also seats 4, and its more reliable..."

Others say they would buy the Z because owning 4 seats only offers you to drive everyone everywhere. Honestly, the new Z doesnt handle as good as the 8... but who takes these cars to the tracks???

I know many take the Rx8 to tracks and ****... but anyone serious enough to do some serious track racing usually upgrades the suspension anyway...

Mazda needs to understand that having a "track-ready" car is great and all... but MAJORITY of the people buying these cars DO NOT go to the track. They like to see the HP numbers on the sticker.


Make a sports car reliable, look good, unique, competitive in price, and fast with reasonable handling... and you got a lot of people buying it. I love this car to death, and have loved it ever since it came out... but almost everyone i know says they wouldnt buy it because there are many better options in that price range that has what they are looking for.

I hope Mazda finds a role for their new rotary. The 8 seems like their bastard child. Jeremy Clarkson said it best, "Its almost like they had a suggestion box at the factory.. they got millions of ideas and said "I know! Lets have all of them!""

8sumthin

I think Mazda really missed the boat on marketing this car, it's not a muscle car, it's not an ultra performance car, it's a go cart that makes it fun to drive everyday and you can take your friends or family along for the ride. If it didn't have the back seat I'd have to drive some sort of sport sedan. With the proper positioning they would own this catagory. Go back to 2 seats and the competition is much greater as well as losing all us family guys who still like to drive.
I've had my car for 5 years and look for an alternative all the time just to have something new and I keep coming back to the car I already have.

reddozen

iTrader: (1)

I think what CrazyJek is saying here is right, but to add a little more celerity to what I think, the RX8 compete directly with the Z cars, the evo, and the imprezas, and whatever other sub $40k~$50k car. Now, those others may have been designed with a different purpose in mind initially, but to the average owner, "which is faster", "What's more reliable", and "what has the biggest aftermarket community".

If they were to make it faster (more HP), more reliable (the S2 may fix that) and try and stimulate the aftermarket community, that alone could go a long way. They need to get more people comfortable with the idea of owning a rotary and help battle the stigma. I get jokes all the time about my cars reliability, but my buddy has an 8 with 170k miles on it... People just aren't educated.

In high school we took apart a piston engine in science and in physics class. maybe mazda should donate some rotary engines to school s and have the science departments educate students about the various kinds of engines available. I duno... i think they need to do a lot more education / PR work to help people understand what they are.

KrylonFuzion

I'm a dreamer and would like to believe Mazdas got an ace up their sleeve...

But to be honset, I don't think they are going to be done tweaking the 16x for a fuel economy-savvy automotive market for a loong time.

But when that engine comes out, you can bet I'm going to swap this renesis out for that 1.6 liter monster :D

cidvicious831

just read a article on super street mag about rx8 coming back. any one read it? i'll try to post a pic.

cidvicious831

sorry i meant rx7

cidvicious831

http://cidvicious831.deviantart.com/...-rx7-155560319 heres the link. im gonna take it down soon so try to read the actual mag. i was shopping with my wife so i was reading while she was choosing the sodas. good way to spend time while she talks about food!!

ccd

I've been following RX-8 offerings and prices in my area. Mazda has had to offer $5k rebates on 2009 RX-8s, at least thru 3/1/10, to clear out old inventory. Best deal I have seen to date is $24,995 for a 2009 R3 with 413 miles on it. That car did not last long.

The other thing seems to be that there are fewer 2010 RX-8s on the market and this time last year. I get the impression that Mazda is already cutting back production so it won't have to offer big rebates this time around. I'd venture that the phase out of the current RX-8 has already begun.

bhop

^ You're not the only one who feels that way. I'm not surprised though...

I'm just waiting for some sort of announcement about what they are doing next.

ccd

To give two examples:

I was tracking the price of a 2009 R3 locally. I was actually going to go to the dealership this week when the price dropped to $24,995, but someone beat me to the punch. Just out of curiosity, I checked their inventory of 2010 RX-8s and they had none. Another dealership in my area has two: a R3 which they have had since the Fall and another car.

Sure feels like the current RX-8 is being discontinued or is being replaced by a new model. Either way, Mazda appears to want to limit the amount of left over inventory.

Drumm09

I've noticed the exact same thing in my area. It seems that the 10 rx8 are few in dealerships. I am not sure if 2010 is the last YM for the rx8 but judging from the low inventory, it can't last too long.

I'm just sitting tight until we hear that announcement....

SlideWayz

I would buy another RX if it (1) got better gas mileage, (2) wasn't underpowered/undertorqued, and (3) was reliable.

Definitely the best handling car I've ever owned, and I love the styling. However, I hated the combination of lack of power and crummy fuel economy. Turbo-ing the car didn't work out...went through 3 engines.

I really hope Mazda does a hat trick.

redcopper06

mazda should have just engineered it with a turbo. that way it would have had beefed up oiling, cooling, and be more structurally sound from the git-go.

as is, they only engineered it for injection in the first place; so they didnt have to make things at a higher performing level. they should have raised the bar & aimed higher imo

everything else on the car is pretty damn sweet

VashCloud

*WRONG*

Sorry I gotta correct this. The Genesis I4 shares a lot of similar stuff with the evo motor but the block selves, pistons, rods etc. Are all totally different and weaker. If anyone was to go for 500 you will have to rebuild motor. Maybe 350-400 is more realistic but still hard.

Same goes with new STI, the new sti motor isnt the same ej25 we are all use to. It used wreaker pistons and rods than previous model motors and therefore a lot of new owners find themselves blowing their motors before they get anywhere close to the old motors powerlevels.

Just gotta clear that up.

kenpo1441

iTrader: (1)

Coming from an Evo X...vashcloud is correct. The block is very similar, but everything else is completely different on the Genesis.