Owner/Hater
01-06-2010, 10:12 PM
#51
Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: PNW
Posts: 759
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Let's not get carried away.
It's a fine car, and good compromise between real-world functionality (ignoring the flooding issue, and the gruesome gas mileage, especially if you have low-speed commuting in a cooler climate) and nice performance, but there are plenty of affordable cars that outhandle it, especially in stock form.
It's a fine car, and good compromise between real-world functionality (ignoring the flooding issue, and the gruesome gas mileage, especially if you have low-speed commuting in a cooler climate) and nice performance, but there are plenty of affordable cars that outhandle it, especially in stock form.
01-06-2010, 10:55 PM
#52
ITs funny People bitch about Fuel Economy/MPG in the Rx-8 Generation.
I dont see people bitch about RX-7's MPG, FB/FC/FD, well ok they exist, but only a few. and are mostly retards. My FC has about the same mpg or maybe a bit less than my FE, and its making FAR LESS power. so, bitch what? I think Mazda did a good job.
Next thing I know is ppl gonna be like "oh, but current gen cars get better mpg and yada yada yada"
You got this car and bitch? wow, if you bitch so much, sell it, no one is stopping you. simple as that.
I dont see people bitch about RX-7's MPG, FB/FC/FD, well ok they exist, but only a few. and are mostly retards. My FC has about the same mpg or maybe a bit less than my FE, and its making FAR LESS power. so, bitch what? I think Mazda did a good job.
Next thing I know is ppl gonna be like "oh, but current gen cars get better mpg and yada yada yada"
You got this car and bitch? wow, if you bitch so much, sell it, no one is stopping you. simple as that.
01-07-2010, 01:23 AM
#54
RX8. Yeah, I get it.
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: May 2009
Location: West Lafayette, IN
Posts: 454
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
"OP; sometimes "it sucks oil and gas" is a self-effacing comeback comment so as not to appear overly pretentious to lowly non- RX-8 owners (I trust at the time he didn't know you also drive one)."
^+1 I say that all the time to people who ask about my 8...just for the simple reason to keep one less 8 off the road in my town =)
^+1 I say that all the time to people who ask about my 8...just for the simple reason to keep one less 8 off the road in my town =)
01-07-2010, 09:35 AM
#55
Huge hole is huge
ITs funny People bitch about Fuel Economy/MPG in the Rx-8 Generation.
I dont see people bitch about RX-7's MPG, FB/FC/FD, well ok they exist, but only a few. and are mostly retards. My FC has about the same mpg or maybe a bit less than my FE, and its making FAR LESS power. so, bitch what? I think Mazda did a good job.
Next thing I know is ppl gonna be like "oh, but current gen cars get better mpg and yada yada yada"
You got this car and bitch? wow, if you bitch so much, sell it, no one is stopping you. simple as that.
I dont see people bitch about RX-7's MPG, FB/FC/FD, well ok they exist, but only a few. and are mostly retards. My FC has about the same mpg or maybe a bit less than my FE, and its making FAR LESS power. so, bitch what? I think Mazda did a good job.
Next thing I know is ppl gonna be like "oh, but current gen cars get better mpg and yada yada yada"
You got this car and bitch? wow, if you bitch so much, sell it, no one is stopping you. simple as that.
Sometimes I think people forget how new this engine is. It's Rotary Xperimental for a reason. If you don't want to be part of a costly experiment, then...why did you buy one?
Oh, you didn't know? This is why you research. It's like paying twice as much for an item, then bitching because of how much you payed. Lack of research doesn't make ignorance OK.
01-07-2010, 09:59 AM
#56
Registered
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Philadelphia, PA USA
Posts: 1,116
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Let's not get carried away.
It's a fine car, and good compromise between real-world functionality (ignoring the flooding issue, and the gruesome gas mileage, especially if you have low-speed commuting in a cooler climate) and nice performance, but there are plenty of affordable cars that outhandle it, especially in stock form.
It's a fine car, and good compromise between real-world functionality (ignoring the flooding issue, and the gruesome gas mileage, especially if you have low-speed commuting in a cooler climate) and nice performance, but there are plenty of affordable cars that outhandle it, especially in stock form.
01-07-2010, 12:33 PM
#59
Registered
iTrader: (2)
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Pacific Northwest
Posts: 16,684
Likes: 0
Received 240 Likes
on
110 Posts
Weight is king of autocross, not 'handling'. MX-5s have 100 or so less HP, very similar suspension package, but can post significantly better auto-x times than a similarly equipped 8 for the same course.
That being said, take a look at the 2009 B-stock SCCA Solo2 Championship results:
So.....yeah.
That being said, take a look at the 2009 B-stock SCCA Solo2 Championship results:
Code:
T 1 194 Bryan Heitkotter 2005 Mazda RX-8 Slv Hoosier 59.989 62.117(1) 59.535 117.860 [94] Fresno, CA Team H&H/Hi Mom San Franci 58.860 58.325 61.881(2) T 2 198 Neal Tovsen 2004 Mazda RX8 Ylw Hoosier 60.041 59.997 59.645 118.094 [98] Saint Paul, MN Mazdaspeed Hoosier Team Milwaukee 60.713(1) 62.566(2) 58.449 (0.234) T 3 94 Zach Heidepriem 2005 Mazda RX-8 Slv Hoosier 63.286(2) 61.562(1) 59.744 118.280 [194] Los Altos, CA San Franci 60.405(1) 58.536 58.588 (0.186) T 4 51 Jason Ruggles 2007 Mazda RX-8 Slv Hoosier 59.603 59.847 59.956 118.908 [151] Margate, FL Team Leadfoot / Thanks J Florida Re 63.154(2) 59.910 59.305 (0.628) T 5 189 Chris Harvey 2006 Mazda RX-8 Red Hoosier 67.776(3) 60.458 60.426 119.029 [89] Osceola, IN The Tire Rack South Bend 58.603 60.776(1) 59.018 (0.121) T 6 98 Ivan Austin 2004 Mazda RX8 Ylw Hoosier 60.934 60.011 60.941 119.231 [198] Crystal, MN Mazdaspeed/Hoosier Milwaukee 64.044(2) 59.555 59.220 (0.202) T 7 193 Eric Jones 2004 Mazda RX-8 Blu Hoosier 63.732(1) 63.274(1) 60.216 119.511 [93] Austin, TX Deguello Racing/RTRT Lone Star 61.057(1) 59.295 59.461 (0.280) 8 151 Jim Fossum 2007 Mazda RX-8 Slv Hoosier 60.979 DNF 60.912 119.859 [51] Greer, SC Mazdaspeed / Hoosier Atlanta Re 59.409 61.656(1) 58.947 (0.348) 9 88 Joe Tharpe 2009 Mazda RX-8 Blk Hoosier 60.738 64.725(2) 61.024 120.155 [188] State Center, IA Loctite / TireRack Des Moines 59.417 61.967(1) 59.941 (0.296) 10 89 John Rogers 2006 Mazda RX-8 Red Hoosier 60.813 61.418 64.146(2) 120.228 [189] Granger, IN Tire Rack South Bend 59.908 59.415 61.641(1) (0.073) 11 37 Benjamin Pullen 1993 Toyota Mr2 Turbo B Hoosier 61.317 60.924 61.067 120.468 Lexington, KY GunShowRacing.com Central Ke 62.223(1) 59.702 59.544 (0.240) 12 22 Kenneth Baker 2008 Mazda RX-8 Blk Hoosier 64.330(1) 61.391 63.107(1) 121.073 Aledo, TX Autocross.com Texas Regi 62.389(1) 59.682 61.360(1) (0.605) 13 93 Joe Goeke 2005 Mazda Rx8 Blk Hoosier 61.366 61.577 61.267 121.147 [193] Kirkland, WA Thanks Eric!/Team Butt H Northwest 59.984 60.156 59.880 (0.074) 14 42 Mike Bronson 2005 Mazda RX-8 Red Hoosier 62.029 62.399 61.547 121.186 West Des Moines, IA Des Moines 60.115 59.981 59.639 (0.039) 15 85 Adam Ruff 2005 Nissan 350Z Ylw Hoosier 60.779 60.663 60.205 121.297 [185] Oregon City, OR Thanks Glenn! Oregon Reg 65.058(2) 61.430(1) 61.092(1) (0.111) 16 99 Mark Sipe 2005 Mazda RX-8 Wht Hoosier 61.859 60.944 61.811 121.641 Reno, NV KONI-HOOSIER-TRUECHOICE Reno Regio 64.693(2) 64.044(2) 60.697 (0.344) 17 185 Glenn Austin 2005 Nissan 350Z Ylw Hoosier 61.553 61.899 61.022 121.644 [85] Maple Valley, WA AXAnalyst/Austin-Soft.co Northwest 61.247 60.622 DNF (0.003) 18 188 Tim Reinhardt 2009 Mazda RX8 Blk Hoosier 66.687(2) 64.373(1) 62.167 122.378 [88] Ames, IA Tire Rack / Loctite Des Moines 61.521(1) 60.211 63.696(2) (0.734) 19 190 Shawn Roberts 2006 Mazda RX-8 Gry Hoosier 62.326 62.248 62.328 122.843 [90] Woodbridge, VA Washington 64.479(2) 60.934 60.595 (0.465) 20 90 Chike Dellimore 2006 Mazda RX-8 Gry Hoosier 61.910 62.374 62.409 122.850 [190] Crozet, VA Mazdaspeed / My wife! Blue Ridge 62.076 61.026 60.940 (0.007) 21 11 KJ Christopher 2004 mazda rx8 Slv Hoosier 61.117 61.052 60.970 122.875 Redondo Beach, CA Deloitte Tax Cal Club R 63.476(1) 66.736(3) 61.905(1) (0.025) 22 91 Tim Heaton 2005 Mazda RX-8 Wht Kumho 62.606 66.768(2) 62.719 125.652 Omaha, NE Crazy 8 Race Team Nebraska R 65.164(2) 63.046(1) 63.267(1) (2.777)
Last edited by RIWWP; 01-07-2010 at 12:37 PM.
01-07-2010, 02:30 PM
#60
Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: PNW
Posts: 759
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
You are entitled to disagree with me, just as some people insist the world is flat. Doesn't change reality, however.
Convenient memory lapse. Nevertheless, it's so patently absurd to make your statement that it's not even worth spending much time rebutting it. Suffice it to say that a 3000 pound, four-door car with no torque can't possibly be the best handling car in the world.
It isn't really a matter of opinion, any more than the topology or the world is a matter of opinion. The fact is that the RX-8 has been the king of B Stock in autocross, but there are two classes above that, with faster cars. And we'll see how it does this year in the combined, new C Stock.
So, I'll repeat: Let's not get carried away.
It's a fine car, and good compromise between real-world functionality (ignoring the flooding issue, and the gruesome gas mileage, especially if you have low-speed commuting in a cooler climate) and nice performance, but there are plenty of affordable cars that outhandle it, especially in stock form.
Convenient memory lapse. Nevertheless, it's so patently absurd to make your statement that it's not even worth spending much time rebutting it. Suffice it to say that a 3000 pound, four-door car with no torque can't possibly be the best handling car in the world. So, I'll repeat: Let's not get carried away.
It's a fine car, and good compromise between real-world functionality (ignoring the flooding issue, and the gruesome gas mileage, especially if you have low-speed commuting in a cooler climate) and nice performance, but there are plenty of affordable cars that outhandle it, especially in stock form.
01-07-2010, 02:36 PM
#61
Registered
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Philadelphia, PA USA
Posts: 1,116
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
You're an offensive little twerp aren't you.
01-07-2010, 03:13 PM
#63
Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: PNW
Posts: 759
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
01-07-2010, 03:18 PM
#64
Registered
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Philadelphia, PA USA
Posts: 1,116
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
If pointing out that the fact that not what you substantively said was offensive, but that the way in which you chose to phrase it was offensive could be a personal attack, then I guess so.
01-07-2010, 03:21 PM
#65
Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: PNW
Posts: 759
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
01-07-2010, 03:23 PM
#67
Registered
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Philadelphia, PA USA
Posts: 1,116
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
01-07-2010, 03:43 PM
#68
Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: PNW
Posts: 759
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
On the assumption that this is a good-faith question, I'll respond.
My first car was a 1969 FIAT 124 Spider, which I owned from early 1975 to 1976. Wonderful handling car, for the time, and lots of fun to drive, when it bothered to start and/or stay running. It started my love of cars generally, sports cars more particularly, and two-seat roadsters specifically. I still think it's one of the most beautiful affordable production cars ever made.
When I was again living in a place where having such a car made sense, I bought a 1978 FIAT 124 Spider (in 1983). It was less car than the '69 had been, pollution control devices having outpaced FIAT's engineering department (not a tall order at the time, unfortunately). But it was still lots of fun on those rare occasions when it chose to run.
That car suffered full-system failure in 1989, when my wife was pregnant with child number 3. So no more two-seat cars for me for a while.
When the car I bought to replace the FIAT suffered full-system failure in 2004, it was time for another two-seat roadster (child #3 being only two years from leaving the nest at that point). And my wife bought an RX-8.
My first car was a 1969 FIAT 124 Spider, which I owned from early 1975 to 1976. Wonderful handling car, for the time, and lots of fun to drive, when it bothered to start and/or stay running. It started my love of cars generally, sports cars more particularly, and two-seat roadsters specifically. I still think it's one of the most beautiful affordable production cars ever made.
When I was again living in a place where having such a car made sense, I bought a 1978 FIAT 124 Spider (in 1983). It was less car than the '69 had been, pollution control devices having outpaced FIAT's engineering department (not a tall order at the time, unfortunately). But it was still lots of fun on those rare occasions when it chose to run.
That car suffered full-system failure in 1989, when my wife was pregnant with child number 3. So no more two-seat cars for me for a while.
When the car I bought to replace the FIAT suffered full-system failure in 2004, it was time for another two-seat roadster (child #3 being only two years from leaving the nest at that point). And my wife bought an RX-8.
01-07-2010, 03:57 PM
#69
Registered
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Philadelphia, PA USA
Posts: 1,116
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
It's a good faith question. I have a '67 Alfa Romeo Spider, which I love to bits. Fortunately, I love it sitting just as much as running. The FIATs are fun little cars and much more sensible than owning an Alfa. I haven't ridden in a FIAT spider in years, but they were always great fun for the money.
01-07-2010, 04:17 PM
#70
Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: PNW
Posts: 759
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
If the 1969 FIAT 124 Spider isn't the prettiest affordable production car ever built, the 1967-1971 ALFA Spider was. Absolutely lovely car, even if it's less reliable than the FIATs of the same vintage. Pininfarina has long known how to design lovely cars.
01-07-2010, 06:45 PM
#71
Registered
How do you define "best handling"? or just "handling", for that matter? "Good handling" is subjective. Different people have different driving styles. Some may prefer a little oversteer, some like a bit of understeer, twitchy or forgiving, etc...
The RX-8 is not exactly a light car, and it doesn't have tons of grip, but there's more to handling than weigh and grip. (Fwiw, I love RX-8 for it's steering feedback and just the way it feels in corners.
)
there are two classes above that, with faster cars.
They may just be more powerful. The best handling car (whatever it is) is not necessarily be the fastest around a track. (i.e. mazadaspeed3 vs RX-8.)
there are plenty of affordable cars that outhandle it, especially in stock form.
...and since we're talking about alfas, I'd really like a 60's or 70's GTV someday.
Last edited by ultrataco; 01-07-2010 at 06:49 PM.
01-07-2010, 07:06 PM
#72
Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: PNW
Posts: 759
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
For a while, my son had both an RX-8, fully prepped for B Stock national autocrossing, and an Elise, also full prepped for Super Stock. There was no comparison (and the Elise, bought used two years old, cost $35,000, fully prepped, not much more than a new RX-8 fully prepped with $4000 shocks, sway bars and the other necessities).
A C4 Corvette, fully set up for A Stock (now B Stock) autocross will outhandle an RX-8, in terms of grip, cornering, and speed through turns.
I could go on and on.
It's not my intention to bash the RX-8. It makes no pretense to being the ultimate handling car; it handles very well, but it's not by any means the best, even in its general price range. It's a compromise car. I just get a little tired of people wildly overstating the cars attributes (while also often understating its liabilities). Mazda made the decision, wisely in my mind, to set it up fairly softly-sprung; it is a four door coupe, after all (and what "four door" has to do with handling is that a four-door car will have a longer, higher roof than a two-door car, and therefore a higher center of gravity; compare that to a convertible with its top down), made to carry people.
To me, torque helps "handling," because it helps you pull out of corners faster. I race a Spec Miata, and I can attest to the fact that a car that handles as if on rails (as a Spec Miata does) is less fun than it would be if it could get out of its own way coming out of turns.
While it's certainly true that the "best handling" car may not be the fastest around a track, it's also true that autocross performance is a very good proxy for "handling," because of its emphasis on turns and transitions.
01-07-2010, 08:22 PM
#73
Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Denver
Posts: 167
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
well i did the same mistake by buying the car without researching... one night i took it out for a spin and i got the rpms up without it being warmed up and for that i had a leak (fixed it btw). after that i joined the club started learning and now the car runs like a sports car knock on wood! . gas is not bad. only complaint i have is that i dont have winter tires. xD
edit: i stopped reading after page 1 so... this argument about s2k and rx8?? o.O lol
edit: i stopped reading after page 1 so... this argument about s2k and rx8?? o.O lol
Last edited by CaptainEggs; 01-07-2010 at 08:24 PM.
01-07-2010, 08:26 PM
#74
Registered
I agree about the Elise. I don't really know much about the S2000, so no comment there (sounds like fun, though). I can understand how an Elise handles better than an 8 overall, but I've heard they are twitchy at the limit, unlike the 8. The RX-8 seems to be designed more for predictable, fun, mountain road handling than outright track speed. However, predictability (and excellent steering) make it easy to go faster.
I can't make any claims about the RX-8 being the best since I have nothing to compare it to other than my '91 rx7 and my parents' '93 camry and '96 caravan. (Probably also why I think the RX-8 is pretty darn fast.
) I've only had the 8 a few weeks and haven't been able to push it's handling limits, but the steering is what impresses me most. And I wouldn't call my R3 "softly-sprung", though I'm sure it rides better than an Elise or S2000. (I've never driven a "regular" RX-8.)
I don't really have a point. Just rambling.
Fully prepped, yes. Not stock though.
I see that in 2008 (link), A Stock was dominated by the S2000 and Super Stock by Elises and Z06's. Hypothetically, how do think a prepped turbo or three rotor RX-8 would fare in AS or SS? I'd think it would do well in SS.
edit #1:
It's not an argument. It's a discussion. 
edit #2:
I think we can all agree on that.
That's debatable...though I can't deny or confirm it. I simply haven't driven any other real performance cars other than my 7, which is definitely not as good as the 8.
I can't make any claims about the RX-8 being the best since I have nothing to compare it to other than my '91 rx7 and my parents' '93 camry and '96 caravan. (Probably also why I think the RX-8 is pretty darn fast.
) I've only had the 8 a few weeks and haven't been able to push it's handling limits, but the steering is what impresses me most. And I wouldn't call my R3 "softly-sprung", though I'm sure it rides better than an Elise or S2000. (I've never driven a "regular" RX-8.)I don't really have a point. Just rambling.
A C4 Corvette, fully set up for A Stock (now B Stock) autocross will outhandle an RX-8, in terms of grip, cornering, and speed through turns.
I see that in 2008 (link), A Stock was dominated by the S2000 and Super Stock by Elises and Z06's. Hypothetically, how do think a prepped turbo or three rotor RX-8 would fare in AS or SS? I'd think it would do well in SS.
edit #1:
Originally Posted by CaptainEggs
edit: i stopped reading after page 1 so... this argument about s2k and rx8?? o.O lol
edit #2:
Originally Posted by Haze
Nothing handles like it.
Originally Posted by Haze
nothing handles better than an RX8
Last edited by ultrataco; 01-07-2010 at 08:43 PM.
01-07-2010, 08:32 PM
#75
Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Denver
Posts: 167
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
i have to agree with 124spider... the 8 is NOT the best handling car. its fun to drive but sometimes we make the 8 sound like its a BEAST! but reality is... its not =/