VikingDJ

I got my quote from subaru. They offered me $27225 (full KBB trade in). The fact that my appearance package and rotary accent package, along with various dealer installs plays no role in my trade in value concerns me. The straight up offer was for a leftover 04 sti, so it's probably a demo model or something. The sale price for the 04 model is $29500. The total price would be $2225 plus rx8, plus tax and tags. Something seems fishy. I don't want an 04, so I am not biting. My next ploy will be to get them to acknowledge what's not given on KBB. They are eager to get rid of the 04, and are avoiding my initial request, and tyring to dump this one on me. As much as I want to make this trade, I may just forget the entire thing. My last attempt is to offer my rx8, and $4k. Tell them not to even bother unless that can be met. In return I get a new 05 sti with all the goodies. It's take it or leave it, because ending up with the rx8 isn't a bad deal.

dean2900

That interesting, mine was 6 more per month from 12 to 15 and I enquired about 15 to 18 but they said they would not allocate more than 15k a year. I guess each dealer is different.

RodsterinFL

Zeltar is right!

I traded a 2001 Mazda Millennia S for the RX. It had low miles and was spotless with no dings, etc. and tires that were all replaced at about 11,000 miles. I got $15, 320 in trade for a car whose sticker was over $31K; however, there was a $3000 rebate AND I bought it under the S plan. I paid $26,300 for it but still...

When you drive a car off the lot you immediately lose $5000-$7000 or so in most cases. The "black book" that many dealers use in my area is actually unfair to the consumer because the very same comapny produces two versions of the book Retail Pricing version and Auction Pricing version. Guess which one they use on the lots! By the way, we went to look at F150 trucks two weeks ago and ended up over by the Mustangs. THey are practically giving them away right now. I saw a 2004 NEW white GT convertible with custom wheels (showcase model of some sort) for an reduced price of $22,900. The BASE MSRP on one is $28,640 without any options or packages. I have to say though that out of the new cars I have driven since buying the RX8, the ONLY one that really excited me was the Mazdaspeed Miata. What a drivers car it is. Mazda somehow seems to get that bulky feel out of the cars even though they are not the fastest cars out there.

heh8me

Dean, it's not the dealer. It's the financial institution (Mazda, the bank) that holds the lease. With my auto dealer, I chose the bank that had the best offer. The incentives were the same, but the money factor was much better than what Mazda was offering. You can go to Edmunds for lease quotes too -- including extended mileage.

Viking. Appearance and roto accent packages have virtually no impact on a trade-in because they won't cause a buyer to pay significantly more for the car. It may be worth it to you, the original buyer who wants to taylor the car to his needs, but the average buyer has little interest. Personally, I think the lines of the car are great as-is, and the spoiler and appearance packages make it looked pimped out. As for the roto accents, I laughed when the dealer showed me what that was.

Doug

Well I will tell you, I am 37 years old and in this time I purchased my 8 and this was the 10th new car I purchased. As a matter of fact, I just bought another so I do not have to drive the 8 as much. I do a lot of driving and I purchased a Honda Civic Hybrid.

Any how, I have found that no matter what car you by, if it is a Hyundai or a Mercedes, the car will drop at least 30% as soon as you drive it off the lot. There are really no exceptions, regardless of the milage.

It is better for you to keep the car at least a couple of years, if you do not drive it much then the milage will make it look better, but not a big difference in the resale (if any) I reccomend that if you are making monthly payments on the car then to get rid of it and take the loss. Probably about $9000.00 or so. If you paid cash for the car and really no loan to speak of, then no harm in keeping it and putting it up for sale and do not sell till you get what you want. Remember there really is a sucker born every minute.

I hope this helps.
Doug

VikingDJ

I decided to treat myself to the sti and keep rx8. The sti is expensive, but I'm treating it as if it were a honda civic. Lots of miles, and my daily driver beater car. It's expensive, but so worth it to own both. I'll get plenty of use out of rx8 until winter, but overall I will be driving the sti more, because it gets better gas mileage. I'm gonna find out just how both cars stand up reliability wise, but I am confident the STI is gonna hold up very well, as will the rx8. We shall see who wins the reliability battle. I do have to be careful of one thing. I am getting used to not having to worry about flooding with STI, so I have to start treating it like it can flood, so I don't get careless and back rx8 out of garage, and shut it down right away. I got used to the rough ride and power, so it serves me very well as commuter car, yet it's a boatload of fun at same time. I can see how the STI can be too bumpy for many, but I personally love feeling the road, and I love getting in RX8 and having it feel like a luxury car after a week with STI. Both are a true treat to drive, yet so different you can really appreciate both for what they offer.

Butt Dyno

It doesn't sound like you have learned much from your current situation.

So now you have $65K of car... I hope you are not renting

john

dag

- I hope I don't have to sell my car. It is depressing to know I paid invoice and will loose 8 grand (if I go by trade-in value + include taxes).

I went into this intending fully to own this car for 8 years +. I never dreamed of potentially having to trade this in.

dag

VikingDJ

I learned a lot. Trading in rx8 for any car let alone an STI would have been a huge financial mistake. Buying STI instead of rx8 would have also been a mistake. With a career change, and a sudden yearly mileage of 25-30k per year, the rx8 was just not the car I found suitable to put that many miles on. I could not get myself to be practical and buy a used daily driver to take off miles on rx8. I look at it as spending a lot more money to get what I want. I guess a regular Impreza would have served the purpose of what I needed, but I took the big plunge and got the STI to use instead. Not a common thing to buy a car like STI, and drive it into ground and treat it like it's a corolla, but as crazy as it may be for some people, it's just so worth it when you can just do what you truly want instead of looking at a car as just a choice of transportation. The 6 year 80k bumper to bumper they added at no additional cost was the icing on cake to make me confident to use daily. I own the rx8 outright, so my only financing is on the STI. I never planned on this happening, but after 6 months the rx8 suddenly became a bad choice in purchasing a new car. The STI alone isn't a good choice either, but you combine the two and it's a good deal all around, even if it's not practical. The STI gets better gas mileage then rx8 even though it has a boatload more power, and is just as much fun to drive, even if it doesn't look as good or doesn't have all the features. I realize buying an STI to use as beater daily car is open for a lot of criticism, but it's what I wanted to do, and I truly have no regrets.

Butt Dyno

Eh, that's not what I'm saying at all. Lots of STi's get daily driven. Subaru makes pretty reliable cars, there will be rattles and squeaks but the important stuff doesn't break.

The STi's mileage might be better than the 8 but it's still 93 and it's still not very good.

Just make sure you pick up some real estate if you haven't yet. It's the gift that keeps on giving.

john

VikingDJ

Already own a home and it's half way paid off. As for MPG, I am already noticing a considerable difference. I got 24-25mpg on 80% highway driving with sti on first two tanks. Of course this is during break in period, and I am keeping car below 4krpms between shifts. My friend has an 03 Subaru Baja, and he gets about same mpg. I think the key for the STi is the 6th gear. It's a true OD, and geared very high for pure highway use. AWD will always cut down on mpg a bit, but if you stay off high boost, this car gets close to normal mpg for a Subaru. The EPA states 18-24mpg, and it's already gone above that. The best I have gotten on rx8 is 19mpg, even cruising down highway at 65mpg. Needless to say there is no MPG problem with the STI. If you gun it, you will guzzle it, but if you drive it normal, you will get decent gas mileage. The rx8 is a nicer vehicle, but to me the STI is just much more practicle for year round use.

AF-RX8

Congrats on the new sti, it is an awesome car ... after reading this whole thread what was the outcome on your RX8 ? Did it depreciate as badly as you thought it would ?

I don't think the 8 is going to depreciate any worse then the industry average, in other words I wouldn't expect Honda's excellent resale value but I wouldn't expect Mitsubishi's poor resale value either.

I am one of those that trades my cars in often ... usually every 18 months ... Most cars depreciate like a rock in the first year or two. I traded in an 03 BMW 330i for my rx8 and while BMW's are supposed to have such excellent resale value I took a $12,000 hit and I am not including sales tax in that number ...


The argument some have brought up about the resale value in 06 if Mazda was to come out with a higher horsepower engine I bet will have little to no effect on our 04's ... people were saying the same thing back when the 2000 BMW 328 went to a 330 in 2001 and today if you look at the value's of these cars used, the 328 has held it's own on a relative basis.

AF-RX8

I am trying to understand your outlook and concept of what you think is good and bad ... what I am getting out of this is debt of any sort except for a Mortgage on your personal home is bad ... it sounds like you are missing what I think is very important and that is the cost of money ... how much is that loan going to cost you and I am not talking about cars, credit cards, etc since I have this mental problem of having to pay for my cars in cash and credit bills in full.

One quick example is Commercial Real estate and without getting into the whole concept do you know that some of the richest people whom purchase real estate are getting rich from taking on debt aka re-financing.

A very basic lesson in this is you refi your commerical bldg, put the refi $$ in your pocket, use the rental income to pay off the debt and then start all over again ... if you own Multiple properties you will get rich doing this because as you will do a refi once a year for a building (if not more depending on how many properties you own) and by the following yr or two down the road it will be time to refi one of your other properties, and so on and so on and so on . . . add some other factors into there like depreciation and you'll be even further ahead then you think ... there is more to it then that but this is a slight idea of how it works very simpified ...

So not all debt is bad if you know what I mean ... there are obviously many different ways to make money and I don't think you should close your mind to what might work for others ... just like they shouldn't close there minds to what might work for you.

VikingDJ

The hit I would have taken on rx8 was too great to part with it at the moment. I may decide to sell it down the road, but they were not going to give me anywhere near KBB trade in on buying a car that was cheaper then rx8 brand new. I played it smart and tested the waters. I totally caught them off guard because I got a quote first on the sti, and they gave me a $300 below invoice price. I then added in rx8 trade, and suddenly they said I had to disregard the previous quote, and to come down with rx8 so they could get a better idea of what it was worth. I knew right then and there that it was going to be a low ball approach because I made them aware that the trade in value on the rx8 was $27500, and the price for STI was 29500. They were not going to let me trade in rx8 and hand them 2k cash and walk out with a brand new car. The rx8 won't become worthless, but the initial edmunds depreciation chart created for rx8 was about as bogus as they come. The value is indeed dropping more then anticipated but will not be noticable as long as you didn't see that initial chart. They had the rx8 retaining a lot of it's value after purchase, which ended up not happening. This comes from mass production, and a low demand for car, much like subaru is experiencing with the STI now. The rx8 will hold it's own, but will never be in the class of BMW, Honda, and Toyota, because those are very high demand cars even used. The rx8 is not. I realize now that the KBB pricing is bogus, and some cars will meet the price, and some will not. Tough to say whether a better rx8 will kill the value of the current one, but I'd think Mazda will slowly build the car up, so it shouldn't cause too much damage. If in 05 they built a 300hp rx8, well then, we'd all be in serious trouble.

AF-RX8

Would you disclose what they offered you on a trade in ?

Just curious what the dealers are offering ... also I do know a fellow member of this board that is looking for a used RX8 ... if you want I'll put you in touch with him (if he hasn't contacted you already)

VikingDJ

I never took it that far. The lady told me over the phone that it's very rare for them to give full KBB trade in value. I will guess I'd have gotten around 25k for trade in for a virtually new car with only 3k miles on it, and an msrp of over 36k. Had I went there with my rx8 and never gotten that online quote, they'd have given me full trade in value, but charged me close to msrp for the STI. Do you understand what I am getting at here? The best way to know what you are getting on a trade in for a car is to get a final price on a new car after haggling, then mention the trade in. It pisses them off because it deletes their initial negiotation. They can sell you car below invoice, but they cannot give full trade in value if the car is not a high demand used car they can sell for 3-4k more then they gave you. After speaking to the salesman after buying car, she said it was a smart move to not trade in rx8, because I'd have been lucky to get 25k for it, which is 2500 below KBB. Of course every dealer in every part of US is different, so this is just one experience. Nothing is what it seems though, and dealers know exactly how to play the game, and make you think you are getting a deal when you aren't. if you get full trade in value, it usualyl means you are simply paying more for the new car you are buying.